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Old 09-18-2012, 04:28 PM   #1
Myron Piatek
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Post Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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When a new car and engine combination gets introduced into Stock or S/S, it should be over factored (2 HP per Cubic inch) so that it has to race to get weight off.
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Unfortunately, that wouldn't even be considered for marketing reasons. Few, if any, people would want to make a big investment to start with a basically less than competitive car. Getting the cars out as they do creates a performance incentive to buy one and gives the factories a lot of exposure when their cars get out there and qualify well. It's good that the factories are involved. But it's totally in NHRA's hands as to how they are introduced into the ranks.
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Old 09-18-2012, 04:36 PM   #2
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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Originally Posted by Myron Piatek View Post
Unfortunately, that wouldn't even be considered for marketing reasons. Few, if any, people would want to make a big investment to start with a basically less than competitive car. Getting the cars out as they do creates a performance incentive to buy one and gives the factories a lot of exposure when their cars get out there and qualify well. It's good that the factories are involved. But it's totally in NHRA's hands as to how they are introduced into the ranks.
I agree with most of your post but I do believe the Big 3 can influence class selection if they were inclined to do the right thing for the sport.
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Old 09-18-2012, 04:48 PM   #3
Myron Piatek
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Post Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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I agree with most of your post but I do believe the Big 3 can influence class selection if they were inclined to do the right thing for the sport.
Absolutely. But which of the big 3 will "do the right thing" and be at a disadvantage to the others if the rest don't follow suit? Everybody is always looking for an advantage.
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Old 09-20-2012, 11:53 AM   #4
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

Alright, here is my take on the suggestions so far....

I think a good solution is emerging among the comments, especially when you combine idieas from Bad Banana, Capt Cobrajet, Jeff, Sammy, 442Olds and X-Tech who are all kinda in the same framework, and Myron, who also addresses the marketing side (which the Big 3 are primarily interested in). Just trying to give credit where it is due

1. Factors need to be examined and adjusted ASAP. I would suggest reviewing these by going thru this year's runs and making the adjustments over the Winter.

1a. New cars need HP, older cars need WT break. (You could do one or the other, but a combo is probably the most fair, let old cars lighten up some, and add HP to the newer ones. 1/8 mile performances from this year are probably the fairest assessement)

2. FI/Computer cars need to run in their own classes, the TOOLS to make adjustments are in a different league from the carbureted cars and they definitely have an advantage in ease of adjustment and precision over the older cars - level 'em out by letting them compete with each other in class eliminatons.

2a. Supercharged cars need to be in their own class - period.

3. Readjust the indexes so they are more realistic. (Something on the order of .5 seems to make sense to me... cars should not routinely be .8 - 1.2 under.)

4. More classes and crate motors are not a good solution, this would dilute classes and make the eliminator even more difficult to monitor and manage... not what we need.

5. Better media coverage of the S/SS would give manufacturers the exposure they crave.

Old idea, not likely to get much play, but a joint NHRA/Racer committee should be looking over this stuff on an ongoing basis, and have seasonal meetings to assess and make changes, with racer representation in the form of divisional delegates to vote. The actual number and structure of this body would need to be "discussed" and agreed on....

These measures seem to cover most of the bases fairly and are doable, if the will to do so is there on the part of NHRA At the very least, they suggest a workable framework for improvement.... just one racer's opinion

I think if these measured are done realistically, we could make S/SS much better for everybody....
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:04 PM   #5
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

I think you are overstating number 2. Anyone that has spent as much time on a carb car as I have mine is just as fast. Look at Tracy Pedigo for example. His car makes slightly more HP per cubic inch than mine does.
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:16 PM   #6
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

I don't understand the need to lower the indexes even further, why would we want to lose racers when Indy is almost always the only race with a full field anymore?

As far as separating the fuel injected cars from the carbureted cars, it's not fair to the guys with fairly factored fuel injected cars, and it would get rid of some really close races, especially in A-C. I don't see any reason why a 397/375 and an LS1 should not run heads up.
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:30 PM   #7
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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I don't understand the need to lower the indexes even further, why would we want to lose racers when Indy is almost always the only race with a full field anymore?

Having the indexes more accurately reflect performance I think is a good thing, the relative performance of the cars will still be the same, but I think a field with the cars .4-.7 under at the top is better than 1 second plus.

As far as separating the fuel injected cars from the carbureted cars, it's not fair to the guys with fairly factored fuel injected cars, and it would get rid of some really close races, especially in A-C. I don't see any reason why a 397/375 and an LS1 should not run heads up.
I agree.... this is a case where the factors are close to correct.... the problem keeps coming back to having accurate/fair factors.
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Old 09-20-2012, 01:20 PM   #8
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

Look if you want more car's in stock and more people in the stands than add some crate motor's !!
GM 502/502,502/450,385/390 ,350/330
add 3 or 4 Mopar and Ford crate motor's
Look I know NHRA Div. 1 has alot of car's , when you draw from 4 or 5 million you can get that many.
But Div. 2and some others have a problem with car the count.
Why not try it at the Div. 2 points races and see how it works out.
Heck if you add 20 or 30 car's to a div. race you'll add what ? another $8000. or $9000.
to help the track stay in business.
I would love to see a 56/57 chevy with a 350/330 runnig l crate motor.
The people in the stands don't care what motor is in that 56, just that it pull's the wheels and looks fast.
Just an Idea,,,,,
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:25 PM   #9
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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Originally Posted by KRatcliff View Post
I think you are overstating number 2. Anyone that has spent as much time on a carb car as I have mine is just as fast. Look at Tracy Pedigo for example. His car makes slightly more HP per cubic inch than mine does.
The point is not how well you can make the car run, but how easy it is to make changes. I have run a FI car, and making changes by pushing buttons is a lot easier than changing jets, adjusting timing with a light, etc. That may turn out to be a non issue for most racers, I'm just making the observation....
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Old 09-20-2012, 12:39 PM   #10
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Default Re: New cars, old cars and horsepower ratings.

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The point is not how well you can make the car run, but how easy it is to make changes. I have run a FI car, and making changes by pushing buttons is a lot easier than changing jets, adjusting timing with a light, etc. That may turn out to be a non issue for most racers, I'm just making the observation....
So, your problem is with the physical effort involved? LOL
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