Going "deep" into the program

[Andys dad]

OK I am sure you all know this but call me an idiot - I did not and still do not have this figured out.

I decided to take my stocker to a WCHRA race and run D-Gas with a 10.60 index on a .4 pro tree. No problem (I figure) running 10.60. I just ran 10.56 and 10.58 the week before at the same track. (Bakersfield temperature about 95 and adjusted altitude about 3500 feet)

Deep staging was allowed so I figured I could compensate for my giant front tire. You had to turn on the bottom bulb and turn out the top bulb in one continuous motion. That was not as easy as I expected and turned out to be imprecise.

Well a not so funny thing happened on the way to the finish line.

Couple of miss-conceptions I had. One - assuming these guys were not as "into" there style as we are. I ran 10.614 and thought great. Oh but wait - out of 16 guys 6 ran 10.60 with a digit. Number one was 10.600. ggeezzee. Mistake number two - they could cut .020 lights and some were deep and some were not.

I thought deep staging would only hurt .04 or .05 and I would be able to cut a descent light. Not true. The only .020 light I had the car slowed down unbelievable - like more than a tenth - and 60ft was out the window.

So long story long - they spanked on the butt and sent me home. I ended up being able to cut a good light and not run the number or cut a terrible light (.520) and run the number. I ran 10.65 with a .099 light against a 10.70 (letting off) with a .020. Guess I decided to not do either.

Lesson learned.

Anyone else every try this?

I still find it hard to believe how much going deep affected reaction time, 60ft and ET.

[Michael Beard]

You can do the stage-in-one-motion Deep stage technique quickly and with precision. Just takes a little practice. Deep-staging in my FWD car is worth about .08 on the tree, and kills the 60' alone about .11. I think it was more like .15 in the 1/4. I believe the reduced rollout hurts a slow car more than a fast one, as you have less of a rolling start. (and the Turismo's working with a 20" tire on the front to begin with!)

I ran a 7.00 index (1/8th mile) class a couple times the other year with the Volare. .400 Pro Tree, deep staging permitted. Even deep and leaving at 3800, I was mostly stuck in the .040's, but managed to win one of the races by going deep and taking an extra hunk. I think it was about .08 slower ET in the 1/8th. I'd have to look at the logbook.

The Turismo is FAR more competitive when Deep Staged. Too bad "majority rule" got their way a number of years ago... Still driveable, just not as easy.

[7423]

Come on Ron, you are not too old to remember the days of Super X at AV Raceway, (guess that was a while ago). 12.90, 4 tenths pro light, everyone went deep. My Fairlane would go 12.70-.75 shallow on a full tree and 12.90-.95 deep. Your car has a ton front end travel, not a good thing for RT on a pro light. As stated, the slower you go, the more you lose. Your 10 second Camaro should be around .10 slower.

[Andys dad]

Thanks for the info Mike

And thanks Charlie for bring up how long ago that was - LOL :-)

And no I don't remember - hell I have trouble with remebering yesteday sometimes - LOL :-)

I guess either - not too many have tried this or it is considered secret information amongst this forums members

My car was off from .05 to .12 depending on how deep I went

My lights were from .020 to .125

And the 60 fts - forget about it - they were off from .09 to .2

Next time tiny front tires and no deep staging

[Michael Beard]

It's not secret info, just hasn't been relevant to Stock racing for a number of years (unfortunately) due to the sanctioning bodies making it illegal.

Tiny tires are going to 1) change your suspension geometry and 2) not give you nearly as much R/T as you might think. Even going from 28" to 23" might only get you .040 if you're lucky. (and if you don't already have them laying around, then you also have the expense of tires!) My recommendation would be to pre-stage (or *just* shy of it), set your launch rpm, then ease off the brake just slightly to slowly roll from pre-stage all the way to deep. That way you don't even have to look back at the tach. Be deliberate, and you absolutely CAN do this consistently! I think you were just rushing yourself too much, resulting in the erratic staging position and subsequent R/T and ET variances.

When permitted in E.T. bracket racing, I deep stage the Turismo using the above method, and it's been flawless. That's how all of the deep stagers were doing it at the Jim Harrington Footbrake Classic last weekend, too. If you can shallow stage consistently, you can deep stage consistently. Give it, and yourself, a chance! You'll be fine. Let me know how you make out!

[et7333]

Originally Posted by 7423

Come on Ron, you are not too old to remember the days of Super X at AV Raceway, (guess that was a while ago). 12.90, 4 tenths pro light, everyone went deep. My Fairlane would go 12.70-.75 shallow on a full tree and 12.90-.95 deep. Your car has a ton front end travel, not a good thing for RT on a pro light. As stated, the slower you go, the more you lose. Your 10 second Camaro should be around .10 slower.

I remember those Super X days Charlie.

[Notch1320]

Andys Dad...... Give WCHRA Open Comp class a try next season. I will be out there with my stocker as well.