Ford vs Chevy Build-up - Page 45

SSGT Mustang · 05-08-2015, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FED 387

nothing I can find in the NHRA rule book mentions shock strut braces either way---- only thing mentioned is that the suspension must remain OEM this has nothing to do with suspension it is a "body strengthening support"!!!--- check with NHRA get a definite ruling -- it is not a performance enhancing modification it is a safety or steering issue you are dealing with here--- If it were me I'd put one one show up at the track and if they did not like it pull it off otherwise plead your case and run the damn thing FED 387

Exactly. I would find it very hard to believe that your divisional tech director would say it has to go.

HandOverFist · 05-09-2015, 01:10 AM

If I had one on hand I would put it on to see what the difference is. I'm sure it will be fine for tomorrow. Thinking I will just let Kenny run it in the Combo if he wants to...I'll make fuel adjustments as needed. I have my high-tech data recorder on charge...going to mount the Go-Pro on the crossbar and point it at the afr gauge hehe.

SSGT Mustang · 05-09-2015, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HandOverFist

If I had one on hand I would put it on to see what the difference is. I'm sure it will be fine for tomorrow. Thinking I will just let Kenny run it in the Combo if he wants to...I'll make fuel adjustments as needed. I have my high-tech data recorder on charge...going to mount the Go-Pro on the crossbar and point it at the afr gauge hehe.

Without a doubt. The car will be fine. But it's worth having down the road.

If you can tig and have a bender, you could just make a cross bar out of chromoly and be done with it. It'll cost you $15 in materials and about an hour to make. .

Have fun today. It should run good.

Dave Gantz · 05-09-2015, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HandOverFist

No doubt the car is lower with those 4-cylinder front springs not to mention all the wear and tear on the street all those years...these cars are made of nothing. I don't have the experience with them to say one way or another what the effect will be on the track. If its negligible I will put it out of mind and concentrate on other areas.

The lowering puts the camber adjustment range out of reach. That's why slotting the mounting holes works.
As to bracing, the car moves whether or not it's lowered. I'm not following you as to how bracing it will get the camber back.

SSGT Mustang · 05-09-2015, 08:03 AM

I've got three fox bodies. A coupe, a hatchback and convertible. Only the convertible has camber problems from not having a steel roof.

The car is in excellent condition. 50,000 miles, never been hit.

When I went to paint, the doors on both sides of the car had to be bent in to get them realigned. Even with caster/camber plate (camber at full slot), couldn't get the camber even close.

The strut towers have moved inward, because of the lack of support. Push them out with a brace and camber returns. Even with a brace, caster/camber plates are usually needed if the car has been lowered.

black88coupe · 05-09-2015, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSGT Mustang

Even with a brace, caster/camber plates are usually needed if the car has been lowered.

I just installed a set of H&R Sport Springs on my 85GT. I also have the Maximum Motorsports strut tower brace and Team Z camber/ caster plates. The alignment shop got it in spec but it took them a little while I guess.

HandOverFist · 05-09-2015, 09:43 AM

One would think after all these years a used brace would be floating around somewhere for sale, but I have not run across it yet.

Well. I'm off to the shop to get everything loaded up...wish me luck!

HandOverFist · 05-10-2015, 03:12 AM

Good news is both cars avoided being on the bottom of the ladder...bad news is they both suck.

I made the first qualifying pass in the Mustang and knew right away it was going to be awful. Eyeballing the afr gauge for much of the run I could see it was in the 11.8 range nearly all the way down. My GoPro camera confirmed it after the fact. Could only muster a 13.60 on a 13.00 index.

I took some fuel away at WOT with the controller before handing the car off to Kenny. It responded on the second qualifying pass with a 13.32...a step in the right direction at least. Kenny reported the afr gauge reading 14.0 before the stripe so I was stumped at what to do with it next.

Just before first round I gave it just a touch more fuel back in all the cells previously entered as well as taking away 2 degrees timing from 3500 to 6500rpm. Kenny and I both went red first round and the Mustang went 13.34 with the changes. I'm going to have to work with the fuel/timing on this engine...really need some type of recorder to nail it down.

There is also a serious bind in the rear-end which is definitely working against forward motion. I will pull it apart tm to see whats up there. Not the best outing for sure, but hey...there were no parts scattered on the track at least.

SSGT Mustang · 05-10-2015, 07:09 AM

Take heart, man. You're within .30 of the index with a car you built yourself having no experience with the brand. That's nothing to be ashamed of.

You also identified problems with A/F and rear end bind, which once fixed will almost surely bring you under the index. You need to watch what the converter is doing and figure shift points. Got a playback tach? Also, did you scale the car?

While not .80 under first time out as most new cars aren't, you'll probably be 30-.50 by the end of the month if you bring it out every weekend and keep working it one change at a time.

I was wondering about how things went all day and pretty sure others have too. I think you did pretty good.

tommy d · 05-10-2015, 08:20 AM

I also was anxious this morning to see how things went. Thanks for keeping us updated.

05-09-2015, 01:10 AM	#442
HandOverFist VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Gulf Breeze, FL Posts: 1,651 Likes: 8 Liked 33 Times in 16 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up If I had one on hand I would put it on to see what the difference is. I'm sure it will be fine for tomorrow. Thinking I will just let Kenny run it in the Combo if he wants to...I'll make fuel adjustments as needed. I have my high-tech data recorder on charge...going to mount the Go-Pro on the crossbar and point it at the afr gauge hehe. __________________ Rich Taylor I/SA - 321

05-09-2015, 08:03 AM	#445
SSGT Mustang Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Jersey Posts: 359 Likes: 35 Liked 204 Times in 54 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up I've got three fox bodies. A coupe, a hatchback and convertible. Only the convertible has camber problems from not having a steel roof. The car is in excellent condition. 50,000 miles, never been hit. When I went to paint, the doors on both sides of the car had to be bent in to get them realigned. Even with caster/camber plate (camber at full slot), couldn't get the camber even close. The strut towers have moved inward, because of the lack of support. Push them out with a brace and camber returns. Even with a brace, caster/camber plates are usually needed if the car has been lowered. Last edited by SSGT Mustang; 05-09-2015 at 08:19 AM.

05-09-2015, 09:43 AM	#447
HandOverFist VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Gulf Breeze, FL Posts: 1,651 Likes: 8 Liked 33 Times in 16 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up One would think after all these years a used brace would be floating around somewhere for sale, but I have not run across it yet. Well. I'm off to the shop to get everything loaded up...wish me luck! __________________ Rich Taylor I/SA - 321

05-10-2015, 03:12 AM	#448
HandOverFist VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Gulf Breeze, FL Posts: 1,651 Likes: 8 Liked 33 Times in 16 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Good news is both cars avoided being on the bottom of the ladder...bad news is they both suck. I made the first qualifying pass in the Mustang and knew right away it was going to be awful. Eyeballing the afr gauge for much of the run I could see it was in the 11.8 range nearly all the way down. My GoPro camera confirmed it after the fact. Could only muster a 13.60 on a 13.00 index. I took some fuel away at WOT with the controller before handing the car off to Kenny. It responded on the second qualifying pass with a 13.32...a step in the right direction at least. Kenny reported the afr gauge reading 14.0 before the stripe so I was stumped at what to do with it next. Just before first round I gave it just a touch more fuel back in all the cells previously entered as well as taking away 2 degrees timing from 3500 to 6500rpm. Kenny and I both went red first round and the Mustang went 13.34 with the changes. I'm going to have to work with the fuel/timing on this engine...really need some type of recorder to nail it down. There is also a serious bind in the rear-end which is definitely working against forward motion. I will pull it apart tm to see whats up there. Not the best outing for sure, but hey...there were no parts scattered on the track at least. __________________ Rich Taylor I/SA - 321

05-10-2015, 07:09 AM	#449
SSGT Mustang Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Jersey Posts: 359 Likes: 35 Liked 204 Times in 54 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Take heart, man. You're within .30 of the index with a car you built yourself having no experience with the brand. That's nothing to be ashamed of. You also identified problems with A/F and rear end bind, which once fixed will almost surely bring you under the index. You need to watch what the converter is doing and figure shift points. Got a playback tach? Also, did you scale the car? While not .80 under first time out as most new cars aren't, you'll probably be 30-.50 by the end of the month if you bring it out every weekend and keep working it one change at a time. I was wondering about how things went all day and pretty sure others have too. I think you did pretty good.

05-10-2015, 08:20 AM	#450
tommy d Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Indiana Posts: 830 Likes: 1,614 Liked 359 Times in 135 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up I also was anxious this morning to see how things went. Thanks for keeping us updated. __________________ Who owns this car, with the peace sign,mag wheels, and four on the floor?