Unbelievable!!!

Brett Brown · 11-09-2008, 01:25 AM

I continue to be amazed by the way the NHRA treats the Sportsman racer. What is more discouraging is that it's being done to us at the Divisional level.
In August the division 7 office posted the schedule and run order for this weekends points race at Las Vegas. Our Divison Director decided to schedule STK, S/S, S/G & S/C for only 2 qualifying runs. He informed me that he felt that this was being completely FAIR seeing that there would be 800 cars at this race. At that time I decided that it was in my best interest to just stay home.
Well, as I look at the qualifying results, I see that there are 800+ cars at the race. And to continue his move of FAIRNESS, our Director decided that it would be a great idea to add another category to attend this race. Welcome Top Fuel Motorcycle!
In addition to having this category (which has nothing to do with running in division 7 or a divisional championship) come and join the rest of the Sportsman racers, he decided to go ahead let them get 3 qualifying runs! UNBELIEVABLE!!!
If this is the act of FAIRNESS to those categories that support the division 7 races, I can't even begin to think what would happen if our Division Director decided to not be FAIR!
If having this race with 800 cars attending makes it a problem in getting EVERYONE 3 qualifying runs, then 2 things need to happen;
1) Quit having this race between the L.V. National & the AAA Finals. It makes this a divisional race for all comers instead of a division 7 points race.
2) For gods sake, quite adding categories and special races within a race!!!

J Adams · 11-09-2008, 03:42 AM

What is wrong with two hits? I am all for 2 on Friday, and 1st round Saturday morning with as many rounds as possible on Saturday. Makes Sunday not such a rush, and leaves a window for the unexpected downtimes. I bet it took the majority of the weekend to give 8 WHOLE bikes one extra run. And after complaints all year about how low car counts are getting, it is nice to see a huge event. I for one am bummed that I had to skip it this year.

BobOrme · 11-09-2008, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brett Brown

I continue to be amazed by the way the NHRA treats the Sportsman racer. What is more discouraging is that it's being done to us at the Divisional level.
In August the division 7 office posted the schedule and run order for this weekends points race at Las Vegas. Our Divison Director decided to schedule STK, S/S, S/G & S/C for only 2 qualifying runs. He informed me that he felt that this was being completely FAIR seeing that there would be 800 cars at this race. At that time I decided that it was in my best interest to just stay home.
Well, as I look at the qualifying results, I see that there are 800+ cars at the race. And to continue his move of FAIRNESS, our Director decided that it would be a great idea to add another category to attend this race. Welcome Top Fuel Motorcycle!
In addition to having this category (which has nothing to do with running in division 7 or a divisional championship) come and join the rest of the Sportsman racers, he decided to go ahead let them get 3 qualifying runs! UNBELIEVABLE!!!
If this is the act of FAIRNESS to those categories that support the division 7 races, I can't even begin to think what would happen if our Division Director decided to not be FAIR!
If having this race with 800 cars attending makes it a problem in getting EVERYONE 3 qualifying runs, then 2 things need to happen;
1) Quit having this race between the L.V. National & the AAA Finals. It makes this a divisional race for all comers instead of a division 7 points race.
2) For gods sake, quite adding categories and special races within a race!!!

A dozen fuel bikes. 12. 175-180 S/C cars. Run 10 qualifying rounds for the fuel bikes in the same time frame (or less) than one round of S/C. It's kind of a no-brainer. The fuel bikes are not only filler, they put extra butts in the grandstands and can fit the entire class between the ready line and water box.

An honest question. How many hits do you need before eliminations? I worked an NHRA divisional event where SST, SG, SC, STK. and SSK got 7 Q/TT rounds. The tower was talking about going for 8. I also work IHRA Pro-Am events. 2 Q/TT then start eliminations on Saturday. Sunday (a new and separate points race) it is 1 Q/TT, then eliminations.

Another honest question. Should all divisional events be contested well before the end of the national event schedule? At the end of the racing season, there will be racers in every class that are in contention for a national championship. Given you can and do have to claim both in and out of division races to achieve that end goal, wouldn't it make sense to do it just like it's being done with the Vegas national - Vegas divisional - Pomona finals national? Park the rig and car(s) at the track between the first two events and fly home to take care of business between them if need be.

RPinoski1 · 11-09-2008, 11:15 AM

Jesse
Two hits for class cars flat out sucks......wether you would like to believe it or not these cars aren't your local bracket cars. Trying to test or use a bracket race as a test is worthless up here in Nor Cal due to lack of track prep.

Having the ability to set records and qualifying on a ladder should mandate a min of 3 qualifyers.

Trying to pack 10lbs of entertainment in to a 5lb box is a disaster from the beginning.

Lynn A McCarty · 11-09-2008, 11:36 AM

I say we have one hit, and run class or against the indexes, then run the bracket race on Sunday as currently done. Make it fun! 2 or 3 or 4 practice runs over the course of Thursday, Friday and Saturday is boring. Watch the fans show up like they do at the NMCA races.

J Adams · 11-09-2008, 03:18 PM

Well Rich, then the event should still be a 4 day event. Or if guys need more than 2 runs, get there on Thursday and run test and tune for 2. You know I have always treated stock like a bracket race, I am not one to get caught up spending thousands to go a little quicker, but my limited combo might be the reason for that. It is not like individual racers are affected by 2 runs, its the same for everyone. If you know that local bracket races can't handle being "on kill", they do offer simple seat time. Where this arguement usually gets screwed up is when STK/SS racers think they are entitled to get 4 runs when S/ST, S/G, S/C should only get 2. If everyone could get 3 then that would be great, but with 2 per category and first round on Saturday, with as many possible to follow, why does that scare people away? If you can't handle setting a record, tearing down, re-assembly, and making it back for first round, then set a record at a race with 200 car count. You don't typically get a run after tear down anyway. And even though record setting is great for guy to showcase their accomplishments and abilities to make thier cars fast ( which I do respect), it doesn't help you win races. And I have won a couple, and been close many times, if that is what it takes to include my opinion.

RPinoski1 · 11-09-2008, 03:58 PM

Jesse
Disregard the no names......I have had runner-up...as if it matters
That race should be 4 days anyway.....most are there from the National anyways waiting till Friday to run.....
As far as testing before a Div that is a joke too.........you know that.....

The whole essence of S/SS is to qualify and move on the ladder to give yourself a better chance to win....two qualifiers just don't get it done.

See ya New Years Day!

Brett Brown · 11-09-2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clutch man

I say win a race then make a compliant!

Clutch Man: I have won a race, so I will complain! Not that it has anything to do with this.

Jesse & Bob: The fact is, we keep getting less & less and continue to get charged more & more. If you want to give only 2 qualifying runs, then charge less.
This is a division 7 race, not an opportunity for all other divisions to get an out of division race in. To me it would suck if I was racing for a division 7 championship and end up not getting the chance to do it against other division 7 racers.
And as far as the Top Fuel Motorcycles are concerned, it has nothing to do with how many there are. If the Director is going to give less to certain categories knowing the car count will be high, then don't compound it by bringing in additional cars (bikes) that are not apart of the divisional program.
If a category qualifies on a timed ladder, then you should get 3 qualifying runs.

Chad Rhodes · 11-09-2008, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPinoski1

Jesse
Disregard the no names......I have had runner-up...as if it matters
That race should be 4 days anyway.....most are there from the National anyways waiting till Friday to run.....
As far as testing before a Div that is a joke too.........you know that.....

The whole essence of S/SS is to qualify and move on the ladder to give yourself a better chance to win....two qualifiers just don't get it done.

See ya New Years Day!

when did THAT become the essence of class racing? I always thought it was building the fastest legal hotrod you could, then out driving/running your competition on race day. Moving around to duck a heads up is the exact opposite of the ESSENCE of class racing

Sean Kennedy · 11-09-2008, 06:49 PM

wow. i'm usually first to complain but yeah this isn't anything to wine about.

2 runs one day racing the next is how big races like that work. 2 runs should be enough if you are showing up ready to race anyway.

as far as the top fuel bikes.... If they let in 12 vehicles that happen to draw more heads than the entire stock/super stock group it only makes financial sense. And in times like this, if you want a place to race at all, you shouldn't be complaining about promotors trying to draw people into the stands.

it looks like everyone from top alcohol to super street got two runs, i'd called that about as fair as it gets.

and on the note of people in the stands, that benefits you too.

oh wow... and the comment about out of division racers in your division.... these guys are racing for national and divisional championships, they spend more time and money than you and i both, and they deserve every shot at it for all the hard work they put in. in fact, they deserve it more.

Take a deep breath and step back and look at the big picture.

11-09-2008, 01:25 AM	#1
Brett Brown Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Anaheim, CA Posts: 235 Likes: 4 Liked 5 Times in 2 Posts	Unbelievable!!! I continue to be amazed by the way the NHRA treats the Sportsman racer. What is more discouraging is that it's being done to us at the Divisional level. In August the division 7 office posted the schedule and run order for this weekends points race at Las Vegas. Our Divison Director decided to schedule STK, S/S, S/G & S/C for only 2 qualifying runs. He informed me that he felt that this was being completely FAIR seeing that there would be 800 cars at this race. At that time I decided that it was in my best interest to just stay home. Well, as I look at the qualifying results, I see that there are 800+ cars at the race. And to continue his move of FAIRNESS, our Director decided that it would be a great idea to add another category to attend this race. Welcome Top Fuel Motorcycle! In addition to having this category (which has nothing to do with running in division 7 or a divisional championship) come and join the rest of the Sportsman racers, he decided to go ahead let them get 3 qualifying runs! UNBELIEVABLE!!! If this is the act of FAIRNESS to those categories that support the division 7 races, I can't even begin to think what would happen if our Division Director decided to not be FAIR! If having this race with 800 cars attending makes it a problem in getting EVERYONE 3 qualifying runs, then 2 things need to happen; 1) Quit having this race between the L.V. National & the AAA Finals. It makes this a divisional race for all comers instead of a division 7 points race. 2) For gods sake, quite adding categories and special races within a race!!! __________________ Brett Brown 7257 STK, SS, COMP

11-09-2008, 03:42 AM	#2
J Adams Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Nor Cal Posts: 14 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Unbelievable!!! What is wrong with two hits? I am all for 2 on Friday, and 1st round Saturday morning with as many rounds as possible on Saturday. Makes Sunday not such a rush, and leaves a window for the unexpected downtimes. I bet it took the majority of the weekend to give 8 WHOLE bikes one extra run. And after complaints all year about how low car counts are getting, it is nice to see a huge event. I for one am bummed that I had to skip it this year.

11-09-2008, 11:15 AM	#4
RPinoski1 Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: PLACERVILLE, CA Posts: 182 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Unbelievable!!! Jesse Two hits for class cars flat out sucks......wether you would like to believe it or not these cars aren't your local bracket cars. Trying to test or use a bracket race as a test is worthless up here in Nor Cal due to lack of track prep. Having the ability to set records and qualifying on a ladder should mandate a min of 3 qualifyers. Trying to pack 10lbs of entertainment in to a 5lb box is a disaster from the beginning.

11-09-2008, 11:36 AM	#5
Lynn A McCarty Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Plainfield (INDY) Indiana Posts: 468 Likes: 1 Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Unbelievable!!! I say we have one hit, and run class or against the indexes, then run the bracket race on Sunday as currently done. Make it fun! 2 or 3 or 4 practice runs over the course of Thursday, Friday and Saturday is boring. Watch the fans show up like they do at the NMCA races. __________________ Lynn A McCarty 3470 SS

11-09-2008, 03:18 PM	#6
J Adams Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Nor Cal Posts: 14 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Unbelievable!!! Well Rich, then the event should still be a 4 day event. Or if guys need more than 2 runs, get there on Thursday and run test and tune for 2. You know I have always treated stock like a bracket race, I am not one to get caught up spending thousands to go a little quicker, but my limited combo might be the reason for that. It is not like individual racers are affected by 2 runs, its the same for everyone. If you know that local bracket races can't handle being "on kill", they do offer simple seat time. Where this arguement usually gets screwed up is when STK/SS racers think they are entitled to get 4 runs when S/ST, S/G, S/C should only get 2. If everyone could get 3 then that would be great, but with 2 per category and first round on Saturday, with as many possible to follow, why does that scare people away? If you can't handle setting a record, tearing down, re-assembly, and making it back for first round, then set a record at a race with 200 car count. You don't typically get a run after tear down anyway. And even though record setting is great for guy to showcase their accomplishments and abilities to make thier cars fast ( which I do respect), it doesn't help you win races. And I have won a couple, and been close many times, if that is what it takes to include my opinion.

11-09-2008, 03:58 PM	#7
RPinoski1 Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: PLACERVILLE, CA Posts: 182 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Unbelievable!!! Jesse Disregard the no names......I have had runner-up...as if it matters That race should be 4 days anyway.....most are there from the National anyways waiting till Friday to run..... As far as testing before a Div that is a joke too.........you know that..... The whole essence of S/SS is to qualify and move on the ladder to give yourself a better chance to win....two qualifiers just don't get it done. See ya New Years Day! Last edited by RPinoski1; 11-09-2008 at 05:32 PM.

11-09-2008, 06:49 PM	#10
Sean Kennedy Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 182 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Unbelievable!!! wow. i'm usually first to complain but yeah this isn't anything to wine about. 2 runs one day racing the next is how big races like that work. 2 runs should be enough if you are showing up ready to race anyway. as far as the top fuel bikes.... If they let in 12 vehicles that happen to draw more heads than the entire stock/super stock group it only makes financial sense. And in times like this, if you want a place to race at all, you shouldn't be complaining about promotors trying to draw people into the stands. it looks like everyone from top alcohol to super street got two runs, i'd called that about as fair as it gets. and on the note of people in the stands, that benefits you too. oh wow... and the comment about out of division racers in your division.... these guys are racing for national and divisional championships, they spend more time and money than you and i both, and they deserve every shot at it for all the hard work they put in. in fact, they deserve it more. Take a deep breath and step back and look at the big picture.