Econo Modified

[rick winchester]

Mark,e mod was 4 1" holes in the plate, 2.5 dia. collector and 10.5, 29.5 tire. I think it had two wt,. breaks 2800lbs. for under 370 ci. 3000 lbs. for big blocks over 370ci. Ken Sharp won the first two races in my Grand Prix using his and Bill Sempsrotts 400 small block.The whole thing folded when they changed the tire and collector rule. It was great to race heads up with no break out . If something like this will ever survive ,the rules must remain the unchanged. Rick.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by rick winchester

Mark,e mod was 4 1" holes in the plate, 2.5 dia. collector and 10.5, 29.5 tire.

THAT is the formula that you need to pursue if you are going to succeed.
Hi Rick, Happy New Year!

[randy wilson]

I'd go for a 10.5 spec tire so everyone runs the same tire. And I'd go for a 2.5 inch outlet. BUT, you have to have people willing to play. And then have someone write, and stick with the rules. If we're going to do that, then let's go all the way, and make it 10 lbs. per cube, 3,000# min. just like it was. Fine with me. Just let everyone know, no matter what, that's the way it will stay. By the way, can we just neck down our current headers to 2.5 inches? I believe the first tire allowed was a 11.5, but that may have been IHRA.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by randy wilson

I'd go for a 10.5 spec tire so everyone runs the same tire. And I'd go for a 2.5 inch outlet. BUT, you have to have people willing to play. If we're going to do that, then let's go all the way, and make it 10 lbs. per cube, 3,000# min.

Look, if this thing is going to have any chance at all, you are correct in that you need to have people willing to play. The BEST way to get people to play is to have a rule structure that is strict enough to limit the high dollar engine mods while being loose enough to allow in the maximum number of "pre-existing" cars. The cubic in/ weight thing restricts your potential entries too much. Whether you like it or not, you're going to have to come up with something that will attract not just obsolete Modified and SS cars but (like it or not!) Bracket cars and .90 cars too. Minimum weight, put a serialized, restrictor plate supplied by the series promoter or check all plates with a go-nogo gauge and replace your collector with a 21/2" one or put a cone on your collector and pre-check with a go-nogo gauge. In a matter of a half an hour a great number of cars can compete.
I think that I would leave the full tree vs. pro tree open and maybe even consider an instant green tree.

[Glenn Hayes]

So ........ your going to allow Automatic Transmissions then, right?

If that's the case, what's the point of another class?

Folks were excited to watch Modified because of the high winding, clutch dropping, 4 dry hops and slamming the gears at 9,000+ RPM.
I wouldn't care if the cars ran 11 second E.T.s.
But, if your going to change things to allow automatics, your just going to have another class without the excitement.

Make the Class with 4 & 5 speeds only.

[joespanova]

Originally Posted by Glenn Hayes

So ........ your going to allow Automatic Transmissions then, right?

If that's the case, what's the point of another class?

Folks were excited to watch Modified because of the high winding, clutch dropping, 4 dry hops and slamming the gears at 9,000+ RPM.
I wouldn't care is the cars ran 11 second E.T.s.
But, if your going to change things to allow automatics, your just going to have another class without the excitement.

Make the Class with 4 & 5 speeds only.

AMEN
and thank you
A 2.5 inch collector ? Really ?

[Dick Butler]

I raced a SS/EA corvette with a powerglide BBC. This car pulled the wheels every run and every dry hop. Its not the Stick that makes the car work, its the suspension and the dry hop. Whoever said allowing an automatic makes it just another class hasnt been reading the rules. No fab manifolds, no dry sumps, etc etc, The collector is for a reason. Keep it simple and allow one size keeps the multiple pile of collectors useless in the garage from developing. Thoughts are appreciated...

[randy wilson]

Listen all. My ideal class for me has already been stated numerous times. I like a max 14.32 tire, 750 carb, 3.5 inch collector, spec heads from brodix, and clutch only. But, that's just me. I feel the restrictions we now have in there are enough to limit money spent. I have no, zero, nada, ziltch problems with bracket cars being allowed as long as they make min. wt. I ran a SS car against two Ness cars, and did just fine under these rules. Do we have to complicate it anymore then this? Use a spec spacer for everyone then, but same size as the carb outlet. Wouldn't that do the same thing. And If everyone is only allowed a 3.5 inch exhaust exit, wouldn't that accomplish the same thing? Also, Billy, I personnaly ain't against having autos in there. Also, Dick, a spec 3.5 collector would be fine with me.

[Michael Beard]

Originally Posted by joespanova

A 2.5 inch collector ? Really ?

Yes. Although a 2" cone would be better. The concept of coupling restrictions on both the intake (restrictor plate) and exhaust (collector) massively mitigates any gains from trying to work the carb, cylinder heads, etc, because it can't breathe. It's not worth spending money on a no-gain proposition. If you used this method, you wouldn't *need* a spec head. Install the plate and collector on any combination, and go play. Tech is a breeze.

We did extensive computer modeling of this concept, ending up with everything from 350 small blocks to 540 big blocks running within less than a tenth of each other. Some ran the first half of the track better, and some ran the back half better, but it all came out in the wash. You can make weight break adjustments for different transmission types, body styles, or whatever you find out is necessary.

Bracket racing, for ALL it's participation, has ZERO crowd appeal.

We had 500+ spectators on Saturday of our American Doorslammer Nationals at Fayetteville in November, because we bothered to pass out a few flyers and only charged $10. Obviously not an overwhelming crowd, but not bad for "just a bracket race", and $150 marketing investment. Motor Mania TV regularly has over 10,000+ viewers watching big money bracket racing online. Anything that's not promoted will have zero appeal. Different types of racing appeals to different crowds. While not every crowd is interested in every market, there is a particular crowd for every market.

[Billy Nees]

Originally Posted by Glenn Hayes

Make the Class with 4 & 5 speeds only.

AND IT WILL BE GUARANTEED TO FAIL. You can't dis-allow 90% of your customers. You guys have to decide what you are willing to LIVE with. We have a local Pro-Stick circuit and it's fun to watch and does very well but they don't run heads-up. In fact, add to the simple rules; Stick cars and trans-brake autos must add 100 lbs. to minimum weight.