What's wrong with Stock?

[Andys dad]

OK I am up -- got the kind of responses I expected. from the same three keyboard jockeys.

You guys do not want any change that impacts 40 year old cars.

How in the heck can the rules stand still with all that is going on in performance increases.

I wish we were in our own eliminator - but I do that would stop the whining.

At the end of the day - who really cares - it is not our game - it belongs to NHRA and the "big 3" - like it or not - it is about selling cars - not race cars.

Guys find someone to harp on that really cares - I just decided to break my pact with other late model fast car owners and address you guys - they were right - none of you would ever step up and ever agree with change - to stuck in the past.

Go to NHRA an get the rules changed - so far the old cars have been dismissed (mostly).

Say to NHRA formally what you are saying on here - which does not count.

Or maybe we should stop racing our cars to show our displeasure with how the 40 year old cars have been screwed.

Have a great rest of the holiday.



Ron

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

OK I am up -- got the kind of responses I expected. from the same three keyboard jockeys.

You guys do not want any change that impacts 40 year old cars.

How in the heck can the rules stand still with all that is going on in performance increases.

I wish we were in our own eliminator - but I do that would stop the whining.

At the end of the day - who really cares - it is not our game - it belongs to NHRA and the "big 3" - like it or not - it is about selling cars - not race cars.

Guys find someone to harp on that really cares - I just decided to break my pact with other late model fast car owners and address you guys - they were right - none of you would ever step up and ever agree with change - to stuck in the past.

Go to NHRA an get the rules changed - so far the old cars have been dismissed (mostly).

Say to NHRA formally what you are saying on here - which does not count.

Or maybe we should stop racing our cars to show our displeasure with how the 40 year old cars have been screwed.

Have a great rest of the holiday.



Ron

Oh, we agree with change Ron. It is the fact that you want everything changed in your favor that is the problem. You want cars already in the class kicked out so you can have your own playground. The new cars got a free pass with the AHFS, that's the sort of change you want.

The rules could stay the same with no problems. There was zero need to change the rules of Stock Eliminator due to "performance increases". New production street cars could have been listed in the guide and raced with no problems. And then the factory race cars could have been put in their own Factory Experimental class, where they belong.

And yeah, if your store bought "I mortgaged my house and spent my life savings to buy fast" car was in its own class, Factory Experimental, along with the rest of them, the complaining would stop.

You'll excuse me now, it's Labor Day, I have to go labor in my garage to make money to pay for racing parts.

[Andys dad]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Oh, we agree with change Ron. It is the fact that you want everything changed in your favor that is the problem. You want cars already in the class kicked out so you can have your own playground. The new cars got a free pass with the AHFS, that's the sort of change you want.

The rules could stay the same with no problems. There was zero need to change the rules of Stock Eliminator due to "performance increases". New production street cars could have been listed in the guide and raced with no problems. And then the factory race cars could have been put in their own Factory Experimental class, where they belong.

And yeah, if your store bought "I mortgaged my house and spent my life savings to buy fast" car was in its own class, Factory Experimental, along with the rest of them, the complaining would stop.

You'll excuse me now, it's Labor Day, I have to go labor in my garage to make money to pay for racing parts.

You have a habit of miss quoting people on here. We do not run "factory stock" it is a travesty and insult to many of my fellow racers - get your facts straight when you refer to me.

I never asked for a single rule change.

Why don't you busy yourself and your keyboard with letters to NHRA. I am sure if the issues are so egregious they will listen and surely change them. I am happy with whatever rule change you can effect.

If you could take the time to show me where I asked for this - I would really appreciate it.

I consider it an insult when you accuse me of dishonorable decisions – I am entitled to make my own decisions and they have nothing to do with how you think.

If you think for one minute I did this because I have the money or desire to beat up on 40 year old cars - why not see me at a drag race - if you ever go to one - oh and please make it out west - I cannot afford to travel back east.

And Bruce - it is not hollow to step up and spend the necessary money on upgrading to a new car .. it is exhilarating - I did not have anything to do with the rules. It has taken a long time to change my thinking to be competitive with a new car - the trouble is none of you have a clue on how hard it is to make one of these go fast.

You apparently think it does not take rear end gear changes, transmission gear changes, converter changes, tuning changes, valve spring changes, cam shaft changes and many other things, too numerous to mention. It takes way more than money but you do not want to believe that - you think you just spend your way to going fast – that causes me to doubt your racing savvy – spending is rarely the answer – hard work and effort usually nets performance increases.

I am a predictive analyst and studied very careful what I thought was the proper course of action – I never considered easy or money being the answer -now you choose to decide I am some sort of bad person with evil ulterior motives.

Perhaps I should have picked the most out of line 40 year old car and BOUGHT one of those -- that would have been OK – right? Or better yet - follow Larry Hills lead and find a combination that is only out of line …

Please vote (on here) to see if we should abandon our new car in favor of a 40 year old one like we use to run. Have NHRA change the factory stock rules and quite beating up on people who love and are driven by drag racing.

Work for change with NHRA not me – except for Jeff T. - no fast car owners want to endure the insults you guys through around on here instead of working for change with NHRA.

[Bruce Noland]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

You have a habit of miss quoting people on here. We do not run "factory stock" it is a travesty and insult to many of my fellow racers - get your facts straight when you refer to me.

I never asked for a single rule change.

Why don't you busy yourself and your keyboard with letters to NHRA. I am sure if the issues are so egregious they will listen and surely change them. I am happy with whatever rule change you can effect.

If you could take the time to show me where I asked for this - I would really appreciate it.

I consider it an insult when you accuse me of dishonorable decisions – I am entitled to make my own decisions and they have nothing to do with how you think.

If you think for one minute I did this because I have the money or desire to beat up on 40 year old cars - why not see me at a drag race - if you ever go to one - oh and please make it out west - I cannot afford to travel back east.

And Bruce - it is not hollow to step up and spend the necessary money on upgrading to a new car .. it is exhilarating - I did not have anything to do with the rules. It has taken a long time to change my thinking to be competitive with a new car - the trouble is none of you have a clue on how hard it is to make one of these go fast.

You apparently think it does not take rear end gear changes, transmission gear changes, converter changes, tuning changes, valve spring changes, cam shaft changes and many other things, too numerous to mention. It takes way more than money but you do not want to believe that - you think you just spend your way to going fast – that causes me to doubt your racing savvy – spending is rarely the answer – hard work and effort usually nets performance increases.

I am a predictive analyst and studied very careful what I thought was the proper course of action – I never considered easy or money being the answer -now you choose to decide I am some sort of bad person with evil ulterior motives.

Perhaps I should have picked the most out of line 40 year old car and BOUGHT one of those -- that would have been OK – right? Or better yet - follow Larry Hills lead and find a combination that is only out of line …

Please vote (on here) to see if we should abandon our new car in favor of a 40 year old one like we use to run. Have NHRA change the factory stock rules and quite beating up on people who love and are driven by drag racing.

Work for change with NHRA not me – except for Jeff T. - no fast car owners want to endure the insults you guys through around on here instead of working for change with NHRA.

Talking about an outdated concept "working with nhra for change"

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

1. You have a habit of miss quoting people on here. We do not run "factory stock" it is a travesty and insult to many of my fellow racers - get your facts straight when you refer to me.

2. I never asked for a single rule change.

3. Why don't you busy yourself and your keyboard with letters to NHRA. I am sure if the issues are so egregious they will listen and surely change them. I am happy with whatever rule change you can effect.

4. If you could take the time to show me where I asked for this - I would really appreciate it.

5. I consider it an insult when you accuse me of dishonorable decisions – I am entitled to make my own decisions and they have nothing to do with how you think.

6. If you think for one minute I did this because I have the money or desire to beat up on 40 year old cars - why not see me at a drag race - if you ever go to one - oh and please make it out west - I cannot afford to travel back east.

1. No one ever said anything about anyone running "factory stock", certainly I did not. You have a habit of being condescending and insulting. I did not misquote you on anything. No one else is claiming they're insulted. Just you.

2. I suggest you look up thread, where you specifically stated the old cars should get kicked out of Stock Eliminator and put in some sort of "nostalgia" class. I can point it out for you if you like.

Here, try your post, #17 in this thread:

Originally Posted by Andys dad

How about cars over 40 years old run in a nostalgia stock category and not stock eliminator?


Ron Durham
Proud V10 drag Pak owner

3. Letters have already been written to NHRA, Ron. You chose to jump in this thread. Now you want to tell everyone whether or not they should comment, and how? Seems true to your form, since you said we should all be forced to mortgage our homes and spend our life savings to stay in the class. Of course, you'll deny that, too. See your post, #24 in this thread.

4. See #2 above, in this very thread you not only asked for older cars to be removed from the class, but stated we should all have to spend everything we have in order to compete. See your post, #24, in this thread.

5. I never called your decision dishonorable. You came out and bragged that you mortgaged your house and spent your life savings. I said it was your choice, one most of us would not make. I don't care what you do with your money. I do care if you try to force the rest of us to have to do it. Again, I call your attention to your post, #24, in this thread.

6. So, now you want me to come to the west coast to speak to you, because you spent all your money and can't come to the east coast. How amusing. Ask anyone who has met me, and there are plenty, I'll tell anyone face to face what I think. I haven't lost anything out west, if you wish to "confront' me, you can come east.

Ron, since you want to make this personal, I suggest you take it up with the owner of the site. I have not made any personal attacks, and I will not. Ken has offered us this site for polite and civil discussion, I will abide by his rules.

[Andys dad]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

1. No one ever said anything about anyone running "factory stock", certainly I did not. You have a habit of being condescending and insulting. I did not misquote you on anything. No one else is claiming they're insulted. Just you.

2. I suggest you look up thread, where you specifically stated the old cars should get kicked out of Stock Eliminator and put in some sort of "nostalgia" class. I can point it out for you if you like.

Here, try your post, #17 in this thread:

3. Letters have already been written to NHRA, Ron. You chose to jump in this thread. Now you want to tell everyone whether or not they should comment, and how? Seems true to your form, since you said we should all be forced to mortgage our homes and spend our life savings to stay in the class. Of course, you'll deny that, too. See your post, #24 in this thread.

4. See #2 above, in this very thread you not only asked for older cars to be removed from the class, but stated we should all have to spend everything we have in order to compete. See your post, #24, in this thread.

5. I never called your decision dishonorable. You came out and bragged that you mortgaged your house and spent your life savings. I said it was your choice, one most of us would not make. I don't care what you do with your money. I do care if you try to force the rest of us to have to do it. Again, I call your attention to your post, #24, in this thread.

6. So, now you want me to come to the west coast to speak to you, because you spent all your money and can't come to the east coast. How amusing. Ask anyone who has met me, and there are plenty, I'll tell anyone face to face what I think. I haven't lost anything out west, if you wish to "confront' me, you can come east.

Ron, since you want to make this personal, I suggest you take it up with the owner of the site. I have not made any personal attacks, and I will not. Ken has offered us this site for polite and civil discussion, I will abide by his rules.

I never bragged - you consider it bragging when some one makes decisions you can not bring yourself to make.

Once again you are trying to engage me in a personal verbal argument on here - you act like a mad child lashing out and finding fault with all truth.

Never address the real issues.

I am not making it personal - stop attacking me personally - look at your words ..

I only wanted to discuss with you in person not on here - what I can afford to do is my business - I suspect you can not afford to come west either.

Now get off of here and watch the ESPN broadcast - this has been exactly what I thought it would be - very entertaining - that is all this website provides - entertainment.

Oh and most of all opinion.

I do not think it is your make up to just let it drop.

[Chris Hill]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

OK I am up -- got the kind of responses I expected. from the same three keyboard jockeys.

You guys do not want any change that impacts 40 year old cars.

How in the heck can the rules stand still with all that is going on in performance increases.

I wish we were in our own eliminator - but I do that would stop the whining.

At the end of the day - who really cares - it is not our game - it belongs to NHRA and the "big 3" - like it or not - it is about selling cars - not race cars.

Guys find someone to harp on that really cares - I just decided to break my pact with other late model fast car owners and address you guys - they were right - none of you would ever step up and ever agree with change - to stuck in the past.

Go to NHRA an get the rules changed - so far the old cars have been dismissed (mostly).

Say to NHRA formally what you are saying on here - which does not count.

Or maybe we should stop racing our cars to show our displeasure with how the 40 year old cars have been screwed.

Have a great rest of the holiday.



Ron

Ron, I'm not sure your in the "late model fast car owners" club.

Evaluating DRC, your car is too slow to qualify at Indy.

Guess you'll need to buy a Hellcat engine so you can MAYBE go fast again.

[Andys dad]

Originally Posted by Chris Hill

Ron, I'm not sure your in the "late model fast car owners" club.

Evaluating DRC, your car is too slow to qualify at Indy.

Guess you'll need to buy a Hellcat engine so you can MAYBE go fast again.

Guess you will have to learn a little about how to play the game ..you never know how much someone weighs from looking at DRC .. not everyone runs as lite as they can .. we protected our HP .. we would have qualified in Super Stock (the eliminator we chose to run) .. but that is all speculation we were not there.

Since you pay so much attention to DRC .. I guess you knew that we run Super Stock - LMFAO

[Chris Hill]

Originally Posted by Andys dad

Guess you will have to learn a little about how to play the game.

We have very good credentials "how to play the game."

Actually, decades of experience on the largest stage.

[Jim Wahl]

Alan said:

"The rules could stay the same with no problems. There was zero need to change the rules of Stock Eliminator due to "performance increases". New production street cars could have been listed in the guide and raced with no problems. And then the factory race cars could have been put in their own Factory Experimental class, where they belong."

The best paragraph in this whole thread. This sums it up perfectly. You just can not have a "no hold bared" group racing a heavily ruled group and expect equality. Ron, when did you become so confrontational? Damn! Jim

.