Ahfs

[B Parker]

So on my 5 hour trip to the Grove I gave this some thought. After trying to come up with some combo's that are underfactored and not by just a little HP I had a hard time naming any. Most of the new cars run in their own class. There are a lot of older cars that run really strong but not many are more than 5 off. In a heads up run in mind shaft air unless a 1000ft deal is made we are putting at risk combo's that really are not out of whack. Case in point the 1970 402/375 Nova's. Hit 15 Hp a few years ago because of a Heads up run at Atco in good air. The 69 350/ 255 hp combo. Tim came real close at Gainesville to the instant hit in mind shaft air. Hal and Joe run real close at several races. Looking at Indy for the last ten years the 305 of Rod's and Chris have owned the H class. .I still think the 305 is the better combo. With all the fuss about the AHFS to help make those underfactored combo's get Hp. Out of the and I'm quessing 100 or more combo's that run Stock what combo are we tying to get inline. For me I feel we have a bigger risk of hurting a combo that really dosen't need HP over getting combo's that could use HP. So please you guys that feel their are combo's so out of whack I like to know what they are and how they affect anyone else.
Thanks Barry

It's late at night sorry for ranting a little.

[Frank Castros]

Eliminate the scrutiny and lower the indexes .10
It's long overdue.

[Larry Hill]

Lowering the index really hurts the lower class cars that sometimes struggle to get to the index.

What needs to be addressed is the stroke of a pen reductions to certain combos when the AHFS was in affect. The rules were in place, go by the rules as written. NHRA helping a “friend” to be fast just screws the rest of us in that class.

Does anybody know the process to get a Stock piston approved?

[jamie2370]

I completely deleted my post so that I can agree with Larry.

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Larry Hill

Does anybody know the process to get a Stock piston approved?

Work with the manufacturer to have the piston made, however, the manufacturer has to submit the piston to NHRA for approval.
Also, make sure the submitted piston is the same weight or heavier than the spec. Although NHRA checks the total assembly weight during a teardown, they will reject a submitted position even if it is a few grams lighter than the spec.

[Frank Castros]

Example of my point:
2018 Indy Non-Qualifiers

129 8735 AA/SA Nic Williams, Northhampton EN, '69 Camaro 9.811 10.70 -0.889
130 3120 I/SA Lyn Smith, Pontiac IL, '73 Century 11.413 12.30 -0.887
131 441 FS/F Mitch Truman, Leesburg IN, '15 Camaro 10.313 11.20 -0.887
132 3355 R/S Tim Weinzapfel, St. Phillips IN, '66 BelA 13.064 13.95 -0.886
133 339L C/SA Randi Lyn Shipp, Floyds Knobs IN, '67 Fir 10.515 11.40 -0.885
134 1322 B/S Tim Bishop, Queenstown MD, '97 Firebird 10.317 11.20 -0.883
135 318 FS/AA Jesse Alexandra, West Bend WI, '17 Camaro 8.519 9.40 -0.881
136 3602 A/S Jason McCormack, Columbiaville MI, '66 Be 10.074 10.95 -0.876
137 154 AA/SA Anthony Fetch, Colonia NJ, '69 Camaro 9.826 10.70 -0.874
138 6070 FS/A Gary Coe, Portland OR, '14 Mustang 8.832 9.70 -0.868
139 338H A/SA Tony Fagnilli, Carolpolis PA, '69 Camaro 10.141 11.00 -0.859
140 7356 C/SA Scott Loge, Livermore CA, '70 GTX 10.544 11.40 -0.856
141 L747 FS/AA Lane Goldstein, Calabassas CA, '18 Camaro 8.545 9.40 -0.855
142 3649 D/SA Bruce Gibson, Dayton IN, '71 Demon 10.696 11.55 -0.854
143 333 A/S Brett McFarland, Manchester OH, '68 Camaro10.099 10.95 -0.851
144 3009 FS/C James Reed, Lincoln IL, '17 Camaro 9.449 10.30 -0.851
145 3922 E/SA Julie Biermann, Xenia OH, '68 Firebird 10.851 11.70 -0.849
146 3651 L/SA Bob Gere, Salem WI, '72 Grand Sport 11.865 12.70 -0.835
147 3969 A/S Joe Martens, N. Olmsted OH, '69 Camaro 10.128 10.95 -0.822
148 2221 G/SA Richard Mace, Jacksonville FL, '91 Corvet 11.179 12.00 -0.821
149 4403 FS/A Gary Emmons, Friendswood TX, '14 Mustang 8.897 9.70 -0.803
150 4411 FS/B Phillip Giles, Flatonia TX, '16 Camaro 9.198 10.00 -0.802
151 3084 F/S Craig Saurbaugh, Grand Haven MI, '66 Nova 11.009 11.80 -0.791
152 3812 F/SA Gary Herche, N. Vernon IN, '71 Skylark 11.063 11.85 -0.787
153 3314 L/SA Chris Utsler, Martinville IN, '74 Apollo 11.915 12.70 -0.785
154 3576 N/SA David Garrity, Greenfield IN, '75 Omega 12.216 13.00 -0.784
155 G339 F/SA Dale Massengill, Kokomo IN, '79 Aspen 11.070 11.85 -0.780
156 3004 O/S Rosalyn Gresens, Toledo IL, '89 Mustang 12.323 13.10 -0.777
157 38 A/S Gary Russell, East Sparta OH, '67 Camaro 10.181 10.95 -0.769
158 33 A/S Tom Russell, East Sparta OH, '67 Camaro 10.202 10.95 -0.748
159 7797 C/S Don Keen, Palmdale CA, '68 Mustang 10.635 11.35 -0.715
160 3952 E/SA Marvin Benoit, Alvaton KY, '71 Camaro 11.026 11.70 -0.674
161 3980 N/SA Bobby Bishop, Lemont IL, '89 Mustang 12.336 13.00 -0.664
162 3657 P/SA Marty Buth, Freeport IL, '84 Mustang 12.802 13.45 -0.648
163 5351 G/SA Keith Hildahl, Northfield MN, '73 Mustang 11.404 12.00 -0.596
164 336 FS/B Kevin Mitchell, Champion IL, '17 Camaro 9.418 10.00 -0.582
165 3219 F/SA Jeff McKinney, Carroll OH, '90 Corvette 11.269 11.85 -0.581
166 5502 L/SA Paul Anderson, Lewiston MN, '80 Malibu 12.151 12.70 -0.549
167 J365 FS/AA Brad Jarvis, Catlin IL, '18 Camaro 8.888 9.40 -0.512
168 4745 C/SA Wayne Larsen, Ponchatoula LA, '69 Mustang 10.946 11.40 -0.454
169 248H E/S Casey Miles, Boca Raton FL, '69 Camaro 11.263 11.65 -0.387
170 3202 FS/A Terry Fritss, Greenup IL, '14 Mustang 9.389 9.70 -0.311
171 3315 J/SA Robert Utsler, Martinville IN, '74 Ventura12.334 12.45 -0.116

[GUMP]

Originally Posted by Frank Castros

Example of my point:
2018 Indy Non-Qualifiers

129 8735 AA/SA Nic Williams, Northhampton EN, '69 Camaro 9.811 10.70 -0.889
130 3120 I/SA Lyn Smith, Pontiac IL, '73 Century 11.413 12.30 -0.887
131 441 FS/F Mitch Truman, Leesburg IN, '15 Camaro 10.313 11.20 -0.887
132 3355 R/S Tim Weinzapfel, St. Phillips IN, '66 BelA 13.064 13.95 -0.886
133 339L C/SA Randi Lyn Shipp, Floyds Knobs IN, '67 Fir 10.515 11.40 -0.885
134 1322 B/S Tim Bishop, Queenstown MD, '97 Firebird 10.317 11.20 -0.883
135 318 FS/AA Jesse Alexandra, West Bend WI, '17 Camaro 8.519 9.40 -0.881
136 3602 A/S Jason McCormack, Columbiaville MI, '66 Be 10.074 10.95 -0.876
137 154 AA/SA Anthony Fetch, Colonia NJ, '69 Camaro 9.826 10.70 -0.874
138 6070 FS/A Gary Coe, Portland OR, '14 Mustang 8.832 9.70 -0.868
139 338H A/SA Tony Fagnilli, Carolpolis PA, '69 Camaro 10.141 11.00 -0.859
140 7356 C/SA Scott Loge, Livermore CA, '70 GTX 10.544 11.40 -0.856
141 L747 FS/AA Lane Goldstein, Calabassas CA, '18 Camaro 8.545 9.40 -0.855
142 3649 D/SA Bruce Gibson, Dayton IN, '71 Demon 10.696 11.55 -0.854
143 333 A/S Brett McFarland, Manchester OH, '68 Camaro10.099 10.95 -0.851
144 3009 FS/C James Reed, Lincoln IL, '17 Camaro 9.449 10.30 -0.851
145 3922 E/SA Julie Biermann, Xenia OH, '68 Firebird 10.851 11.70 -0.849
146 3651 L/SA Bob Gere, Salem WI, '72 Grand Sport 11.865 12.70 -0.835
147 3969 A/S Joe Martens, N. Olmsted OH, '69 Camaro 10.128 10.95 -0.822
148 2221 G/SA Richard Mace, Jacksonville FL, '91 Corvet 11.179 12.00 -0.821
149 4403 FS/A Gary Emmons, Friendswood TX, '14 Mustang 8.897 9.70 -0.803
150 4411 FS/B Phillip Giles, Flatonia TX, '16 Camaro 9.198 10.00 -0.802
151 3084 F/S Craig Saurbaugh, Grand Haven MI, '66 Nova 11.009 11.80 -0.791
152 3812 F/SA Gary Herche, N. Vernon IN, '71 Skylark 11.063 11.85 -0.787
153 3314 L/SA Chris Utsler, Martinville IN, '74 Apollo 11.915 12.70 -0.785
154 3576 N/SA David Garrity, Greenfield IN, '75 Omega 12.216 13.00 -0.784
155 G339 F/SA Dale Massengill, Kokomo IN, '79 Aspen 11.070 11.85 -0.780
156 3004 O/S Rosalyn Gresens, Toledo IL, '89 Mustang 12.323 13.10 -0.777
157 38 A/S Gary Russell, East Sparta OH, '67 Camaro 10.181 10.95 -0.769
158 33 A/S Tom Russell, East Sparta OH, '67 Camaro 10.202 10.95 -0.748
159 7797 C/S Don Keen, Palmdale CA, '68 Mustang 10.635 11.35 -0.715
160 3952 E/SA Marvin Benoit, Alvaton KY, '71 Camaro 11.026 11.70 -0.674
161 3980 N/SA Bobby Bishop, Lemont IL, '89 Mustang 12.336 13.00 -0.664
162 3657 P/SA Marty Buth, Freeport IL, '84 Mustang 12.802 13.45 -0.648
163 5351 G/SA Keith Hildahl, Northfield MN, '73 Mustang 11.404 12.00 -0.596
164 336 FS/B Kevin Mitchell, Champion IL, '17 Camaro 9.418 10.00 -0.582
165 3219 F/SA Jeff McKinney, Carroll OH, '90 Corvette 11.269 11.85 -0.581
166 5502 L/SA Paul Anderson, Lewiston MN, '80 Malibu 12.151 12.70 -0.549
167 J365 FS/AA Brad Jarvis, Catlin IL, '18 Camaro 8.888 9.40 -0.512
168 4745 C/SA Wayne Larsen, Ponchatoula LA, '69 Mustang 10.946 11.40 -0.454
169 248H E/S Casey Miles, Boca Raton FL, '69 Camaro 11.263 11.65 -0.387
170 3202 FS/A Terry Fritss, Greenup IL, '14 Mustang 9.389 9.70 -0.311
171 3315 J/SA Robert Utsler, Martinville IN, '74 Ventura12.334 12.45 -0.116

How would lowering the indexes change these qualifying results?

[Angelo DiTocco]

Originally Posted by B Parker

So on my 5 hour trip to the Grove I gave this some thought. After trying to come up with some combo's that are underfactored and not by just a little HP I had a hard time naming any. Most of the new cars run in their own class. There are a lot of older cars that run really strong but not many are more than 5 off. In a heads up run in mind shaft air unless a 1000ft deal is made we are putting at risk combo's that really are not out of whack. Case in point the 1970 402/375 Nova's. Hit 15 Hp a few years ago because of a Heads up run at Atco in good air. The 69 350/ 255 hp combo. Tim came real close at Gainesville to the instant hit in mind shaft air. Hal and Joe run real close at several races. Looking at Indy for the last ten years the 305 of Rod's and Chris have owned the H class. .I still think the 305 is the better combo. With all the fuss about the AHFS to help make those underfactored combo's get Hp. Out of the and I'm quessing 100 or more combo's that run Stock what combo are we tying to get inline. For me I feel we have a bigger risk of hurting a combo that really dosen't need HP over getting combo's that could use HP. So please you guys that feel their are combo's so out of whack I like to know what they are and how they affect anyone else.
Thanks Barry

It's late at night sorry for ranting a little.

I still think the approach should include giving hp back to combos that do not have the options for aftermarket parts that some of the combos you refer to currently have. You have one of each... so I think you know what I mean LOL

[Larry Hill]

A racer may want to complete in the A/SA shootout knowing that the index is a full tenth of a second harder than the B/SA index of 10.25. Some racers are fast enough to be in the shootout and qualify. The Bell Curve is always in effect.

[Frank Castros]

How would lowering the indexes change these qualifying results?

Daren,
The point of listing this result is to dispel the notion that lowing the indexes by a tenth across the board would be unfair to to those at the bottom of the list. Based on this example I don't think so.