We're Evolving!

GUMP · 01-06-2010, 12:02 PM

One good move that the NHRA has made in the new rule book is the runner C. C. rule for stock. It at least gives a little hope that it won't go over to crate motors.

Paul Merolla · 01-06-2010, 12:21 PM

Billy, first off I'll say thank you for all your recent posts - it's putting some life back in this board...along with Evan's excellent replies. Even though I have yet to hit the track in Stock (this year, God willing) I have some thoughts on this topic of evolution. I consider myself to be part of the "we need more tech" crowd; I'm curious as to the mindset of the current crop of class racers... i.e. what percent want more tech, less tech, etc. My hunch is that most racers would be in favor of more stringent enforcement of our rules, and even-handed application of them across the board. That being said, we all know NHRA doesn't appear to be heading in that direction - whether it's a financial reason or otherwise. So - what could those of us that care about these classes do to further our agenda as far as tech goes? All we usually hear is, "These classes are dead, NHRA is killing us off, I quit, etc." Well, the way I see it is, if enough people are dedicated to this sickness, then we should be able to do something to preserve it and not just let everything "happen" to us. How bout some positive ideas...whether it involves NHRA or not. I know organizing racers is like herding cats, but throwing your hands up is chicken dookie if you ask me. I'll start....what if we really got behind AHRA? I know there are a thousand negatives, but it's essentially a clean slate - racer friendly, same rules as NHRA, not run by bean counting A-holes. Let 'er rip! Flame ON!

X-TECH MAN · 01-06-2010, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Merolla

Billy, first off I'll say thank you for all your recent posts - it's putting some life back in this board...along with Evan's excellent replies. Even though I have yet to hit the track in Stock (this year, God willing) I have some thoughts on this topic of evolution. I consider myself to be part of the "we need more tech" crowd; I'm curious as to the mindset of the current crop of class racers... i.e. what percent want more tech, less tech, etc. My hunch is that most racers would be in favor of more stringent enforcement of our rules, and even-handed application of them across the board. That being said, we all know NHRA doesn't appear to be heading in that direction - whether it's a financial reason or otherwise. So - what could those of us that care about these classes do to further our agenda as far as tech goes? All we usually hear is, "These classes are dead, NHRA is killing us off, I quit, etc." Well, the way I see it is, if enough people are dedicated to this sickness, then we should be able to do something to preserve it and not just let everything "happen" to us. How bout some positive ideas...whether it involves NHRA or not. I know organizing racers is like herding cats, but throwing your hands up is chicken dookie if you ask me. I'll start....what if we really got behind AHRA? I know there are a thousand negatives, but it's essentially a clean slate - racer friendly, same rules as NHRA, not run by bean counting A-holes. Let 'er rip! Flame ON!

Problem is....unless it has to do with NHRA most on here dont give a rats butt. You know as well as I do the purse could be a $1,000,000 and there are guys who wouldnt run anything else but NHRA if it was in their back yard because of their ego's.

Paul Merolla · 01-06-2010, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X-TECH MAN

Problem is....unless it has to do with NHRA most on here dont give a rats butt. You know as well as I do the purse could be a $1,000,000 and there are guys who wouldnt run anything else but NHRA if it was in their back yard because of their ego's.

OK, so how can we force a change in NHRA? NOTE: The question is NOT, "Why will NHRA never change?"

Bobby Zlatkin · 01-06-2010, 03:17 PM

About two years ago when there was talk of a 'for profit' corporation buying the professional side of the NHRA only and not the sportsman side, it seemed to everyone that would be a terrible thing. In retrospect, it probably would have been a good thing.

Let's face it, the only thing the professional and the sportsman drag racers have in common is the venue. The race track. Other than that, our interests are different. We' re not doing this for a living (well, the most of us), We're doing it for fun.

Maybe if the two had been seperated, and the sportsman side remained 'not for profit', still belonging to it's members, we could control our own destiny.

That's why I believe sports national events are much more fun for a sportsman racer than national events where we suck hind teat.

We could still have Indy as the premier event. Just a different weekend.

I never could understand how our organization got sold out from under us. Instead of the organization being our adversary, it should represent the wants of the majority.

Billy Nees · 01-06-2010, 03:50 PM

Guys! Come on, we've only had 6 replies and we're already O/T to NHRA sucks and his d**k is bigger than mine!
I think that topics like this can be important! Did I say that? Woah!
Come on Terry? Where are we going ? Let's hear some real opinions about where our sport might be heading in the future. Come on, you smart guys out there! Don't make me call you out!
BTW, if you can measure your d**k by the horsepower you're making, I've got the smallest d**k out there so don't be shy.
(no offense to anyone named D**k!)

gmonde · 01-06-2010, 04:40 PM

from my side of the fence ,there is going to be a time where it will become just a flat hood 9" tire class,,the ecoonmy in the state thats its in,people loosing jobs on a daily basis ,people will have to scale back and racing is luxury for most of us and the car counts will be down ,pay outs will be lower than they already are,nhra will have no choice but to consolidate classes ,they guys running divisionals can run fast as they want ,i havent seen tear downs at divisionals(to much going on),there enough of us out there stock/super stock guys to have our own events (we do with associations but not nhra) but in todays world that will never happen,but i cant see it going a way completely ,i walk around the pits and see some of the innovation,dedication,compasion that is put to each car to get as much out of it as possible its just amazing ,,,is nhra bad ,i dont think so ,its just like any thing else in life when thing are rolling along and demand is up you build up to meet demand,now its more bussiness than doing whats best for the racers,,, a major shake up good or bad would be good ,this way the decision is clear gmonde

Robert Simpson · 01-06-2010, 05:07 PM

I believe that the ultimate goal is to have a 1-2 day race with a limited field. I see only 16-32 cars that are on a invitaion list. You qualify for the list based on how you do at the divisionals etc. A large entry fee, with a so-so payout.

Yes I believe that SS will eventually be turned into a ci/pd description with a spec carb. For example your car came with a 283 so you fit into a ci/pd that fits your weight break. You can have any heads and a spec carb. Then teck would have nothing to do but pump it and check the carb/weight/gas and they are done.

Yes I believe that Stock will gradually turn into a 9" Super Stock class. Roller rockers everyone allowed solid roller cams with the stock lift. We do not know what they have in store. But, I have been around this for years and if there are several different ways that NHRA can go on a decision, there decision will typically be the least logical one and one that usually costs the most.

When a rule is changed to "enhance" it opens up other doors that effect other things. If the rule on the lifters would have been lets say 120pds seat pressure checked on the car for all cars then you would not have the lifters, cams and valve train expense we have and the power that comes with it, then the extra HP we earn on our combo.....NHRA wants us and needs us to fill in some and to receive our money. There is no one in the high ups of NHRA who is/was a racer so they have no idea what it takes to race.

I love to race and the challenge of making my combo better. I have only raced at Divisionals and other meets and not Nationals. I can not easily get 5 days off to race a event or leave on a Wed just to get a parking spot at a divisional and more that 1 time run.

If NHRA would let there Divisional tech directors make there decisions and stand by them while having every division communicate with the other divisions it would help alot. If NHRA would just be consistent with there rules that would help alone.

I believe that the sportsman classes could be marketed in such a way that it would be very inviting to companies of all kinds. Thus helping NHRA and in turn help the racers.

Sorry Billy I got a little off subject...............

X-TECH MAN · 01-06-2010, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Guys! Come on, we've only had 6 replies and we're already O/T to NHRA sucks and his d**k is bigger than mine!
I think that topics like this can be important! Did I say that? Woah!
Come on Terry? Where are we going ? Let's hear some real opinions about where our sport might be heading in the future. Come on, you smart guys out there! Don't make me call you out!
BTW, if you can measure your d**k by the horsepower you're making, I've got the smallest d**k out there so don't be shy.
(no offense to anyone named D**k!)

What do I think? I believe Robert Simpson's post is not far off of what could be in the not so distant future. Less tech problems for the associations is a sure bet. The HP game is a joke and requires to much man power to keep up with even though there are some who would do it for nothing if allowed. As for tech (tear downs) the Marty Barretts and Greg X;s are long gone. No one wants to do it anymore or has the knowledge to keep up with it only to be over ruled. Limited fields most likely to shorten the number of days at the track and the number of hours to put on a circus like show. It may not come in a year or two but its coming like it or not. I will think more about this and post when I can be more sure of what Im saying.

Mark Yacavone · 01-06-2010, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Guys! Come on, we've only had 6 replies and we're already O/T to NHRA sucks and his d**k is bigger than mine!
I think that topics like this can be important! Did I say that? Woah!
Come on Terry? Where are we going ? Let's hear some real opinions about where our sport might be heading in the future. Come on, you smart guys out there! Don't make me call you out!
BTW, if you can measure your d**k by the horsepower you're making, I've got the smallest d**k out there so don't be shy.
(no offense to anyone named D**k!)

Billy, I just looked in my crystal ball (the one I used to predict the exact index hits), and well, I don't want to get your thread deleted or moved to the lounge, but let me say this:

I think we have a lot more to worry about in the next ten years, than what Stock Eliminator
evolves into.

01-06-2010, 12:02 PM	#1
GUMP VIP Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Shelby, NC Posts: 1,817 Likes: 2,156 Liked 2,336 Times in 549 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! One good move that the NHRA has made in the new rule book is the runner C. C. rule for stock. It at least gives a little hope that it won't go over to crate motors.

01-06-2010, 12:21 PM	#2
Paul Merolla Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Papillion, NE Posts: 610 Likes: 242 Liked 293 Times in 65 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! Billy, first off I'll say thank you for all your recent posts - it's putting some life back in this board...along with Evan's excellent replies. Even though I have yet to hit the track in Stock (this year, God willing) I have some thoughts on this topic of evolution. I consider myself to be part of the "we need more tech" crowd; I'm curious as to the mindset of the current crop of class racers... i.e. what percent want more tech, less tech, etc. My hunch is that most racers would be in favor of more stringent enforcement of our rules, and even-handed application of them across the board. That being said, we all know NHRA doesn't appear to be heading in that direction - whether it's a financial reason or otherwise. So - what could those of us that care about these classes do to further our agenda as far as tech goes? All we usually hear is, "These classes are dead, NHRA is killing us off, I quit, etc." Well, the way I see it is, if enough people are dedicated to this sickness, then we should be able to do something to preserve it and not just let everything "happen" to us. How bout some positive ideas...whether it involves NHRA or not. I know organizing racers is like herding cats, but throwing your hands up is chicken dookie if you ask me. I'll start....what if we really got behind AHRA? I know there are a thousand negatives, but it's essentially a clean slate - racer friendly, same rules as NHRA, not run by bean counting A-holes. Let 'er rip! Flame ON!

01-06-2010, 03:17 PM	#5
Bobby Zlatkin Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Mills River, NC Posts: 417 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! About two years ago when there was talk of a 'for profit' corporation buying the professional side of the NHRA only and not the sportsman side, it seemed to everyone that would be a terrible thing. In retrospect, it probably would have been a good thing. Let's face it, the only thing the professional and the sportsman drag racers have in common is the venue. The race track. Other than that, our interests are different. We' re not doing this for a living (well, the most of us), We're doing it for fun. Maybe if the two had been seperated, and the sportsman side remained 'not for profit', still belonging to it's members, we could control our own destiny. That's why I believe sports national events are much more fun for a sportsman racer than national events where we suck hind teat. We could still have Indy as the premier event. Just a different weekend. I never could understand how our organization got sold out from under us. Instead of the organization being our adversary, it should represent the wants of the majority. __________________ Bobby & Norene Zlatkin L/SA

01-06-2010, 03:50 PM	#6
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,485 Likes: 3,587 Liked 7,682 Times in 1,730 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! Guys! Come on, we've only had 6 replies and we're already O/T to NHRA sucks and his dk is bigger than mine! I think that topics like this can be important! Did I say that? Woah! Come on Terry? Where are we going ? Let's hear some real opinions about where our sport might be heading in the future. Come on, you smart guys out there! Don't make me call you out! BTW, if you can measure your dk by the horsepower you're making, I've got the smallest dk out there so don't be shy. (no offense to anyone named Dk!) __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS I'm not spending 100K to win 2K Last edited by Billy Nees; 01-06-2010 at 03:53 PM.

01-06-2010, 04:40 PM	#7
gmonde Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 615 Likes: 56 Liked 165 Times in 59 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! from my side of the fence ,there is going to be a time where it will become just a flat hood 9" tire class,,the ecoonmy in the state thats its in,people loosing jobs on a daily basis ,people will have to scale back and racing is luxury for most of us and the car counts will be down ,pay outs will be lower than they already are,nhra will have no choice but to consolidate classes ,they guys running divisionals can run fast as they want ,i havent seen tear downs at divisionals(to much going on),there enough of us out there stock/super stock guys to have our own events (we do with associations but not nhra) but in todays world that will never happen,but i cant see it going a way completely ,i walk around the pits and see some of the innovation,dedication,compasion that is put to each car to get as much out of it as possible its just amazing ,,,is nhra bad ,i dont think so ,its just like any thing else in life when thing are rolling along and demand is up you build up to meet demand,now its more bussiness than doing whats best for the racers,,, a major shake up good or bad would be good ,this way the decision is clear gmonde

01-06-2010, 05:07 PM	#8
Robert Simpson Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Jacksonville, Florida Posts: 808 Likes: 7 Liked 20 Times in 12 Posts	Re: We're Evolving! I believe that the ultimate goal is to have a 1-2 day race with a limited field. I see only 16-32 cars that are on a invitaion list. You qualify for the list based on how you do at the divisionals etc. A large entry fee, with a so-so payout. Yes I believe that SS will eventually be turned into a ci/pd description with a spec carb. For example your car came with a 283 so you fit into a ci/pd that fits your weight break. You can have any heads and a spec carb. Then teck would have nothing to do but pump it and check the carb/weight/gas and they are done. Yes I believe that Stock will gradually turn into a 9" Super Stock class. Roller rockers everyone allowed solid roller cams with the stock lift. We do not know what they have in store. But, I have been around this for years and if there are several different ways that NHRA can go on a decision, there decision will typically be the least logical one and one that usually costs the most. When a rule is changed to "enhance" it opens up other doors that effect other things. If the rule on the lifters would have been lets say 120pds seat pressure checked on the car for all cars then you would not have the lifters, cams and valve train expense we have and the power that comes with it, then the extra HP we earn on our combo.....NHRA wants us and needs us to fill in some and to receive our money. There is no one in the high ups of NHRA who is/was a racer so they have no idea what it takes to race. I love to race and the challenge of making my combo better. I have only raced at Divisionals and other meets and not Nationals. I can not easily get 5 days off to race a event or leave on a Wed just to get a parking spot at a divisional and more that 1 time run. If NHRA would let there Divisional tech directors make there decisions and stand by them while having every division communicate with the other divisions it would help alot. If NHRA would just be consistent with there rules that would help alone. I believe that the sportsman classes could be marketed in such a way that it would be very inviting to companies of all kinds. Thus helping NHRA and in turn help the racers. Sorry Billy I got a little off subject...............