A/SA First in the 9.80's

[Dave Ficacci]

Originally Posted by Mike Mans

I totally understand what you're point is by getting beat by them - but look at how you got to this point. You are racing a 1969 Camaro. A 41 year old car that has had 41 years of horsepower added to it. It's been beaten up. I didn't do it, you probably didn't even do it - but your cars have taken a significant beating with time.

Beaten up or not, it's still a good combination. The combination was capable of running with any other AA A or B car in the country. That was taken away when these new cars arrived. It didnt take 41 years to get here, it took one piece of paper when someone wrote down 425 for the CJ and 390 for the DP.

Unfortunately the odds of power being taken off are slim to none. The factory race cars are brand new with factory support. They are trying to encourage people to build new race cars and have gotten horsepower factors approved at a certain number (you would know better than I) that may be lower than actually produced. But I guarantee you that in 1969 a 427 properly built in stock was "underrated." If Ford and Chrysler came out with a new Drag Pak and Cobra Jet cars with 500hp factors, nobody in their right mind would build one!

You are correct, a 500hp rating would be too high and no one would build it, but 425 is a joke... Ok, I understand they had to start somewhere. They proved the 425 rating was ridiculous last year, and yet they rate the 2010 at 425 again!

If you remember back to when the 93+Firebirds/Camaros came out, this was the exact same problem. But now, they are on a pretty even plane with the rest of you guys - the system is slow I will give you that. But it does eventually work itself out.

It took 15 years for it to work out. You would think they would have learned from their mistakes. Maybe they will add HP to these cars more aggressively. Only time will tell..but for now, this blows.

I hate losing in heads up races, and fortunately we were able to get into a class where as you've said - I don't run into heads up situations very often. But I assure you, we spend hundreds of hours a year making our car faster and building horsepower just in case we do find ourselves in that position. I know firsthand how much this stuff costs, we build all of our own motors and never stop trying new things. It's not easy.

No one said it was easy, nor did I say you didn't work hard. This is probably a lame comparison, but imagine NHRA came out and said, SS/BS cars and CS cars are now combined, but the BS cars only have to add 100 lbs to fit the new class. With the swipe of the pen your "fast" car is now mid pack. How would you like to hear from someone not in your class to tell you to "work on your stuff."

I know it's a slightly different case, but a prime example is Jim Daniels. Ray Barton and those guys have breathed Hemi engines since their inception, but in the last year or two they've SIGNIFICANTLY picked up their program and are running TENTHS faster than they ever have. It can be done. I know it's time and money which we are all struggling to keep up with, but if you are set to run your 60's/70's muscle car - you're pockets have to get deeper. You are competing with teams of engineers at Ford and Mopar whose sole purpose is building efficient engines that crank out huge horsepower.

Comparing SS/AH to stock is apples and oranges. Without custom heads and manifolds, picking up tenths (legally) in stock, doesn't happen.

At the end of the day, there is always going to be a "better combination" and a guy with more money or time to put into it than what most have got. It sucks, but it's all part of the Stock / Super Stock classes and it hasn't changed.

Absolutely true, but a "better combination" shouldn't be 3 tenths in front of everyone else out of the box. That's a "soft combination" that will only get faster once these guys start sorting them out.

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[442OLDS]

Without custom heads and manifolds, picking up tenths (legally) in stock, doesn't happen.


VERY WELL SAID!


Maybe there is a "hidden" agenda here.All of the rules for the NHRA UNLEASHED PROGRAM are listed here:

http://www.nhra.com/userfiles/file/u...0Unleashed.pdf


They all seem to allow NOS..........Hint!

[Floyd Gomez]

The hardest part for me to swallow is reading the rule book and knowing how limited I am to building my combo. I can't buy a crate motor built for racing because it is not legal for Stock in NHRA. I fell if NHRA wants to let these cars in stock they need to allow older combo's access to new technology. The rules clearly state "No polising, Porting, or coating of the intake or heads" but today it is standard technology from the manufacturer. Let us run newer parts and combo's so we can catch up or design another class in stock like IHRA did for purpose factory race cars. Just my .02 worth

[Ken Keir]

Originally Posted by Dave Ficacci

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Dave I agree with you completely. Adam loves stock and superstock racing but most of all he likes heads up class racing. We are working to make our car faster but adam also knows that we are way behind the new cars. When we race a car heads up we would like to think that we have a fare chance.

Ken Keir
A/SA 1470

[SS Engine Guy]

Just to be clear, I am in favor of any and all technology that goes into the new stuff just as I am in favor of new technology and equipment in my shop. You stay current or you get behind. My statement had more to do with making a combo a killer or a loser with the stroke of a pen. I don't like the idea of years and hundreds of thousands of dollars of mine and my customers money being tossed away because some bean counter thinks he can make a few brownie points. And that is what tech is becoming......bean counters.

On another note, I truely admire Chris and his Dad's desire to do most of the work on their cars. That is where hot rodding came from before the days of the mail order catalog. Also an imtimate knowledge of everything in your powerplant is extremely important and you only get that from doing it. Once you understand what works and what dosen't, only then can you make progress. The only way to get that understanding is by doing it.

[Chris "drooze" Wertman]

Originally Posted by SS Engine Guy

I truely admire Chris and his Dad's desire to do most of the work on their cars. That is where hot rodding came from before the days of the mail order catalog. Also an imtimate knowledge of everything in your powerplant is extremely important and you only get that from doing it. Once you understand what works and what dosen't, only then can you make progress. The only way to get that understanding is by doing it.

Thanks, I needed and appreciate that.....were finishing up the put together after some parts issues hinked us for 3 days....I found a solution today.....but beware the new Indy Timing Chains with the flat roller bearing for the 5.7 and 6.1 they dont fit right...the bearing pack is too thick....tried it both ways and its a damm good thing I had my old one...