Junior Stock vs IHRA Pure Stock

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

It dosent matter to me anymore anyway. I find that street rodding is more fun these days but maybe not as exciting as a high RPM launch. Just pointing out how some want to keep "Upgrading" things until you have what you have in todays stock elim. Now you have cars that were never lisenced or titled for the street running in the 8's with blowers !. Todays stockers are much wilder than the S/S cars of yesterday. Now you can even have aftermarket racing seats so other than the 9 inch tire your stuck with you have the SUPER STOCK LOOK of today.
Best way to go about it would be to contact IHRA's Mike Baker and get a list of pure stockers that have maintained their membership and car number the last few years and take a vote on who and how many want to up grade. Present it to Mike Baker and see how it goes. When I was racing Jr. stock until 1972 and later in S/S I found the elec waterpump drive to be worth a min of .10 to .12 after they were allowed on my 7200 RPM S/S (late 70's era) Chevy small block. Of course in todays S/S the same combo turns in excess of 9000 RPM due to "UpGrading. The higher the RPM range the more you gain due to the amount of HP required to turn the pump and push the water. That was with a water pump that had every other vane ground off to cut the resistance. You still need to have the specs for spring pressures, duration and overlap on the later combos which IHRA does not have for most if the class is to be what its supposed to be plus the knowledgeable tech crew required to check a cam and spring pressures at open and closed heights. Best way out is to eliminate the pure stocks all together and make them all "stockers". To much cheating going on anyway and not enough people to keep track of whats going on. Thats how the any torque converter and reground cams came to be in factory stock (or pure stock as its now called). Converters could be made by competent manufactures to make them do whatever was needed. It was hell checking the OEM cam shaft in some combos. Not enough hours in a week much less on a Friday or Sat, evening. Been there and done that.

But you are kind of making my point.
AND I will talk to Mike Baker he is a thoughtful person.

A while back made a suggestion about Certified Cams and Springs and Engines to simpify Tear down.

Suggested a roving Tear Down Specialist go to specific meeting places to Seal and Certifiy cars as legal.

This would improve race day efficiencies and more people would be modivated to set national records.
Mine got burried but still aiming to make one.

FWIW I drive not tow my car to all the races.
It is Street Legal and sometimes passes emmisions.
Have to retune it but it will pass with the Bullet PS Cam.
Yeah it does have a Yank converter with Lock up.
In fact with street radials, using Belsteins it makes a great Autocross car.

In that sense I am meeting the concept of a Street can become racer.
Cost are lower than most racer, mileage near 20mpg, small foot print at the racetrack, do have to be fit to change tires.
The trunk is so big I can carry everything I need to race.

I get the fact that Stock is a bigger tire, valve trane and cam to Super Stock.
The fact that prepared Factory Hotrods can be bought race ready again, except this time it is not a (wink wink) hidden secret.

I think IHRA has thoughtfully considered what Stock today should be.
Like the fact you can put a V8 in a Vega or Maverick.
Smart moves to expand the base of cars over the more popular cars like Camaro and Mustangs.

I wrote a full page opinion in Super Stock Drag Illustrated way back when about Stock and updating the class for the future.

Interesting IHRA probably already thinking in that direction did 90% of what I suggested.

Dan


BTW I thank you for opinion you are giving me valid feedback.

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by brent flynn

this is my rig... Got about 4000.00 in the truck... Gave 2000.00 for the trailer in 2003.... They serve me well... I have generators and awnings....what more does a guy need? Hehe...also, a 4 person tent!:d
Attachment 14473
Attachment 14474

nice !!

[X-TECH MAN]

Good luck Dan. ANYTHING that would make more racers jump in with both feet would be a help. Factory stock or Pure stock has been pretty dead after all that was done in the years past to satisfy the players. Nothing much seemed to help bring in more entries. Like the idea of certified cams as tear down for a cam check is a pain in the butt.

[ALMACK]

Originally Posted by brent flynn

this is my rig... got about 4000.00 in the truck... gave 2000.00 for the trailer in 2003.... They serve me well... i have generators and awnings....what more does a guy need? hehe...also, a 4 person tent!
Attachment 14473
Attachment 14474

Nice looking rig Brent !

I've always liked that body style Chevy Duallie.

Here's my outfit for next year for the 2-3 day events.
Paid 2500 for the truck and 3500 for the lightweight slide-in camper.

[skills]

Hello X-tech welcome back.......I am a fan but I like this idea of pure stock. How about a street stock for division level based on the legal street races they have on Friday nights. Car has to be street legal to state laws just a dial in so you won't have to have major teardown and inspections. That may bring in the younger car crowd and older guys that don't want to chase the major races.

[brent flynn]

Originally Posted by ALMACK

Nice looking rig Brent !

I've always liked that body style Chevy Duallie.

Here's my outfit for next year for the 2-3 day events.
Paid 2500 for the truck and 3500 for the lightweight slide-in camper.

Cool! i wont lie... i do want a covered trailer, but, its not really in the budget right now... Gettin started on my 400 stocker combo is gonna cost some bucks, so the trailer will have to wait. Maybe in a year or two,,, i dont want any payments, so it'll make it easier to make it to some points meets. Im hoping to start in 2014, and run 2 or 3 of them. As long as i run under the index .4 or .5, i will make a few of them. I cant wait... i know stock is kinda screwed up, but, im gonna try to live the dream my own way...

[brent flynn]

Originally Posted by Dan Fahey

nice !!

THanks Dan!

[Dan Fahey]

Originally Posted by skills

Hello X-tech welcome back.......I am a fan but I like this idea of pure stock. How about a street stock for division level based on the legal street races they have on Friday nights. Car has to be street legal to state laws just a dial in so you won't have to have major teardown and inspections. That may bring in the younger car crowd and older guys that don't want to chase the major races.

Well for the most part that is what Pure Stock is!
Just think IHRA needs new blood and should consider adding European and Asian built cars to the mix.
Considering the volume of these vehicles sold.

Toyota trucks have a US like OHV engine in their trucks.
Be cool if the offered it in one of their RWD sedans.

It was be a good launching point and bring more cars to the races.
May spurn a more local Stock racing.

Getting any car prepared should take a few mods to run near the index.
Not suppose to be so easy as to buy a car and then go to the races and be competive.

Heck every car maker already has a Bolt On Mods market.
Which is the nature of Pure Stock.
Sure would bolster the aftermarket to meet this new demand.

Kind of like X-Mans idea of the Factory Stock concept vs Pure Stock.
Just somehow think that PS is the wrong term to use....
Hense going back to the Junior Stock term..
Factory Stock seems to me a better fit.

The thing is that if IHRA wants to compete for Drag Racing space they need to think how to attract racers away from NHRA.
Or attract racers that NHRA ignores and without creating another class.

Simplification of the Tear Down process is key.
NHRA makes it draconian.
Certification and Verification of Parts.
Go back to Street Gasoline, eliminate having to store race gas.
If you want to set a record..ok use the Race gas.

Make racing more fun...instead of a drudgery.

Dan

[Robert Swartz]

Originally Posted by Dan Fahey

Well for the most part that is what Pure Stock is!
Just think IHRA needs new blood and should consider adding European and Asian built cars to the mix.
Considering the volume of these vehicles sold.

Toyota trucks have a US like OHV engine in their trucks.
Be cool if the offered it in one of their RWD sedans.

It was be a good launching point and bring more cars to the races.
May spurn a more local Stock racing.

Getting any car prepared should take a few mods to run near the index.
Not suppose to be so easy as to buy a car and then go to the races and be competive.

Heck every car maker already has a Bolt On Mods market.
Which is the nature of Pure Stock.
Sure would bolster the aftermarket to meet this new demand.

Kind of like X-Mans idea of the Factory Stock concept vs Pure Stock.
Just somehow think that PS is the wrong term to use....
Hense going back to the Junior Stock term..
Factory Stock seems to me a better fit.

The thing is that if IHRA wants to compete for Drag Racing space they need to think how to attract racers away from NHRA.
Or attract racers that NHRA ignores and without creating another class.

Simplification of the Tear Down process is key.
NHRA makes it draconian.
Certification and Verification of Parts.
Go back to Street Gasoline, eliminate having to store race gas.
If you want to set a record..ok use the Race gas.

Make racing more fun...instead of a drudgery.

Dan

Dan,

Just a couple thoughts here.

First you would need to expand the class or add more weight breaks. That was my original intent with our FWD Olds, it misses the lowest weight break. The class needs to encompass the same weight breaks "Stock" has to allow the broadest range of participation.

Next would be to look at the current rules and determine what changes could be made that would make sense from not only a cost perspective but a common sense perspective as well. I'd personally like to see the muffler rule "with headers", done away with. Unless the intent with this is to be a street car driven to the track class?

I like the concept of Pure Stock. Just like regular "Stock", it favors the faster RWD cars.

[cicero819]

Originally Posted by ALMACK

Nice looking rig Brent !

I've always liked that body style Chevy Duallie.

Here's my outfit for next year for the 2-3 day events.
Paid 2500 for the truck and 3500 for the lightweight slide-in camper.

Did you have a gun to the guy's temple? I want you shopping for me! Great looking rig. CR