worst red light debate, again!

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Hagen Gary

Ohhh, let me hurry up and get my post in.

I'm on both sides of this. Slow car in SS (for div 4 anyway), Fast car in Stock and I like the rule the way it is. As someone already pointed out, I like to have a clean tree. There is an advantage to that. Especially if you’re a blinder racer. If you take away my green light coming on, you also take away my ability to more accurately estimate my RT by when the green comes on. Is that good enough Mr. Bill?

No, Hagen, this s not about "fast cars" or "slow cars," because it will effect every car in the Eliminator except the one, fastest car. Like an AA/S car, for instance. That car (unless it's a slug) will NEVER leave first.

Additionally, it is a losing battle to try to assess "advantages" like a "clean tree" that will come into play because there is a never-ending list of advantages/disadvantages to running ANY car (slow cars are affected by the weather and wind, more than faster cars; faster cars have traction problems that slower cars don't have) etc., etc., etc....

You just can't legislate advantages/disadvantages, so we need to go with the program that gives an advantage to NOBODY... the worse red light system.

[Bob Mulry]

[ faster cars have traction problems that slower cars don't have) etc., etc., etc...]

I guess that you didn't see my earlier post about ALWAYS dialing slower than your opponent so that you won't spin your tires.....

Bob

[Hagen Gary]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

Additionally, it is a losing battle to try to assess "advantages" like a "clean tree" that will come into play because there is a never-ending list of advantages/disadvantages to running ANY car (slow cars are affected by the weather and wind, more than faster cars; faster cars have traction problems that slower cars don't have) etc., etc., etc....

You just can't legislate advantages/disadvantages, so we need to go with the program that gives an advantage to NOBODY... the worse red light system.

Lets throw out all advantages/disadvantages that don't apply to the tree. Now we have a slow car that has a pretty good idea of when the tree will come down, and a fast car who has to guesstimate when its going to start coming down. If your a blinder racer, its a hell of alot more consistant when your leaving first and have a pretty good idea of when that bulb will light. Go under the blinder when your spotting someone1 sec here, 2.5 there and keeping focus is a little bit harder. In my opinion, major advantage for the slower car. Balance that out with the first to red light rule and its even in my opinion. Not yours, but obviously your in the minority.

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Mike Carr

Bill, to answer your often-asked question, NO, there is NO good reason why we have the current system. Anyone with an IQ over twenty can see that the rule is unfair. Happy?

The thing that bothers the majority of us, is the fact that you and a few others bring this old subject up time and time again. We're just sick of reading it. Myself (and others) have politely asked you, and people of your ilk, to please stop posting this stuff every few months, get off your ***, and actually go out and DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

And, while you're at it, get NHRA to fix the other issues that are wrong with our sport, issues much more important than a first or worst redlight rule that might come into play 5% of the time, or less. Fix the payouts, fix the rising costs/fees, fix the run schedule, fix the AHFS, fix the track conditions, fix Class Eliminations, and all the other nonsense NHRA has shoved upon us over the past 5-10 years.

Mike, thank you for your moment of clarity, and for agreeing that this rule is unfair.

Not many of the detractors on this board are willing to admit that.

I hammer on this point because it is so STUPID for NHRA to allow something that affects us all, to go on, month-after- month, year-after-year, when the fix for it is so easily implemented and cheap. I see it as an insult to everybody racing, to have to put up with it.

None of the problems you brought up have a lifespan of 48 years... nor do any of them have the option oif such an easy fix.

Let's fix what we CAN, and worry about the hard ones, later.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

None of the problems you brought up have a lifespan of 48 years... nor do any of them have the option oif such an easy fix.

Let's fix what we CAN, and worry about the hard ones, later.

By all means, yes, let's rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic after it hits the iceberg, and the bow is slipping beneath the waves.

Because it is so easy to rearrange the deck chairs, and it'll matter so damned much as the hull slams into the bottom of the ocean.

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Bimbo Jones

Right back atcha Bill. Ya just lost one of the two people that was on your side on this one. Don't get wet!

If that's all it takes to lose you, you weren't very convinced in the first place.

Is BIMBO your real name?

[Bimbo Jones]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

If that's all it takes to lose you, you weren't very convinced in the first place.

Is BIMBO your real name?

I just don't have a dog in this hunt at the present. But if I did I thought Steve Taylor was correct and the WRLR should diffenently be used in S/P Electronics. And if it is well received there then we wouldn't be having this debate.
BTW, Bimbo is a nickname I got growing up in Ark.

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Bimbo Jones

I just don't have a dog in this hunt at the present. But if I did I thought Steve Taylor was correct and the WRLR should diffenently be used in S/P Electronics. And if it is well received there then we wouldn't be having this debate.
BTW, Bimbo is a nickname I got growing up in Ark.

Thanks for the reply. Steve was the one who convinced me that this worse red light rule was the only really fair way to run things with regard to how red lights are handled, rules-wise, but if it's valid for one handicapped eliminator (S/P), it should work for all of them.

It's a moot point though, because, as most of us agree, it's never gonna happen.

And, that's a shame...

[X-TECH MAN]

All this arguing is a waste of time. The REAL problem is how are you going to afford the gas or diesel to get to a race in the future. Its already $4.15 for diesel and $3.92 for gas here in the center of Florida. Its supposed to be $6 a gallon for gas and diesel will be even higher by mid summer. Diesel is the same crap you guys in the north heat your homes with minus the road use taxes. It wont be long until no one will be going to the races and the tracks will go out of business. The only ones showing up to a race will be those who have more money than brains. Do you think the tracks (bracket races, NHRA or IHRA events ) will keep paying the purses when only 5 to 10 cars show up. The cost of eating is rising. Now I know some on here have all the money in the world to pay for your toys but not all of us are in that position. Give this red light deal a rest until some of the other problems with this country are fixed.

[Don Kennedy]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

All this arguing is a waste of time. The REAL problem is how are you going to afford the gas or diesel to get to a race in the future. Its already $4.15 for diesel and $3.92 for gas here in the center of Florida. Its supposed to be $6 a gallon for gas and diesel will be even higher by mid summer. Diesel is the same crap you guys in the north heat your homes with minus the road use taxes. It wont be long until no one will be going to the races and the tracks will go out of business. The only ones showing up to a race will be those who have more money than brains. Do you think the tracks (bracket races, NHRA or IHRA events ) will keep paying the purses when only 5 to 10 cars show up. The cost of eating is rising. Now I know some on here have all the money in the world to pay for your toys but not all of us are in that position. Give this red light deal a rest until some of the other problems with this country are fixed.

The real problem is what are we doing about the problem ? if all we do is complain amoug our selves then nothing will happen . i say fax your concerns to the congress every day > i know i have > we must make them act or it is our fault nothing is going right