2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide - Page 3

Mike Gray · 04-25-2012, 08:31 PM

I have no issue with the weight of any of the new cars. I'm just amazed at the weight difference between the street version and the class guide.
I started construction on a '67 shelby stocker (untill the economy put it on hold) and the class guide shows a weight of 3187lb. only 70lbs lighter than the camaro. I didn't know all of that street legal technology was that heavy. The camaro sure looks a lot larger and heavier than my '67 mustang. If I could take out the same percentage of weight my car would weigh about 2700lbs. The problem is it still wouldn't be competitive with the new cars.

GUMP · 04-25-2012, 08:59 PM

You would be really surprised at the weights of everything in a new car. The stock harness on my 1995 Formula was about 40 lbs! The same goes for the carpet. I scraped over 30 lbs of deadener and sealer out of my body-in-white 2010 Camaro. That is before you look at the stuff the government now mandates. Ever pick up the rims on a new Camaro?

68camaroSS · 04-25-2012, 09:42 PM

Just to give some insight on the real numbers of this 427 NA engine, I have been running close to the same combination in my 68 camaro in bracket mode for the past year. 427 LS7 NA, originally Z06 motor, replaced pistons with 12:5 compression Ross, have close to the same cam as the COPO, powerglide, but with a 950 carb setup, stock GM 4-barrel intake. Car runs 6.0's in the 1/8 shifting at 6800. Dynoed with a fresh motor this year at over 700 hp @6800. Figure how much more the COPO would be capable of from reported rumored 9.69 after the engine/chassis experts get more run time, go to full race tune, running it up to 7500 rpm.

Stewart Way · 04-25-2012, 10:20 PM

Byron
Not sure the 275 vs 425 is that far off. Adjust for cid and the 275 goes to 325. WJ says a point of CR is 4% so thats another 12 % or 365 HP. Then the light valves, the 33% larger throttle body opening and the .640 vs .490 cam and its pretty close. What is .150 lift worth? Maybe its even in favor of the 427. Not sure the TB difference gets much since I doubt its the choke point on either engine, but it sure doesn't hurt. Either way it will make a slick stocker.

Jeff Teuton · 04-26-2012, 01:49 AM

Byron knows the old 360 is a truck motor, and of course the Chev is a race motor. Thats about the same. i can tell the chevy guys are happier already. Don't you think so Stewart? I'm glad they are feeling better.

Andys dad · 04-26-2012, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Teuton

Byron knows the old 360 is a truck motor, and of course the Chev is a race motor. Thats about the same. i can tell the chevy guys are happier already. Don't you think so Stewart? I'm glad they are feeling better.

Ya think

Chevy454 · 04-27-2012, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GUMP

You would be really surprised at the weights of everything in a new car. The stock harness on my 1995 Formula was about 40 lbs! The same goes for the carpet. I scraped over 30 lbs of deadener and sealer out of my body-in-white 2010 Camaro. That is before you look at the stuff the government now mandates. Ever pick up the rims on a new Camaro?

I shipped a set of 20" wheels/tires off our 2010 to a guy in New York...cost me $180 to ship, as each front was like 34lbs and each rear was 37lbs, iirc...I couldn't believe how heavy they were.

Stewart Way · 04-27-2012, 11:53 PM

Your right Jeff. But compare the (race) 427 to the 6.1 hemi. The hemi has the smaller TB, around 2 pts less compression, less cam and the 427 is rated less than 1 hp/ci and the hemi started at more than 1 hp/ci. If you correct the 6.1 370/385hp to 427 inches and for the additional compression the 6.1 would be over 470hp.
The 5.7 hemi at 305 hp is likely closer to the 427 and everyone complained about the 5.7. If you correct the 5.7/305hp for compression and inches its about 400hp. The TB, valves and additional cam may be worth the other 25hp.
Why isn't everyone complaining about the 427/425 rating?
I can remember threads where Mopar (and Ford) folks were called immoral and unethical but I doubt we will hear that about the Chevy guys. And we shouldn't.

RULER · 04-28-2012, 01:00 AM

If you want to compare OLD vers NEW look at the 427/ 425hp L72 1969 and then check the spec's on the new copo 427/ 425hp. All these new cars are NOT STOCK ELIMINATOR CARS PLAIN AND SIMPLE!!!!

davidhuff · 04-28-2012, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RULER

If you want to compare OLD vers NEW look at the 427/ 425hp L72 1969 and then check the spec's on the new copo 427/ 425hp. All these new cars are NOT STOCK ELIMINATOR CARS PLAIN AND SIMPLE!!!!

I am sure you do not like the new COPO ,but NHRA has put them in the classguide and they are hear to stay whether you like it are not.I think the new cars will put a few more young fans in the stands and that will be good for NHRA Drag Racing.

04-25-2012, 08:31 PM	#21
Mike Gray Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 615 Likes: 309 Liked 685 Times in 196 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide I have no issue with the weight of any of the new cars. I'm just amazed at the weight difference between the street version and the class guide. I started construction on a '67 shelby stocker (untill the economy put it on hold) and the class guide shows a weight of 3187lb. only 70lbs lighter than the camaro. I didn't know all of that street legal technology was that heavy. The camaro sure looks a lot larger and heavier than my '67 mustang. If I could take out the same percentage of weight my car would weigh about 2700lbs. The problem is it still wouldn't be competitive with the new cars.

04-25-2012, 08:59 PM	#22
GUMP VIP Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Shelby, NC Posts: 1,817 Likes: 2,156 Liked 2,336 Times in 549 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide You would be really surprised at the weights of everything in a new car. The stock harness on my 1995 Formula was about 40 lbs! The same goes for the carpet. I scraped over 30 lbs of deadener and sealer out of my body-in-white 2010 Camaro. That is before you look at the stuff the government now mandates. Ever pick up the rims on a new Camaro?

04-25-2012, 09:42 PM	#23
68camaroSS Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: columbia TN Posts: 88 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide Just to give some insight on the real numbers of this 427 NA engine, I have been running close to the same combination in my 68 camaro in bracket mode for the past year. 427 LS7 NA, originally Z06 motor, replaced pistons with 12:5 compression Ross, have close to the same cam as the COPO, powerglide, but with a 950 carb setup, stock GM 4-barrel intake. Car runs 6.0's in the 1/8 shifting at 6800. Dynoed with a fresh motor this year at over 700 hp @6800. Figure how much more the COPO would be capable of from reported rumored 9.69 after the engine/chassis experts get more run time, go to full race tune, running it up to 7500 rpm. Last edited by 68camaroSS; 04-25-2012 at 10:10 PM.

04-25-2012, 10:20 PM	#24
Stewart Way Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 476 Likes: 20 Liked 70 Times in 22 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide Byron Not sure the 275 vs 425 is that far off. Adjust for cid and the 275 goes to 325. WJ says a point of CR is 4% so thats another 12 % or 365 HP. Then the light valves, the 33% larger throttle body opening and the .640 vs .490 cam and its pretty close. What is .150 lift worth? Maybe its even in favor of the 427. Not sure the TB difference gets much since I doubt its the choke point on either engine, but it sure doesn't hurt. Either way it will make a slick stocker. __________________ Stewart Way 2424 SS

04-26-2012, 01:49 AM	#25
Jeff Teuton VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Houma, LA Posts: 2,717 Likes: 2 Liked 325 Times in 50 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide Byron knows the old 360 is a truck motor, and of course the Chev is a race motor. Thats about the same. i can tell the chevy guys are happier already. Don't you think so Stewart? I'm glad they are feeling better. __________________ Jeff Teuton 4022 STK

04-27-2012, 11:53 PM	#28
Stewart Way Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 476 Likes: 20 Liked 70 Times in 22 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide Your right Jeff. But compare the (race) 427 to the 6.1 hemi. The hemi has the smaller TB, around 2 pts less compression, less cam and the 427 is rated less than 1 hp/ci and the hemi started at more than 1 hp/ci. If you correct the 6.1 370/385hp to 427 inches and for the additional compression the 6.1 would be over 470hp. The 5.7 hemi at 305 hp is likely closer to the 427 and everyone complained about the 5.7. If you correct the 5.7/305hp for compression and inches its about 400hp. The TB, valves and additional cam may be worth the other 25hp. Why isn't everyone complaining about the 427/425 rating? I can remember threads where Mopar (and Ford) folks were called immoral and unethical but I doubt we will hear that about the Chevy guys. And we shouldn't. __________________ Stewart Way 2424 SS

04-28-2012, 01:00 AM	#29
RULER Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 221 Likes: 15 Liked 58 Times in 18 Posts	Re: 2012 Camaro in the NHRA Classguide If you want to compare OLD vers NEW look at the 427/ 425hp L72 1969 and then check the spec's on the new copo 427/ 425hp. All these new cars are NOT STOCK ELIMINATOR CARS PLAIN AND SIMPLE!!!!