End of Stock and SuperStock Racing??

[Jeff Lee]

I've been saying this to deaf, SELFISH ears to years. Decrease the amount of classes which will push towards more heads-up runs, make those that try, try harder and sponsors will be happier all at the same time. I know that the two out of two OEM's I've spoken to whole heartedly agree with me and I've not communicated with the 3rd OEM representative.
How to do this? Simple. Combine classes like Top Stock; I.e., A-B-C race together on B weight, D-E-F race together on E weight, and so on down the line. At the same time, combine sticks and autos.
This gets shot down due to those trying to protect their turfs, plain and simple. But I'd rather loose a small turf than the whole turf.
I'm at Boy Scout camp this entire week. It's a lot more rewarding than drag racing but I see the politicos here too. Damn, everybody's got an agenda and turf to protect!

[Gary Smith]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lee

I've been saying this to deaf, SELFISH ears to years. Decrease the amount of classes which will push towards more heads-up runs, make those that try, try harder and sponsors will be happier all at the same time. I know that the two out of two OEM's I've spoken to whole heartedly agree with me and I've not communicated with the 3rd OEM representative.
How to do this? Simple. Combine classes like Top Stock; I.e., A-B-C race together on B weight, D-E-F race together on E weight, and so on down the line. At the same time, combine sticks and autos.
This gets shot down due to those trying to protect their turfs, plain and simple. But I'd rather loose a small turf than the whole turf.
I'm at Boy Scout camp this entire week. It's a lot more rewarding than drag racing but I see the politicos here too. Damn, everybody's got an agenda and turf to protect!

Unfortunately the very reason I got so obsessed with class racing may be the very reason of it's impeding doom - over complexity to the average spectator. When you count the number of designations, confusing rules, unexplainable slower cars, bracket-index-breakouts, it's no wonder the average fan ends up walking away from the stands. And as I've said before, lack of self-marketing from most racers to non-traditional outlets (car-shows, seminars, other varying non-motorsport venue solicitation) and less than desirable engagement with spectators continues to seal the fate of Stock & Super Stock. It is no longer up to the "HRAs" to sustain its future, but the participants and supporters.

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by Gary Smith

Unfortunately the very reason I got so obsessed with class racing may be the very reason of it's impeding doom - over complexity to the average spectator. When you count the number of designations, confusing rules, unexplainable slower cars, bracket-index-breakouts, it's no wonder the average fan ends up walking away from the stands. And as I've said before, lack of self-marketing from most racers to non-traditional outlets (car-shows, seminars, other varying non-motorsport venue solicitation) and less than desirable engagement with spectators continues to seal the fate of Stock & Super Stock. It is no longer up to the "HRAs" to sustain its future, but the participants and supporters.

Excellent Post !!

"And as I've said before, lack of self-marketing from most racers to non-traditional outlets (car-shows, seminars, other varying non-motorsport venue solicitation) and less than desirable engagement with spectators continues to seal the fate of Stock & Super Stock. It is no longer up to the "HRAs" to sustain its future, but the participants and supporters."

[partsbob67]

do you think this would help or hurt? cut the classes and also go to a spec type engine program where you use edelbrock heads for your engine and a 750 or 850 holley carb. now I realize this doesn't work for the 6 cyl guys and some other combos, but it could cut some of the cost of building and maintaining a combo. it's seems like that is what they are doing with the new cars, why not spread the wealth?

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by partsbob67

do you think this would help or hurt? cut the classes and also go to a spec type engine program where you use edelbrock heads for your engine and a 750 or 850 holley carb. now I realize this doesn't work for the 6 cyl guys and some other combos, but it could cut some of the cost of building and maintaining a combo. it's seems like that is what they are doing with the new cars, why not spread the wealth?

NO !

Takes away the fun of selecting a combo.
Narrowing number of classes is a good idea.
However think the Crate Engines Classes should be added to S/SS.
Match HP rating accordingly.


d

[Kenny Wigington]

Originally Posted by partsbob67

do you think this would help or hurt? cut the classes and also go to a spec type engine program where you use edelbrock heads for your engine and a 750 or 850 holley carb. now I realize this doesn't work for the 6 cyl guys and some other combos, but it could cut some of the cost of building and maintaining a combo. it's seems like that is what they are doing with the new cars, why not spread the wealth?

NO, not exactly. Then you "junk" all the existing hardware there, in place, now. Relegating combo's worked on hard, for many years and decades, at their own costs, labor and parts , would be completely wasting them, and that would essentaily, kill the Stock and SuperStock classes, for good. That would not be beneficial, to anyone.

[Michael Colaluca]

Combining sticks and autos with 1lb weight breaks would also help the class. Who doesn't like to watch heads up racing??

[Ken Miele]

With all do respect to RJ, this subject comes up every so often. Stock and Super Stock are doing just fine. Its not coming to the end, its just changing. Life is dynamic as is racing. The class has been changing ever since it was created. Currently there are more competition numbers in stock then ever before.

Granted there are things that need to be addressed, but for the most part racers still have fun and look forward to going racing. Just look at the entry's for Chicago and Norwalk, there are close to a 1000 cars entered.

As Michael listed there are new young racers in stock and super stock and it looks about right compared to when I was young. Back in the seventy’s when I got into racing, I did not know anyone that was interested in Class Racing. Everyone in the neighborhood had hot rods, mostly muscle cars. We went to the track every once in awhile, but most of our racing was on the street. Most of us could not afford a truck and trailer and a race car. You would need at least $10,000 to $15,000 to have a racing operation. Most of us only made $150-200 a week as a teenager or 20 something.

I think its more affordable today to have a class car. A 80’s 5.0 mustang, truck and trailer could be had for $20,000 to $25,000. Even cheaper if you work at it. Most things today cost 4 times as much as they did in 1975.

I grew up in Queens New York, there were lots of kids who didn’t care about cars or racing, just like today. I don’t see it being much different today. In the mid 80’s when I started class racing the fans would leave the stands after the pro’s ran and would filter through the pits to look at not only the pro’s, but sportsmen also, just like today. I also remember some of the older class racers saying, “there’s no way class racing will be around in the next 20 years, there is not enough young people interested and NHRA does not give a dam about us, we're are only filler”

Guys, Class Racing will be around as long as NHRA is around. The sky is not falling, yes its expensive to race, but it was expensive for a young person back in the seventy's. Heck most racers thought it would be the end of all racing in the seventy’s. Fuel was skyrocketing, very few performance cars were coming out of Detroit. Good jobs were hard to come by. The more things change, the more they stay the same someone once said.... Class racing is changing.... not ending.

[partsbob67]

Originally Posted by Kenny Wigington

NO, not exactly. Then you "junk" all the existing hardware there, in place, now. Relegating combo's worked on hard, for many years and decades, at their own costs, labor and parts , would be completely wasting them, and that would essentaily, kill the Stock and SuperStock classes, for good. That would not be beneficial, to anyone.

so then it's kind of back to he with the biggest wallet wins. I say that because what does a set of "legal'" heads run now? 3 grand or more depending on how fast you need to go. and each year we get away for the true origin of stock with rule enhancements for the sake of safety (race seats, wheelie bars etc...) or dependability (roller rockers). sounds like we are doing all the changing ourselves.

[RJ Sledge]

When this thread was started it was in the form of a question.

I am sure that most S and SS racers want to continue with what they enjoy. I was just thinking about some ways that we as racers could help.

Kyle and I were thinking about what could be done by the racers themselves to help improve our (S and SS) position. Maybe NHRA does not need any help from us. I believe anything that can be done to improve attendance, while emphasizing S and SS, is a plus for everyone involved.

I apoligize if anybody took my question as a statement of S and SS coming to a end. Bottom line I just want to see it continue and grow.

Problems are somethimes hard to correct, but new ideas and suggestions on the positive side are essential.

Appreciate all who responded

RJ