Crate Engines in NHRA?

[Hagen Gary]

Originally Posted by Chad Rhodes

first off your buddy made the disparaging comment about "you guys are half retarded", so go beat on him for lowering the bar.

Second off, the first thing I bolded is what class racing is all about. The second thing I bolded sounds like it came straight out of a bracket racer's mouth (not that there is anything wrong with that). About the third thing I bolded.........you have to look at NHRA national event sportsman class structure as two different ladders to the top. One one side, from bottom up, is super street, super gas, super comp, and top sportsman. These classes most often lead to the alcohol classes, pro mod, and the fuel classes (ala Shawn Langdon, the Force Girls, and others). The other side is stock, SS, and Comp. This side most often leads to Pro Stock at the top (stanfield, Brogdon, Kent, etc). Stock and SuperStreet would both be at the bottom rung on their respective sides, but the mindset is totally different on either side. Super Street is truly the entry level class here, and NHRA even states it. Class racing, on the other side is performance based and is about things like knowing the in's and out's of a motor, trans, etc and yes even things like that different carb base that's worth .004. If that's not what interests you, and you don't have the knack for it, maybe the other side of that "ladder" would be better for you.

I'm not trying to bash you, or suggest that you aren't cut out for class racing, but some of your own posts raise those questions. I'm also not saying that one side of the class structure is lesser than the other, or that they are mutually exclusive. There are lost of racers that excel at both. But they do require a different mentality and skill set. "going mid 11's for the least amount of money possible" doesn't sound like the class racer mentality. "going 1.00 under the index for the least amount possible" does, whether it be V/S, AF/S or A/SA

I don't know how you can argue with that. Good post Chad. Keep CM in IHRA. Lord knows we need the car count. I'm with ED on this too. The lack of parts in your area is no excuse for limiting yourself to one sanctioning body. I guess I just assumed that most CM cars are mostly bracket racers who run the IHRA races when they come in the area. I had no idea they actually wanted NHRA to change the rules for them. NHRA doesn't want older cars. Why would they give people a way to make them competitive again by adding whatever combination you want?

[Chris1529]

[QUOTE=Hagen Gary;248490] I guess I just assumed that most CM cars are mostly bracket racers who run the IHRA races when they come in the area.


I think that is a rediculous comment. I think if you look a little closer, you see there are many well built IHRA crate motor cars. There is alot of difference between the preparation for a nice class racing car than there is for a weekend bracket car. I don't agree with all the combinations of crate motors and rules that are out there, but if factored properly, there should be no problem running them as the basic premise is the same.

[Mark Yacavone]

My thoughts on this are pretty simple.

I like to look at a S/SS car and have an idea what engine combination might be in it
That's part of the allure and interest I have in those classes ...Always been that way.

Crate motors just don't do that for me. Too close to Bracket Two for a traditional guy like me. I feel the same way, to a lesser extent, about GT / Super Stock..... and definitely that way about Nascar.

As far as changing NHRA rules to accommodate your favorite car you drove back in high school...That's not the way it works in Stock Eliminator.

You build yourself a car that fits into the existing rules structure.
Seems simple enough to me...

How many you want?


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/2272813283.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/2250438196.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/cto/2284359294.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/cto/2212685293.html


Don't want to leave out the Blue Oval bunch:

Here you go. Runs P/SA or the bottom Pure Stock class in IHRA

http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/ctd/2260965401.html

[CrateCamaro]

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

My thoughts on this are pretty simple.

I like to look at a S/SS car and have an idea what engine combination might be in it
That's part of the allure and interest I have in those classes ...Always been that way.

Crate motors just don't do that for me. Too close to Bracket Two for a traditional guy like me. I feel the same way, to a lesser extent, about GT / Super Stock..... and definitely that way about Nascar.

As far as changing NHRA rules to accommodate your favorite car you drove back in high school...That's not the way it works in Stock Eliminator.

You build yourself a car that fits into the existing rules structure.
Seems simple enough to me...

How many you want?


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/2272813283.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/2250438196.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/cto/2284359294.html


http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/cto/2212685293.html


Don't want to leave out the Blue Oval bunch:

Here you go. Runs P/SA or the bottom Pure Stock class in IHRA

http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/ctd/2260965401.html

Ok I get it now...build a whole new combo and then its ok to run NHRA stock. Id rather not quote any of your posts because I have been in the internet war with you before and really its all verbal diarea as far as im concerned. Its ok to allow VW's into superstock, its ok for the new mustangs to have a blower and run at half of thier potential, its ok for the new chalenger to have an intake big enough for a top fuel car and apparently its now ok for a CRATE ENGINE 352 and 428 cube engine to run in the new mustang...????

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by CrateCamaro

Ok I get it now...build a whole new combo and then its ok to run NHRA stock. Id rather not quote any of your posts because I have been in the internet war with you before and really its all verbal diarea as far as im concerned. Its ok to allow VW's into superstock, its ok for the new mustangs to have a blower and run at half of thier potential, its ok for the new chalenger to have an intake big enough for a top fuel car and apparently its now ok for a CRATE ENGINE 352 and 428 cube engine to run in the new mustang...????

See, here is what you don't seem to grasp. NO, it is NOT okay for any of those things to happen. Not at all. It has been FORCED upon us by NHRA, we never wanted it, we never said it was okay. So your argument that since that stuff is okay, then crate motors should be okay, doesn't hold water, not even a drop. NONE of it was okay with the vast majority of racers, it is just okay with NHRA, Ford, and Chrysler. So you expect us to say that, since NHRA has already screwed us, again, and screwed up the class, we will be just overjoyed to let them add something else that we don't want. That's a pretty ludicrous expectation. It's like telling a rape victim that, since she's already been raped, she should be okay with three or four more to step up and take their turn, too.

Let me spell it out for you, so you can grasp it. No, the things that you listed were NOT okay with the racers, and no, adding crate motors on top of all of the other things we did not want, is not okay.

Can you grasp it now?

In case you don't get it, the vast majority of NHRA class racers are sick of having things forced upon them, from higher fees for everything, to absurd schedules, reduced contingency payouts, stagnant purses, and the new underfactored cars. So don't expect them to want to have your crate motor program forced upon them., either. There's a reason car counts are down, and local grass roots combo programs are springing up. The racers are fed up.

[Hagen Gary]

Originally Posted by CrateCamaro

Ok I get it now...build a whole new combo and then its ok to run NHRA stock. Id rather not quote any of your posts because I have been in the internet war with you before and really its all verbal diarea as far as im concerned. Its ok to allow VW's into superstock, its ok for the new mustangs to have a blower and run at half of thier potential, its ok for the new chalenger to have an intake big enough for a top fuel car and apparently its now ok for a CRATE ENGINE 352 and 428 cube engine to run in the new mustang...????

Yes, Its ok to run a VW in SS, but in case you havent been reading the message board. It isn't ok with the majority of people to allow Ford and Dodge to scheme the system by putting cars in the guide that were never produced. Same goes for your Crate. You built it knowing well and good that NHRA doesn't want you, now you want in. You keep making reference to old guys needing to give it up, but I bet I'm younger than you and I get that the basis of STOCK (Not bracket II) is that it was once a car that was available off the show room floor. I might not know what car came with what, but it sure intrest me to find out when I see it at the races. I walk right by a CM. I guess I didn't grow up thinking that everyone gets a trophy and rules should be changed to accommodate an outcast.

[Jeremy1374]

Originally Posted by Hagen Gary

You keep making reference to old guys needing to give it up, but I bet I'm younger than you and I get that the basis of STOCK (Not bracket II) is that it was once a car that was available off the show room floor. I might not know what car came with what, but it sure intrest me to find out when I see it at the races. I walk right by a CM. I guess I didn't grow up thinking that everyone gets a trophy and rules should be changed to accommodate an outcast.

not one stocker came off the showroom floor and ran low 11s high 10s etc. If you think you can slap a CM car together and be competitive, go for it. Mike gave a pretty good example of the differences between a CM and a "real" stocker. To ad to that you still have rules and regs to live by. It's not bracket 2 as you refer to. No 9" fords in any GM CM car. Now I do agree that the CM cars should have a engine combo that is close to what was avail in that body style. IE 350 in camaro etc. But for you NHRA elitists that turn your nose down at these cars stop and take a min to look at one and see what they are all about. Bash on

[Hagen Gary]

Originally Posted by Jeremy1374

not one stocker came off the showroom floor and ran low 11s high 10s etc. If you think you can slap a CM car together and be competitive, go for it. Mike gave a pretty good example of the differences between a CM and a "real" stocker. To ad to that you still have rules and regs to live by. It's not bracket 2 as you refer to. No 9" fords in any GM CM car. Now I do agree that the CM cars should have a engine combo that is close to what was avail in that body style. IE 350 in camaro etc. But for you NHRA elitists that turn your nose down at these cars stop and take a min to look at one and see what they are all about. Bash on

I don't think I ever implied that these cars were running 10's off the showroom floor. Only that they were available with the engine/trans combo that is in the race car that runs 10's with stock parts. Thats the difference between a real stocker and a bracket car. Stock is part muscle car show, and should stay that way. Throwing whatever engine you please into whatever body you have is a bracket car, no matter how nice its built.

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by CrateCamaro

Ok I get it now...build a whole new combo and then its ok to run NHRA stock. Id rather not quote any of your posts because I have been in the internet war with you before and really its all verbal diarea as far as im concerned. Its ok to allow VW's into superstock, its ok for the new mustangs to have a blower and run at half of thier potential, its ok for the new chalenger to have an intake big enough for a top fuel car and apparently its now ok for a CRATE ENGINE 352 and 428 cube engine to run in the new mustang...????

1, Yes ,now you've got it.

2, If you DID want to get into an internet war with me, you'd have to read,write and spell past a 4th grade level.

3, VW's belong in Modified Eliminator, along with the rest of the hood scoop cars, if you want my opinion.

4, Blower, Turbos are fine with me if they came with the car in sufficient quantities and are rated properly.
If you think I'm in favor of Crate Motors of any kind in Stock, you've got the wrong guy.

[goinbroke2]

Wow, whole lot of animosity here.

1) Chipper if you can't find the parts (I'm in Elmsdale, i agree there are no parts around here...anywhere!) then either get them sent up from the states or build something new enough that the junkyards do have it. Run Class in the Miramichi or greenfield, Sydney or travel to an IHRA track in the states.

2) Crate motors still have all the spec's to follow that stockers do, just different rules/spec's.

3) NHRA will never add crate motors so what's the argument about?

4) I'm from Canada and would take offence to some of the stuff posted but I know it's in the "heat of posting". Don't even start with the "we beat you" or we'll come down and burn down the whitehouse again LOL!
This is a classracing site, relax on the politics.