Hood Scoops to Comp

david ring · 12-08-2009, 12:38 PM

I own a comp car and I'm always happy if someone wants to join us, but I don't think NHRA should force the hood scopp folks in.

As for the expense of comp versus SS-I can afford a 4 cylinder Bantum altered and am partners with the engine builder in the project, so that is what makes comp affordable for me. But one of those SS/?S or SS/?M hood scoop cars built by East Texas or B and B is way out of my price range, to say nothing of what a hemi car costs. I'm not sure that there is any car in drag racing that costs as much to build as a hemi, except aybe what it costs to build an engine shop for pro stock and that seems to be the way to go in that class these days.

And Mike Carr-your explanation was quite good-only one error

-.65.to -.699 = .05

that should be -.650 to -.709 = .05

So you only get an A-.

Jack McCarthy · 12-08-2009, 12:47 PM

my 2 cents...

the fastest car in any handicap eliminator has a huge advantage due to two factors.
one first redlight rule (nhra will never change it to be fair)
two driving the finish line is mucho easier (not nhra's fault)

so... the scoop guys have these two advantages... and they will fight to the death for them

anyway as i see the current evolution...
if the scoops go to comp then we get stock & superstock lumped together...

i do NOT wish for stock & superstock to get lumped but i'd like to see scoops outta SS

anyway we will be the last ot know as usual

captain jack

Ed Wright · 12-08-2009, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack McCarthy

my 2 cents...

the fastest car in any handicap eliminator has a huge advantage due to two factors.
one first redlight rule (nhra will never change it to be fair)
two driving the finish line is mucho easier (not nhra's fault)

so... the scoop guys have these two advantages... and they will fight to the death for them

anyway as i see the current evolution...
if the scoops go to comp then we get stock & superstock lumped together...

i do NOT wish for stock & superstock to get lumped but i'd like to see scoops outta SS

anyway we will be the last ot know as usual

captain jack

I actually have to race them, and don't mind them a bit.

buzzinhalfdozen · 12-08-2009, 01:18 PM

I've got a "scoop" car and I've been spotted by some "real" S/S cars so where's the advantage?

Ed Wright · 12-08-2009, 01:39 PM

sprnova, how many heads-up races did you have this year? Think I had six?

sprnova · 12-08-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Wright

sprnova, how many heads-up races did you have this year? Think I had six?

no heads up runs

Ed Wright · 12-08-2009, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sprnova

no heads up runs

After you have a few of those, you won't think it's just bracket racing.

John Stock · 12-08-2009, 02:28 PM

Josh,

I’m not of the opinion that hood scoop cars (Modifieds). should be removed from Super Stock. If I had half a brain, I’d run one of the “Weigh Me, Pump Me, Send Me to Dinner” classes.

It wasn’t the topic of Don’s post but, I do believe that a case can be made that the Indexes for Modified classes are not equitable. Currently a disproportionate number of Modifieds qualify at the top of the ladder. As you so eloquently (and accurately outside of a heads up) describe the Eliminator as a bracket race, it isn’t hard to see why positions 1-4 on the qualifying sheet are of high value. Cars 1-4 will always get the available byes if they are still in competition. Any free pass in a round of a single elimination contest doubles the statistical odds of winning the event.

The reason that Modifieds qualify at the top is a function of the AHFS. At national events Modifieds can trigger the AHFS and they are balanced out by every car in their class. Traditional Super Stock cars that trigger are only balanced against their same engine combination. In reality, this means many Super Stock cars get horsepower adjustments after hitting -1.15 while Modifieds in practice only get an adjustment when they run -1.40 at sea level. In reality it would currently take a -.25 or -.30 change to the Modified indexs to bring equity to the qualifying and ladder situation, IMHO.

That said, that black V-6 Camaro is a bad dude.
As is that Silver Mustang with a couple of missing cylinders.

12-08-2009, 12:38 PM	#1
david ring Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Oneonta.,NY Posts: 889 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Hood Scoops to Comp I own a comp car and I'm always happy if someone wants to join us, but I don't think NHRA should force the hood scopp folks in. As for the expense of comp versus SS-I can afford a 4 cylinder Bantum altered and am partners with the engine builder in the project, so that is what makes comp affordable for me. But one of those SS/?S or SS/?M hood scoop cars built by East Texas or B and B is way out of my price range, to say nothing of what a hemi car costs. I'm not sure that there is any car in drag racing that costs as much to build as a hemi, except aybe what it costs to build an engine shop for pro stock and that seems to be the way to go in that class these days. And Mike Carr-your explanation was quite good-only one error -.65.to -.699 = .05 that should be -.650 to -.709 = .05 So you only get an A-. Last edited by david ring; 12-08-2009 at 12:45 PM.

12-08-2009, 12:47 PM	#2
Jack McCarthy VIP Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: lyndon ky. ... louisville area Posts: 1,326 Likes: 30 Liked 500 Times in 120 Posts	Re: Hood Scoops to Comp my 2 cents... the fastest car in any handicap eliminator has a huge advantage due to two factors. one first redlight rule (nhra will never change it to be fair) two driving the finish line is mucho easier (not nhra's fault) so... the scoop guys have these two advantages... and they will fight to the death for them anyway as i see the current evolution... if the scoops go to comp then we get stock & superstock lumped together... i do NOT wish for stock & superstock to get lumped but i'd like to see scoops outta SS anyway we will be the last ot know as usual captain jack __________________ Jack McCarthy 3609 STK "the Captain"

12-08-2009, 01:18 PM	#4
buzzinhalfdozen Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bellevue Ohio Posts: 984 Likes: 0 Liked 11 Times in 8 Posts	Re: Hood Scoops to Comp I've got a "scoop" car and I've been spotted by some "real" S/S cars so where's the advantage? __________________ Joe Buchanan SS/BX 3117

12-08-2009, 01:39 PM	#5
Ed Wright Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sand Springs, OK Posts: 8,132 Likes: 896 Liked 390 Times in 170 Posts	Re: Hood Scoops to Comp sprnova, how many heads-up races did you have this year? Think I had six? __________________ Ed Wright 4156 SS/JA

12-08-2009, 02:28 PM	#8
John Stock Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 32 Likes: 0 Liked 45 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Hood Scoops to Comp Josh, I’m not of the opinion that hood scoop cars (Modifieds). should be removed from Super Stock. If I had half a brain, I’d run one of the “Weigh Me, Pump Me, Send Me to Dinner” classes. It wasn’t the topic of Don’s post but, I do believe that a case can be made that the Indexes for Modified classes are not equitable. Currently a disproportionate number of Modifieds qualify at the top of the ladder. As you so eloquently (and accurately outside of a heads up) describe the Eliminator as a bracket race, it isn’t hard to see why positions 1-4 on the qualifying sheet are of high value. Cars 1-4 will always get the available byes if they are still in competition. Any free pass in a round of a single elimination contest doubles the statistical odds of winning the event. The reason that Modifieds qualify at the top is a function of the AHFS. At national events Modifieds can trigger the AHFS and they are balanced out by every car in their class. Traditional Super Stock cars that trigger are only balanced against their same engine combination. In reality, this means many Super Stock cars get horsepower adjustments after hitting -1.15 while Modifieds in practice only get an adjustment when they run -1.40 at sea level. In reality it would currently take a -.25 or -.30 change to the Modified indexs to bring equity to the qualifying and ladder situation, IMHO. That said, that black V-6 Camaro is a bad dude. As is that Silver Mustang with a couple of missing cylinders.