New Classes in Stock AAA/SA, AAA/S and FS/AAA

[rseibenick]

The FWD cars went from 8 diff weight breaks , stick and auto for 16 diff. classes in 2003 to 6 combined classes now in 2023. We have already helped to reduce the # of classes in stock. .

[SDmopar]

They should just avg the stick and auto HP numbers and run them together.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

I wouldn't say "obsessed" with it. There just aren't enough Stick cars running anymore and with the HP factors being done the way they are it just seems like common sense to me. More so than going to one pound weight breaks after thinking about Yac's post.

"Honestly" if you feel that the "pure factory race cars should be in their own completely separate classes" then IMHO they should be in SS where they belong along with all of the other "pure factory race cars". You know, like the Race Hemis, the Thunderbolts and the 427 Camaros. But I'm guessing that somebody will just come on here and tell me that , "we can't go back, mistakes were made, live with it".

The Cuda's and Darts are in Super Stock.



The difference between some of the cars of old and the new factory race cars has been rehashed here a thousand times.Most of the older factory hot rods were not 4-5 times as expensive as the pedestrian street cars, even the ZL-1 was only about 3 times higher. A new factory race car is over $100,000. Most of the older cars came with full legal equipment, and a VIN. The new factory race cars come with none of that.


In all honesty, many of the factory race cars are truly "paper cars", some of the engines were never even built or available at all. Many of the ones that were, were never sold in sufficient quantity to meet the old rules. The old stuff is held to a higher standard. The best example is the 67 L-88. We know 36 were built, and sold by dealers, and we know a bunch went out the "back door" in the form of parts, etc. Some new Fords were never even built, not even one, and with Chevrolet selling 69 COPO cars a year, there weren't even 36 of many combinations built, there weren't even 50 built of some over 2-3 years. You can race all of them. But you can't race a 67 L-88 Corvette.

[Billy Nees]

Have you priced a new Camaro or Mustang (or Challenger) lately? More like half-again more expensive if that. Ya know the one thing that has always stuck in my mind about the original COPOs? They had window stickers on them but they were blank. At least the two that went through my local Chevy Dealer were.

As far as VINs go, there's an awful lot of Pontiacs and Oldsmobiles running around without them. I would have to say that the precedence for allowing the new stuff in was probably set when NHRA started allowing the older SS only stuff into Stock. And yes, I've been around long enough to remember when they were built and sold as SS only.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

The Cuda's and Darts are in Super Stock.

Not anymore! The way I'm seeing it, the '68 Darts and Cudas can fit AAA.

[Carguy49]

Since the discussion is on some of the older cars, I have a question. When did the 64 Ford Thunderbolt combination become legal for stock?? They were built as S/S only back in the day. It is what it is, but just curious.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by Carguy49

Since the discussion is on some of the older cars, I have a question. When did the 64 Ford Thunderbolt combination become legal for stock?? They were built as S/S only back in the day. It is what it is, but just curious.

When a Racer with NHRA's ear wanted it!

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

Alan the facts are..there are no appropriate RWD classes for the bulk of of the current crop .Most are centered around DF/S and EF/S ,which are low 17's to low 16 second cars.
The bottom RWD class is W, which is a mid 16 index ,but most can run in the15's.
V/S(A) is for V6's or 4 cylinder combos. The good one run in the 14's
How would you equalize that situation? Lower the FWD hp's ? How would they get enough weight out to speed them up?
Raise the V and W indexes, where there are already second under cars?
All I see is a whole bunch of grief for guys that aren't bothering anyone, and trying to race on a limited budget. I say leave the FWD guys alone .They are the only entry level cars left in NHRA class racing.

Now ,.if you want to combine say, D and E, and F and G... go ahead ,but it will end up as a net loss for NHRA ,when the newer guys have a heads up run , every other round, and then stop going to Divisionals ;-)

Are they truly "entry level"? Ie., are they a gateway for people looking to get into class racing, learn, and move up? Or are they a protected special class, for people to play in the deep end of the pool, with water wings, instead of learning to swim?




Look, I don't mind FWD, it's not my cup of tea, but variety is the spice of life.


The true concept of a dime rocket is really cool. The idea of an underfactored combination, where you can buy the car for a low price, you go buy used wheels and tires, cheap headers, freshen the engine, build a nice budget transmission with a cheap converter, throw in a gear on a spool, and go run 0.80+ under, that's frikkin awesome. If you're not hiding from heads up runs, even better.



But when I read these posts you guys make, the FWD guys don't want heads up races (but Billy wants to make the RWD stick guys race the RWD automatic guys heads up), they want to deep stage, and they want the "first or worst" rule rescinded. They want to buy their car for under $1250 on marketplace. They don't want to buy high end pistons, rings, camshafts, clutches, converters, etc. But they want a "level playing field" that suits them, to race guys who make the investment.




Are we talking about NHRA Stock Eliminator here?


Or are we talking about NHRA Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion Eliminator?


As usual, the conversation is not a conversation, or a discussion. It's a dead end.

[Jared Jordan]

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Not anymore! The way I'm seeing it, the '68 Darts and Cudas can fit AAA.

Not yet. Still in the guide as SS only and without an HP reduction, they won't fit AAA. 5.98 lbs/hp when rated @ 505 hp, the current SS factor.

But here's hoping. *fingers crossed*

[Bobby Fazio]

Weren't these Super Stock Only combos when they came out?

Originally Posted by Jared Jordan

What combos can run AAA?

'65 Race Hemi
'64 T-Bolt
'69 ZL1
...and?

Wonder too if the guys already running in AA can even get 200+ lbs out.

Selfishly, I hope this is the time when NHRA will add the '68 Dart/Cuda to Stock @ the 450 hp rating the '64/'65's got!