Class At Indy

[Ed Wright]

Originally Posted by Jeff Teuton

9 AH, 12 A/SA, and 9 B/SA

Going to be good to watch.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

Going to be good to watch.

Only if the accually race instead of playing games !

[Jeff Teuton]

The competitors have been playing games since Chris landed in Santo Domingo. The current AHFS probably encourages more game playing say than 10 or so years ago, but that is the system we have. The current has difinitive numbers that can be manipulated easier than a system based on averages; i e eliminator average, combo average, class average or a combinatiion of. Averages make the system a moving target which it should be because both S & SS are dynamic eliminators, not static numbers. Combining averages (half season based on a few years or when the combo was hit last) and static (numbers that don't move) numbers (again the .850 and the rest 1.00, 1.20, 1.25 etc) don't mix well, sorta like Cherios and Buttermilk By the way, Chris was Christopher Columbus for the non-history fans. Too much coffee this morning.

[Ed Fernandez]

Originally Posted by Jeff Teuton

The competitors have been playing games since Chris landed in Santo Domingo. The current AHFS probably encourages more game playing say than 10 or so years ago, but that is the system we have. The current has difinitive numbers that can be manipulated easier than a system based on averages; i e eliminator average, combo average, class average or a combinatiion of. Averages make the system a moving target which it should be because both S & SS are dynamic eliminators, not static numbers. Combining averages (half season based on a few years or when the combo was hit last) and static (numbers that don't move) numbers (again the .850 and the rest 1.00, 1.20, 1.25 etc) don't mix well, sorta like Cherios and Buttermilk By the way, Chris was Christopher Columbus for the non-history fans. Too much coffee this morning.

Jeez Jeff,you know Chris?You're older than I thought.
BTW did you get the package?

[Larry Hill]

My horse got scratched from the A/SA race as of tomorrow's 15 Hp. The only new Ford left will be the Super Stock 428, you know 14.24 compression, .850 lift, solid rollers, Nascar intake, 1000 CFM throttle body, at 375 Hp.

Its corruption at the top, the tech. dept. knows its way wrong, they are doing what they are told.

[Casey Miles]

I have a question about how these piece meal motors from Ford and Mopar are getting put into Stock? Are they crate motors? If so why are they in stock? I spoke to a friend of mine ( which are few) and he told me that the 352 Ford engine isn't anything you car get as a whole, you have to buy the parts and put it together. I know that there was question about the Shelby cars, but if what my friend is correct, the Shelby cars are no big deal. Stock may as well be call Modified product. If you think about it, Stock is allow exotic materials (Shubeck lifters) Pro Stock is not, just about any transmission along with rear ends and it seems any motor combo that the factories can think of now.
I try to keep my car close to stock and it's a far cry from what's going on now. If the factories want to through engines into stock, NHRA should put them at least 1.25 HP per cubic inch rather then some make believe HP that the factory says it is. NHRA should support Stock as Stock and force the factories to build the cars as production cars, not just 50 of them, if they build that many. Stock has been an Eliminator class now for over 37 years and now it's changing with no reguard for where it came from. Stock were cars in sheep's clothing running like wolfs, now it just wolfs!

Casey Miles
248H Stock

[Andrew Hill]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

I have a question about how these piece meal motors from Ford and Mopar are getting put into Stock? Are they crate motors? If so why are they in stock? I spoke to a friend of mine ( which are few) and he told me that the 352 Ford engine isn't anything you car get as a whole, you have to buy the parts and put it together. I know that there was question about the Shelby cars, but if what my friend is correct, the Shelby cars are no big deal. Stock may as well be call Modified product. If you think about it, Stock is allow exotic materials (Shubeck lifters) Pro Stock is not, just about any transmission along with rear ends and it seems any motor combo that the factories can think of now.
I try to keep my car close to stock and it's a far cry from what's going on now. If the factories want to through engines into stock, NHRA should put them at least 1.25 HP per cubic inch rather then some make believe HP that the factory says it is. NHRA should support Stock as Stock and force the factories to build the cars as production cars, not just 50 of them, if they build that many. Stock has been an Eliminator class now for over 37 years and now it's changing with no reguard for where it came from. Stock were cars in sheep's clothing running like wolfs, now it just wolfs!

Casey Miles
248H Stock

That's why these new cars are so ridiculous. They are purpose built race motors from a performance parts catalog with bogus HP factors. Nothing Stock about it.

[dwydendorf]

Originally Posted by Casey Miles

I have a question about how these piece meal motors from Ford and Mopar are getting put into Stock? Are they crate motors? If so why are they in stock? I spoke to a friend of mine ( which are few) and he told me that the 352 Ford engine isn't anything you car get as a whole, you have to buy the parts and put it together. I know that there was question about the Shelby cars, but if what my friend is correct, the Shelby cars are no big deal. Stock may as well be call Modified product. If you think about it, Stock is allow exotic materials (Shubeck lifters) Pro Stock is not, just about any transmission along with rear ends and it seems any motor combo that the factories can think of now.
I try to keep my car close to stock and it's a far cry from what's going on now. If the factories want to through engines into stock, NHRA should put them at least 1.25 HP per cubic inch rather then some make believe HP that the factory says it is. NHRA should support Stock as Stock and force the factories to build the cars as production cars, not just 50 of them, if they build that many. Stock has been an Eliminator class now for over 37 years and now it's changing with no reguard for where it came from. Stock were cars in sheep's clothing running like wolfs, now it just wolfs!

Casey Miles
248H Stock

When I started going to the Drags in 1970 Stock wasn't Stock back then. I am really sorry that Stock doesn't fit everyones idea of what Stock shoud be. Everyone that thinks the new factory combos that are different than the old combos in stock need to get over it. Back in the early 70's you could run cheater slicks,headers. cheater cams, and aftermarket pistons. These were hardly items available on factory built cars back then and yet some people continue to whine about the new factory combinations. Maybe you guys should run an IHRA pure stocker, as it may be more in tune of what you think Stock should be. I know NHRA went to a Pure Stock format in the early 1970's that has evolved into stock today but there is nothing about Stock that is Pure Stock even before the new factory combinations came into Stock.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by dwydendorf

When I started going to the Drags in 1970 Stock wasn't Stock back then. I am really sorry that Stock doesn't fit everyones idea of what Stock shoud be. Everyone that thinks the new factory combos that are different than the old combos in stock need to get over it. Back in the early 70's you could run cheater slicks,headers. cheater cams, and aftermarket pistons. These were hardly items available on factory built cars back then and yet some people continue to whine about the new factory combinations. Maybe you guys should run an IHRA pure stocker, as it may be more in tune of what you think Stock should be. I know NHRA went to a Pure Stock format in the early 1970's that has evolved into stock today but there is nothing about Stock that is Pure Stock even before the new factory combinations came into Stock.

You just dont get it. it has NOTHING to about the fact that they are new cars with FI, computers, etc. and use aftermarket parts like every other stocker or S/S car on the planet. Its the frigging HORSE POWER RATINGS that bogus or in plain english....screwed up !

[Casey Miles]

Originally Posted by dwydendorf

When I started going to the Drags in 1970 Stock wasn't Stock back then. I am really sorry that Stock doesn't fit everyones idea of what Stock shoud be. Everyone that thinks the new factory combos that are different than the old combos in stock need to get over it. Back in the early 70's you could run cheater slicks,headers. cheater cams, and aftermarket pistons. These were hardly items available on factory built cars back then and yet some people continue to whine about the new factory combinations. Maybe you guys should run an IHRA pure stocker, as it may be more in tune of what you think Stock should be. I know NHRA went to a Pure Stock format in the early 1970's that has evolved into stock today but there is nothing about Stock that is Pure Stock even before the new factory combinations came into Stock.

Sorry but you are wrong, when NHRA started Stock after Jr. Stock, about 1973, you had to have all the stock parts, except the cheater cam because they had no way of checking the cam. Stock got bastardized as people complained that they couldn't run the stock parts without breakage.

BTW, here is the rating for the Viper V-10 engine for sale in the real world:
510 cu in (8.4 L)[9] V10
600 bhp (450 kW) @ 6000 rpm
560 lb·ft (760 N·m) @ 5600 rpm
This is what we are talking about, the bogus rating of the engines. I'm sure that this engine has to run on unleaded fuel since it's street driven, the race engine doesn't which means more compression the the street version. NHRA rates the V-10 @ 456 HP, aren't we missing something like at least 150 HP. This is what is pissing peolpe who run Stock for so many years. You can't compete against the pen and "A"holes who write with it.

Casey Miles
248H Stock?