Has anyone changed their mind about AA/SA index?

[Tom Moock]

Jeff, I don`t care what hood you run, is your 13 challenger B/SA a factory production car or a Drag Pak car. if factory production car? only superseded and or replacement parts you can use are motor parts, if listed by NHRA, no body parts per rule book, Joseph said your car didn`t have ser. # , Do you have to use stock control arms with straight axle or do you run indep. rear end? like the stock production Challenger came with. Tom

[Hagen Gary]

I wasn't a Chevy dealer or even alive in 1969. But couldn't you get a cowl hood for a Camaro over the counter or installed on your small block car? I would think you could with all the other options you could get over the counter. So, why did all those cars have to change to the flat hood and try to match paint a few years ago? I'm just asking because I'm uninformed. Please do not curse me out or call me names. Btw, I ran AA this year, and would prefer 10.80.

[Greg Hill]

10.75 or 10.80 would be a fair index for AA. This hood business is interesting but it's not that big a deal either way. The big deal is the horsepower rating of the Challengers in question and the reduction in shipping weight. First the 392 SRT motor is 485 from the factory and had 105 hp taken off before it ever went down the track and is rated at 380. The 5.7 Hemi is 375 hp from the factory and is rated at 300 now. These ratings are at SAE net with all accessories, mufflers and cats. Also shipping weights were reduced by 5-600 lbs. As long as I've been racing the only thing that comes close to this are the extremely bogus hp ratings used on the factory race cars when they first came out.

One needs to ask who benefits from these hp and weight reductions and how things like this happen. Is this good for stock eliminator? What's this do for the guys who have a car that runs in the same class? In my opinion, Nhra, the manufacturer, and the folks that pushed for this are responsible. We get side tracked by issues like a hood, but the big thing is the hp ratings and reduction in shipping weights.

[Hagen Gary]

So now we're not just looking for a Vin number on a car with a hood, now are looking for a Vin number on the car with the hood, 500 pounds less weight and a lot softer horse power factor? Is that what you're saying Mr. Hill?

[Joseph Teuton]

Originally Posted by Tom Moock

Jeff, I don`t care what hood you run, is your 13 challenger B/SA a factory production car or a Drag Pak car. if factory production car? only superseded and or replacement parts you can use are motor parts, if listed by NHRA, no body parts per rule book, Joseph said your car didn`t have ser. # , Do you have to use stock control arms with straight axle or do you run indep. rear end? like the stock production Challenger came with. Tom

The pink car is not classified as a Drag Pak. It doesn't follow the same rules as a DragPak. It's being classified as a showroom production car. It has a straight axle that was approved by NHRA. Other than that everything else on the car is avalible from the factory with factory part numbers!

[Joseph Teuton]

Originally Posted by Hagen Gary

So now we're not just looking for a Vin number on a car with a hood, now are looking for a Vin number on the car with the hood, 500 pounds less weight and a lot softer horse power factor? Is that what you're saying Mr. Hill?

Again this is not a Drag Pak. So no it's not 500 lbs less weight, it has glass windows, outside mirrors, and everything but a rear axle that comes from the factory. The hood is available for this car but to be honest it does nothing in performance due the fact it's made to run with a factory air box. Guys this is called evolution. We can not keep racing 1960, 70's, 80's and so on car when we are in the year 2016. We can't really think that the factory's were not going to produce cars and people were not going to submit them to NHRA to race and move along history huh..? Every car out there had a soft hp rating when it first came out or NO one would have raced it. With due time this will be consider an old car and other new cars will be here.

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Joseph Teuton

Every car out there had a soft hp rating when it first came out or NO one would have raced it. With due time this will be consider an old car and other new cars will be here.

Every car? Seriously? You REALLY want to try to tell us that EVERY car out there started out 5% to 20% or more soft?

And you really want to tell us no one ever builds anything that doesn't start off truly soft when they build it? No one would ever consider racing Stock or Super Stock if they couldn't start off with a soft easy combination?

Does anyone really seriously think that class racing has reached that point? Is it entirely over run with people who feel entitled and need a complete gift from the rule book in order to come race?

Look, I don't give a rat's back side about the hood on your car. And I like the new cars. But I don't think they need a massive gift in order to get them to the track.

Now that the thread has been completely derailed, how about we get back on the subject? A perfect example was this weekend. Where would McClanahan have qualified had he been running on a 10.80 index, as opposed to the current 10.60 index? He'd have been .979 under, as opposed to .779 under. Is .979 really outside the norm for a fast car?

[HR9121]

I saw the pink car had the glove box insulated to hold cold beer, can this be confirmed as a factory option or is this another way y'all are skirting the rules?

[Tom Moock]

Joseph, So Jeff`s Challenger started out as a Drag Pak car and you changed it to a production car, per you said it had no ser. #, do you have same control arms as the Drag Pak? 4 bar or do you have stock control arms per rule book? you didn't answer my question. Tom

[Joseph Teuton]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Every car? Seriously? You REALLY want to try to tell us that EVERY car out there started out 5% to 20% or more soft?

And you really want to tell us no one ever builds anything that doesn't start off truly soft when they build it? No one would ever consider racing Stock or Super Stock if they couldn't start off with a soft easy combination?

Does anyone really seriously think that class racing has reached that point? Is it entirely over run with people who feel entitled and need a complete gift from the rule book in order to come race?

Look, I don't give a rat's back side about the hood on your car. And I like the new cars. But I don't think they need a massive gift in order to get them to the track.

Now that the thread has been completely derailed, how about we get back on the subject? A perfect example was this weekend. Where would McClanahan have qualified had he been running on a 10.80 index, as opposed to the current 10.60 index? He'd have been .979 under, as opposed to .779 under. Is .979 really outside the norm for a fast car?

Allen I didn't give specifics how soft but cars didn't start where they truly should have been. Are some index's soft sure.

With so many combos out there why would you want to pick a combo that isn't competitive, is all I was saying.

As the thread goes, your buddy Bruce started the tiff about the hood and accusing us of cheating. I agree as everone on the thread that something needs to be done and not just AA!