2011 ahfs

[Chad Rhodes]

two things I think would HELP this some. One would be that any instant hit pass be met with a teardown, two would be to compare an "instant hit" pass with an average of everyone with that combo's fastest passes ( we know Nitro Joe has this info) to see if the combo is really deserving of HP.

1) it would keep an illegal car from killing a combo.

2) it would prevent one maniac from killing an otherwise reasonable combo. My point here is that there are several cases where one person has a combo figured out well beyond any of his competitors. He is the anomaly, and should be awarded for the achievement, but the rest of the guys running the same combo shouldn't be penalized i.e. 427/425, Sorensen is killer fast, at least .10 faster than any other 425 I would say. But there are a slew of good, fast 425's that aren't even in the same realm as him. If you hit the whole combo, Sorensen is still .10 quicker than the other 425's, but they all get penalized with him. I am NOT suggesting penalizing on an individual basis, just suggesting that just because one guy has a combo flying doesn't necessarily mean the combo as a whole is soft.

[B Aceves]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

two things I think would HELP this some. One would be that any instant hit pass be met with a teardown, two would be to compare an "instant hit" pass with an average of everyone with that combo's fastest passes ( we know Nitro Joe has this info) to see if the combo is really deserving of HP.

1) it would keep an illegal car from killing a combo.

2) it would prevent one maniac from killing an otherwise reasonable combo. My point here is that there are several cases where one person has a combo figured out well beyond any of his competitors. He is the anomaly, and should be awarded for the achievement, but the rest of the guys running the same combo shouldn't be penalized i.e. 427/425, Sorensen is killer fast, at least .10 faster than any other 425 I would say. But there are a slew of good, fast 425's that aren't even in the same realm as him. If you hit the whole combo, Sorensen is still .10 quicker than the other 425's, but they all get penalized with him. I am NOT suggesting penalizing on an individual basis, just suggesting that just because one guy has a combo flying doesn't necessarily mean the combo as a whole is soft.

Ha you beat me too it !
ITS Embbarrsing that it takes a Performance Bassed Racer to realize the Big picture now doesnt it. Or maybe a bracket racer also hmm idk. Good post
X2 X3 X4 X5 whatever......

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

two things I think would HELP this some. One would be that any instant hit pass be met with a teardown, two would be to compare an "instant hit" pass with an average of everyone with that combo's fastest passes ( we know Nitro Joe has this info) to see if the combo is really deserving of HP.

1) it would keep an illegal car from killing a combo.

2) it would prevent one maniac from killing an otherwise reasonable combo. My point here is that there are several cases where one person has a combo figured out well beyond any of his competitors. He is the anomaly, and should be awarded for the achievement, but the rest of the guys running the same combo shouldn't be penalized i.e. 427/425, Sorensen is killer fast, at least .10 faster than any other 425 I would say. But there are a slew of good, fast 425's that aren't even in the same realm as him. If you hit the whole combo, Sorensen is still .10 quicker than the other 425's, but they all get penalized with him. I am NOT suggesting penalizing on an individual basis, just suggesting that just because one guy has a combo flying doesn't necessarily mean the combo as a whole is soft.

This is a performance based eliminator To many on here want to forget that.

I agree with number one.
But as far as number two goes if someone "legally" finds a way to go faster than the competition. There should be no reason to let the slower guys have a free ride.

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by art leong

This is a performance based eliminator To many on here want to forget that.

I agree with number one.
But as far as number two goes if someone "legally" finds a way to go faster than the competition. There should be no reason to let the slower guys have a free ride.

my point is this, if one guy with a combo has everyone else covered, then HE is the standout, not the combo. If one combo has everyone else covered, then the COMBO is the standout. If you punish the whole group on one's actions then you are promoting mediocrity. I don't see it as the slower guys having a free ride as much as I see it as one guy either spends more, knows, more, or works more. That person earned an advantage ( with the spending more being questionable). Let's use a hypothetical situation here, you have combo A that has 20 guys actively running one. 3 of them are .25 under, 1 is 1.10 under, and the rest are a tight average around .8 under. Obviously the 3 slow cars need to fix their problems and get to work ( I occasionally fall in that category), the one guy flying needs to go through a good "TSA style" tech inspection, but do you really think the other 16 guys as a whole are getting a free ride?

I don't think this is unfair to the class. Sure you have a standout, but that standout gives everyone else a target to aim at and it doesn't discourage people from having a fast race car. If you said that the instant hit only applies if the combo has an average of -.xx that's all it would take to keep from killing a combination.

Remember that the AHFS is intended to keep the playing field level between combinations, not individuals.

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

my point is this, if one guy with a combo has everyone else covered, then HE is the standout, not the combo. If one combo has everyone else covered, then the COMBO is the standout. If you punish the whole group on one's actions then you are promoting mediocrity. I don't see it as the slower guys having a free ride as much as I see it as one guy either spends more, knows, more, or works more. That person earned an advantage ( with the spending more being questionable). Let's use a hypothetical situation here, you have combo A that has 20 guys actively running one. 3 of them are .25 under, 1 is 1.10 under, and the rest are a tight average around .8 under. Obviously the 3 slow cars need to fix their problems and get to work ( I occasionally fall in that category), the one guy flying needs to go through a good "TSA style" tech inspection, but do you really think the other 16 guys as a whole are getting a free ride?

I don't think this is unfair to the class. Sure you have a standout, but that standout gives everyone else a target to aim at and it doesn't discourage people from having a fast race car. If you said that the instant hit only applies if the combo has an average of -.xx that's all it would take to keep from killing a combination.

Remember that the AHFS is intended to keep the playing field level between combinations, not individuals.

Chad what would you do in my case? Where there are only 2 other cars in the world?
One problem is a lot of racers have "I have to run the same combo that everyone else does"
I agree with the complete full teardown before a instant hit.
The last time I ran fast enough to get an instant hit I was told I might as well take the record because I was getting checked anyway.

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by art leong

Chad what would you do in my case? Where there are only 2 other cars in the world?
One problem is a lot of racers have "I have to run the same combo that everyone else does"
I agree with the complete full teardown before a instant hit.

I understand your position, there is not another 69 427/435 running that I know of. I doubt we will ever be fast enough to trigger an instant hit in AA/SA with it, but if we did we affect no one but ourselves. In your case you would piss two others off. How close are you guys et wise if you don't mind me asking?

[art leong]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

I understand your position, there is not another 69 427/435 running that I know of. I doubt we will ever be fast enough to trigger an instant hit in AA/SA with it, but if we did we affect no one but ourselves. In your case you would piss two others off. How close are you guys et wise if you don't mind me asking?

One car is being built and the other is as fast or faster than me.
If the crybabies hadn't gotten Indy changed I could not have cared less about the index.
But now if I go out and get the index whacked by half a second at a mineshaft track. What happens at Indy with a density altitude of 3500 feet. Remember I run a 151 cubic inch motor that weighs 2600 pounds

[Chad Rhodes]

Originally Posted by art leong

One car is being built and the other is as fast or faster than me.
If the crybabies hadn't gotten Indy changed I could not have cared less about the index.
But now if I go out and get the index whacked by half a second at a mineshaft track. What happens at Indy with a density altitude of 3500 feet. Remember I run a 151 cubic inch motor that weighs 2600 pounds

your case is different because it affects your index, thus your ability to qualify for Indy. I do thin you getting whacked .50 in index is nuts, because its not affecting parity in your class at all, if anything it may discourage some guy from building a car for your class. All it will do is change your position on the ladder.

[Craig Couris]

Let's address the A/SA & AA/SA indexes for a moment. The A index is 11.00 and the AA index is 10.60. Wouldn't it be much more fair to the older cars if the AA index was softened up to let's say 10.75? With the proposed AHFS, the blown cars basically get a free pass because there is no reason ever to go faster than a 9.61 but there isn't a carburetor car that can run that fast. We all know the blown cars can go much faster when and if needed.

Now, I put the weight in my car to run A/SA because there is no way I can run with a blown car. I can now go 9.90's so I now I must slow the car down just to make sure I do not hurt my combination. How can anyone say my car now needs hit with HP?

The AA index needs to be changed now.

[Sean Cour]

Originally Posted by Craig Couris

Let's address the A/SA & AA/SA indexes for a moment. The A index is 11.00 and the AA index is 10.60. Wouldn't it be much more fair to the older cars if the AA index was softened up to let's say 10.75? With the proposed AHFS, the blown cars basically get a free pass because there is no reason ever to go faster than a 9.61 but there isn't a carburetor car that can run that fast. We all know the blown cars can go much faster when and if needed.

Now, I put the weight in my car to run A/SA because there is no way I can run with a blown car. I can now go 9.90's so I now I must slow the car down just to make sure I do not hurt my combination. How can anyone say my car now needs hit with HP?

The AA index needs to be changed now.

Craig, a carb car has run that fast. But I agree on the index. A .75 would make a lot more sense. It's like a 200 lb. difference between A and AA for most of the higher rated cars. The difference is more like two-two and half tenths, not four.