Newbie pondering combos

Joe Toller · 01-11-2009, 04:16 PM

Ok, got excel to work, thanks Alan, and I'll throw most all of those first ideas out of the window I think. I can fab and weld and build drivetrains, so that's why I wanted to try building a car, plus I wanted something unique. I do have a couple other cars in my pile to look into that aren't rough, one idea of which was suggested to me by a very helpful member here. I do have a weird AMC/Rambler bone in me, as well as access to a few of those various cars...

What I'd like to know now is, what is everyones most memorable oddball they've seen, or what oddball would you like to build if you could?

Rich Biebel · 01-11-2009, 06:35 PM

I raced against a fairly late model Jeep Pickup a couple years ago at a Lucas race. I believe it was an inline 6. That was a pretty unusal combination.......We had a dbl. breakout race and I lost....He ran 13.9 something.......it was running in a F.I. class as I was at the time........His ET's varied a lot as I recall but he went deep into eliminations that day.....A Jeep engine was an AMC when I worked on them in the late 70's in a Jeep dealership as a flat rater.....

Owen S Quirion · 01-12-2009, 10:27 AM

One of my favorite combinations was the Galonka Brothers Caddy Coupe DeVille. Big, Green, and Fast. I like Ed Fernandez's Gremlin too.

Jeff Lee · 01-12-2009, 12:05 PM

The 360 Matador would be the way to go in my opinion. The AMC 401/360 shares the same top end components and the 360 cam is
.425" lift (which is plenty) to the 401's .457" lift. I'm, saying not much there in the cam to make you lean one way or the other. The '72-'74 360 HP is ripe for a reduction with NHRA as it is a low compression engine that nobody has tackled yet. The high compression 360 of '70-'71 has received reductions. The ports on the 360/401 are very good and the carb size is adequate, more so on the 360. With the 360 you could switch classes and run a 4bbl or 2bbl.
The rear suspension on the Matador is similar to the GM A-Body (Chevelle, GTO, ETC.) so it should work well with normal modifications.
The 401 would be no more difficult to build but there is a slight premium on parts. It would be faster but probable less aggressive against the index. At least with the current HP rating.
The wagon in question was a 304-2bbl Matador wagon.
Good luck!

big blue galaxie · 01-15-2009, 10:31 PM

I am in the same boat as you, yet after taking a good look at it all it seems like what we have to ask ourselves is what would be the benefit in terms of competetiveness, ease and cost for doing a particular combo. Also, like one other racer said, but I'll paraphrase here, zoom factor. It sucks to run a car that just doesn't squeeze you good down the quarter. My car is big with a small motor and a stick, so unless you gear it and scream the guts out of it, it will not do the job. But if I work at it (ie time and $$$$$$), it can do the job. Any car can. But some cars and combinations are easier. The physics of speed are the same no matter what. The cheap way is to take the lightest car, combined with an engine that conforms to the rules with the best factory available heads and induction, cam and driveline to match. It takes us sitting down and calculating everything out before making a move. What got me excited about Stock Eliminator is seeing late model Mustangs with E7TE heads and stock spec cams going 11's and nudging the 10's. Seeing 301 turbo pontiacs do 12.5's legally, not to mention the big dogs like that Vette that went mid 9's with an L88. Good stuff. This type of racing is hard fought, probably more so than any other that I have seen because the top players have had to make so many sacrifices to squeeze out everything and still be legal. Chevy and Mopar seem easiest to do from a cost benefit point, then Ford, then everybody else. In the end we have to be committed for a class like this, because the more obscure the car combination, the more sacrifice it's going to require.

01-11-2009, 04:16 PM	#1
Joe Toller Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lewistown, Montana Posts: 550 Likes: 78 Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Newbie pondering combos Ok, got excel to work, thanks Alan, and I'll throw most all of those first ideas out of the window I think. I can fab and weld and build drivetrains, so that's why I wanted to try building a car, plus I wanted something unique. I do have a couple other cars in my pile to look into that aren't rough, one idea of which was suggested to me by a very helpful member here. I do have a weird AMC/Rambler bone in me, as well as access to a few of those various cars... What I'd like to know now is, what is everyones most memorable oddball they've seen, or what oddball would you like to build if you could?

01-11-2009, 06:35 PM	#2
Rich Biebel VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern New Jersey suburbs Posts: 2,315 Likes: 25 Liked 544 Times in 213 Posts	Re: Newbie pondering combos I raced against a fairly late model Jeep Pickup a couple years ago at a Lucas race. I believe it was an inline 6. That was a pretty unusal combination.......We had a dbl. breakout race and I lost....He ran 13.9 something.......it was running in a F.I. class as I was at the time........His ET's varied a lot as I recall but he went deep into eliminations that day.....A Jeep engine was an AMC when I worked on them in the late 70's in a Jeep dealership as a flat rater..... __________________ Rich Biebel S/C 1479 Stock 147R

01-12-2009, 10:27 AM	#3
Owen S Quirion Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Captiol District of New York Posts: 71 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Newbie pondering combos One of my favorite combinations was the Galonka Brothers Caddy Coupe DeVille. Big, Green, and Fast. I like Ed Fernandez's Gremlin too. __________________ BF/S 1985 Grand Am 3.0 V6

01-12-2009, 12:05 PM	#4
Jeff Lee VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Anthem, Arizona Posts: 2,766 Likes: 0 Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Newbie pondering combos The 360 Matador would be the way to go in my opinion. The AMC 401/360 shares the same top end components and the 360 cam is .425" lift (which is plenty) to the 401's .457" lift. I'm, saying not much there in the cam to make you lean one way or the other. The '72-'74 360 HP is ripe for a reduction with NHRA as it is a low compression engine that nobody has tackled yet. The high compression 360 of '70-'71 has received reductions. The ports on the 360/401 are very good and the carb size is adequate, more so on the 360. With the 360 you could switch classes and run a 4bbl or 2bbl. The rear suspension on the Matador is similar to the GM A-Body (Chevelle, GTO, ETC.) so it should work well with normal modifications. The 401 would be no more difficult to build but there is a slight premium on parts. It would be faster but probable less aggressive against the index. At least with the current HP rating. The wagon in question was a 304-2bbl Matador wagon. Good luck! __________________ Jeff Lee 7494 D/S '70 AMX

01-15-2009, 10:31 PM	#5
big blue galaxie Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 36 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Newbie pondering combos I am in the same boat as you, yet after taking a good look at it all it seems like what we have to ask ourselves is what would be the benefit in terms of competetiveness, ease and cost for doing a particular combo. Also, like one other racer said, but I'll paraphrase here, zoom factor. It sucks to run a car that just doesn't squeeze you good down the quarter. My car is big with a small motor and a stick, so unless you gear it and scream the guts out of it, it will not do the job. But if I work at it (ie time and $$$$$$), it can do the job. Any car can. But some cars and combinations are easier. The physics of speed are the same no matter what. The cheap way is to take the lightest car, combined with an engine that conforms to the rules with the best factory available heads and induction, cam and driveline to match. It takes us sitting down and calculating everything out before making a move. What got me excited about Stock Eliminator is seeing late model Mustangs with E7TE heads and stock spec cams going 11's and nudging the 10's. Seeing 301 turbo pontiacs do 12.5's legally, not to mention the big dogs like that Vette that went mid 9's with an L88. Good stuff. This type of racing is hard fought, probably more so than any other that I have seen because the top players have had to make so many sacrifices to squeeze out everything and still be legal. Chevy and Mopar seem easiest to do from a cost benefit point, then Ford, then everybody else. In the end we have to be committed for a class like this, because the more obscure the car combination, the more sacrifice it's going to require.