AA/SA @ Norwalk OH

[GARY JACOB]

I have an original nascar short track intake and carb. The intake is a dual plane type and the carb is a vacuum secondary with lemans type bowls. The carb is listed in the holley spec manual as a 1965 hemi nascar. The intake looks just like the later crate hemi single carb intake but is made from mag.

[Larry Hill]

I forgot to mention the car in the picture for best appearing had an AAR hood on it. A picture is always worth a 1000 words.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by GARY JACOB

I have an original nascar short track intake and carb. The intake is a dual plane type and the carb is a vacuum secondary with lemans type bowls. The carb is listed in the holley spec manual as a 1965 hemi nascar. The intake looks just like the later crate hemi single carb intake but is made from mag.

I stand corrected....Its possable the 3 barrel carb was a 1964 piece and not a 1965 or was there a difference in the short track combo vs the Daytona (long track) version ?? The 3 barrel Holley was also a vacuum seconday 850 (or 950?) CFM carb. We ran one on a bracket car back in the stone age. I will look it up when I can find the paper work I have stored away.

[David Barton]

Larry, before I jump to any conclusions which hood and engine combo do you run?

[Chris Hill]

Originally Posted by David Barton

Larry, before I jump to any conclusions which hood and engine combo do you run?

71 'cuda 440 six pack with shaker hood

http://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCPhoto.asp?ID=181491

[Steve Hagberg]

Jeff and David: Regarding the 3-bbl carb and intake, Chrysler completed the design modifications to the carb and 'short track' manifold and submitted them to NASCAR one week before the Firecracker 400 at Daytona in 1964. The combination was accepted by them and ran at that race. The manifold was the '043' magnesium version with the rear half of the plenum modified to accept the wide 3-bbl throttle blade. Les Norton runs this manifold on his car as it has been accepted by NHRA even though the carb has not been accepted! The interesting part of the story is that the Chrysler engineers spent a lot of time and money trying to get the 3-bbl to work, and even had to move the secondary boosters to correct the fuel distribution. Eventually they said it was worth 2% HP improvement, the same as they found in early testing with Hilborn fuel injection. The carb is a Holley model 3085A P/N 2536406 and used base plate gasket 2536411. One of these would be a rare find as it is not the same as the generic 3-bbl Holleys that were later sold over the counter. Anyway, it's not legal in stock, just an interesting story. By the way, I came about this information when a good friend let me look over an extensive collection of weekly engineering meeting minutes from late '63 to mid '64 by the group developing the A 864 engine program which included both the NASCAR engine and the Drag Race cross ram engine. Facinating reading. These guys were so far ahead of everyone else it was scary. Hollow stem valves, titanium retainers, a slew of light weight proposals including gun drilled cams, titanium wrist pins, Hilborns without conventional throttle blades. What we got was aluminum heads, oil and water pumps, mag intakes and more.

[X-TECH MAN]

Originally Posted by Steve Hagberg

Jeff and David: Regarding the 3-bbl carb and intake, Chrysler completed the design modifications to the carb and 'short track' manifold and submitted them to NASCAR one week before the Firecracker 400 at Daytona in 1964. The combination was accepted by them and ran at that race. The manifold was the '043' magnesium version with the rear half of the plenum modified to accept the wide 3-bbl throttle blade. Les Norton runs this manifold on his car as it has been accepted by NHRA even though the carb has not been accepted! The interesting part of the story is that the Chrysler engineers spent a lot of time and money trying to get the 3-bbl to work, and even had to move the secondary boosters to correct the fuel distribution. Eventually they said it was worth 2% HP improvement, the same as they found in early testing with Hilborn fuel injection. The carb is a Holley model 3085A P/N 2536406 and used base plate gasket 2536411. One of these would be a rare find as it is not the same as the generic 3-bbl Holleys that were later sold over the counter. Anyway, it's not legal in stock, just an interesting story. By the way, I came about this information when a good friend let me look over an extensive collection of weekly engineering meeting minutes from late '63 to mid '64 by the group developing the A 864 engine program which included both the NASCAR engine and the Drag Race cross ram engine. Facinating reading. These guys were so far ahead of everyone else it was scary. Hollow stem valves, titanium retainers, a slew of light weight proposals including gun drilled cams, titanium wrist pins, Hilborns without conventional throttle blades. What we got was aluminum heads, oil and water pumps, mag intakes and more.

Thank you Steve for the info on the "Bath Tub" intake and 3 barrel carb combo. It would have taken me days and maybe weeks to dig out the paper work and info on this combo as I have it packed away. I knew I wasnt to crazy...LOL .It was just a long time ago when we researched it for IHRA's AA/S class. In the end IHRA went with a 7 lb class break and reduced the HP rating on the Hemi X ram 2x4 system which would also allow the Ford T-Bolts and L-88 Corvettes with thier old HP ratings to compete together heads up. Dan Davorak had build one (a 64 X-ram Hemi model) but I dont know if he had the chance to run it before his surgery.

[Bob Pagano]

Item number: 250447430693 ebay Nascar carb, no intakes at this time but have seen a few in the last couple years even the wedge nascar intake, there were two just last month.

[David Barton]

Thanks for the interesting facts Steve.

The intake I have here at the shop is the exact same one you're talking about. Which intake did they have before they had the 3 bbl approved? Was it the same one without the 3 bbl modification?

[Evan Smith]

Randall and George,

As a SRAC member, I spoke with NHRA (over a year ago) about the factor on the Hemi, and at one point was told that it was going to get a reduction after a two-year period—it never happened. I tried to fight the good fight, but didn't win.

It was also unfair that the 440x6 in the B-Body got hit to the moon, when the A-body with a similar chassis got nothing (had the A-Body been included it could have brought the entire average down). Moreover, NHRA hit the 350 Chevy based on runs make by a Camaro and a Corvette? There is clearly little logic applied at times, and this was brought to the attention of high-ranking NHRA officials, albeit with zero response.

I am certainly not one to bash NHRA because I feel that most of the guys sportsman racers deal with are good people, but it's amazing to me that we could make a few simple changes to "enhance" the sport, yet no one wants to act and make such improvements.

Evan