Lets Root Cause the Detriment of Class Racing

[SBillinson]

Originally Posted by Mike Pearson

That would pretty much kill the class. The HP adjustments would come way too slow and would never keep up. The faster and under factored combos would rule. I cant imagine you would keep going to races if you have absolutely no chance to win. Not everyone in Stock and Super Stock is a millionaire and can spend big bucks to race.
Participation is still good right now despite the high fuel cost. Look at St Louis last weekend. big car count. Most nationals reach their quotas very quickly and there is always racers on here begging to get an entry to nationals. Most divisionals are pretty well attended if scheduled properly. I am not seeing much wrong with our classes right now. Hurting the guys at the bottom half of the Q sheet is not the way to grow the classes.

Personally I think the modified cars should be running in comp but I would never push for that change.

It's a proposal to make the class more competitive. It's not the only proposal. There are way too many classes and not enough performance-based competition. Performance is confined to class eliminations and the occasional heads-up run.

The current situation is akin to the "everyone gets a trophy" mentality. I need to work hard on my combination and not just throw money at it. There are lots of guys going way fast who don't have all the bells and whistles seen on the cars in the millionaire's club.

I agree that Modified should be taken out of SS. The only reason I included it is they're already part of the class and not enough of them to run on their own. Given the present state of the class, it would be hard to justify taking them out unless NHRA also took out FSS, GT and FWD conversions. That would really kill the class.

[Mike Pearson]

Originally Posted by SBillinson

It's a proposal to make the class more competitive. It's not the only proposal. There are way too many classes and not enough performance-based competition. Performance is confined to class eliminations and the occasional heads-up run.

The current situation is akin to the "everyone gets a trophy" mentality. I need to work hard on my combination and not just throw money at it. There are lots of guys going way fast who don't have all the bells and whistles seen on the cars in the millionaire's club.

I agree that Modified should be taken out of SS. The only reason I included it is they're already part of the class and not enough of them to run on their own. Given the present state of the class, it would be hard to justify taking them out unless NHRA also took out FSS, GT and FWD conversions. That would really kill the class.

I doubt you would find very many that think Stock or Super Stock is an “everyone’s gets a trophy” class. I know I have worked and raced hard to get the ones I have. No gimmes.
If you really believed what you said you would be running your car in comp eliminator. Instead of super stock. There is a class for your combo there. That’s a different world over there and you have to be really fast to play and have a chance to win. Comp has very few cars competing due to the extreme cost. We don’t want stock and super stock to become like comp. Also eliminating anyones class is not a good idea. How would you like it if your class was eliminated making your combo obsolete.
I enjoy racing and do it as a hobby. I don’t do it to make money although it’s nice to win some once in a while. I have won in every series that I race in. NHRA, IHRA and the local association that we have here in Florida.
I do all of my own work. Build my engines, transmission. Set up the rear end gears. I did all the welding and fabrication on my car. I also did the body work and paint. Not many left that do their own work.

[SBillinson]

Originally Posted by Mike Pearson

I doubt you would find very many that think Stock or Super Stock is an “everyone’s gets a trophy” class. I know I have worked and raced hard to get the ones I have. No gimmes.
If you really believed what you said you would be running your car in comp eliminator. Instead of super stock. There is a class for your combo there. That’s a different world over there and you have to be really fast to play and have a chance to win. Comp has very few cars competing due to the extreme cost. We don’t want stock and super stock to become like comp. Also eliminating anyones class is not a good idea. How would you like it if your class was eliminated making your combo obsolete.
I enjoy racing and do it as a hobby. I don’t do it to make money although it’s nice to win some once in a while. I have won in every series that I race in. NHRA, IHRA and the local association that we have here in Florida.
I do all of my own work. Build my engines, transmission. Set up the rear end gears. I did all the welding and fabrication on my car. I also did the body work and paint. Not many left that do their own work.

I do most of my work too, including tig welding and machining. Besides chassis work and other fabrication, I welded my block and heads. I also rebuild my transmissions and set-up differentials.

I do have an engine builder. He's amazing at his craft, and an incredible mentor and friend. He indulges me a bit with my crazy ideas, but he's the one who turned a 20 year old road racing engine into a .70 under piece. Not an easy task. I'm sticking with him despite having a decent little machine shop in my garage. He also builds all of his own stuff, and is bad fast.

I want to race Comp, but I love super stock and stock. When I do begin racing comp, I'll still compete in SS, but probably not Modified.

Combining classes doesn't eliminate anyone, it just makes the class more competitive. Having so many classes, working the ladder and shuffling around to avoid heads-up runs isn't exactly in the spirit of performance. Working hard on you stuff to go faster is the epitome of class racing. There are lots of people who still do that, but in many ways they're competing against themselves. Fewer classes would give everyone a chance to show their stuff, not only the millionaires. It may even draw some spectators and sponsorship.

[Andy Friar]

Originally Posted by SBillinson

I do most of my work too, including tig welding and machining. Besides chassis work and other fabrication, I welded my block and heads. I also rebuild my transmissions and set-up differentials.

I do have an engine builder. He's amazing at his craft, and an incredible mentor and friend. He indulges me a bit with my crazy ideas, but he's the one who turned a 20 year old road racing engine into a .70 under piece. Not an easy task. I'm sticking with him despite having a decent little machine shop in my garage. He also builds all of his own stuff, and is bad fast.

I want to race Comp, but I love super stock and stock. When I do begin racing comp, I'll still compete in SS, but probably not Modified.

Combining classes doesn't eliminate anyone, it just makes the class more competitive. Having so many classes, working the ladder and shuffling around to avoid heads-up runs isn't exactly in the spirit of performance. Working hard on you stuff to go faster is the epitome of class racing. There are lots of people who still do that, but in many ways they're competing against themselves. Fewer classes would give everyone a chance to show their stuff, not only the millionaires. It may even draw some spectators and sponsorship.

I give you kudos for doing most of the work on your own. Very few cats in sportsman/ bracket racing today, let alone STK/ SS that can do that much.

[SBillinson]

Originally Posted by Andy Friar

I give you kudos for doing most of the work on your own. Very few cats in sportsman/ bracket racing today, let alone STK/ SS that can do that much.

Thanks Andy. I'm building a stocker with my son. We'll post in the build section toward the end of the year..

[dannyboy]

Get a committee:
Bruce Bachelder-
Dave Ley
Current Div. Tech Directors
1 SK/SS rep from each Div,
Have them meet a couple of times to thrash ideas and suggestions, then sit down with Lonnie and devise a plan that is equitable for all concerned.

That would give a broad spectrum to draw from, old school that worked for years and new thinking.
Need to maintain current racers and their offspring as well as bring new blood into the sport.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by dannyboy

Get a committee:

Are you running for Congress? Form a committee!
We've got ENOUGH committees!
What has our SRAC committee done for us?
We NEED somebody who knows combos and can read a (rule) book!

[Charlie Yannetti]

Once everyone understands, and accepts, the the SRAC is nothing more than a group looked upon by NHRA as an "Appeasing Committee", we can all be over it..

This was the supposed replacement of Len Imbrogno, the way I see it, and it failed.. some reps do take it seriously, but I find it to be nothing more than a clique of non-communicating members.. and actually the NHRA fall guys, or girls.. got a problem, they say??.. bring it to your SRAC rep.. Yup, that always works, RIGHT??

It's a shame that the Rule By Committee thing has settled into NHRA Tech, where fairness and common sense no longer exist, unless the committee likes you..

As I've always said about the Left Coast regime, kick 'em all out, and replace them with REAL RACERS.. many of the issues raised in this thread would be easily rectified..

JUST SAYIN'!!!!

[GTX JOHN]

Well, this is probably not the right post to respond
to this.

Last week when we had class in Bakersfield, we put iron
heads on both our Stockers. The only thing the aluminum
heads do for us is take some weight of the nose of the cars.
Even with the 30 pounds off the car the Aluminum heads (We have
the best ones money can buy) slow the car down about 5 to 7
hundreds. Plus, they are very fussy about temp. and consistency.

But the "X" iron heads we have are too valuable and scarce to
run all the time. We will probably never find another set good
enough to turn into competitive stocker heads. I have destroyed
most all my good "X" heads over the last 50 some years. I look constantly
for them and often travel to the big automotive swap meet nearly every month
down in California.

Fortunately, we have three finished sets of top-quality Aluminum heads
as they are no longer produced and getting harder to find as
well. However, we have some hope of finding more as they are only
some years out of production = Not 50+ years and even back then
only a two-year production deal.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by GTX JOHN

But the "X" iron heads we have are too valuable and scarce to run all the time. We will probably never find another set good
enough to turn into competitive stocker heads. I have destroyed
most all my good "X" heads over the last 50 some years.

Imagine how many sets of "good X heads" you would still have if there were some knowledgeable people in place doing tear downs and it was no longer a mandatory process to have to make stock heads into Stocker heads?
Do you think they would crack if they weren't ground so thin? ;-)