Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea?

George Wright · 06-24-2025, 09:15 PM

I attended a double in Vegas a few years ago and enjoyed it very much. Doubles work great for divisions that don't have high car counts. I have also attended the St. Louis double a few times and most recently the Norwalk double. Not good. Too many cars. We always get our allocation of qualifying runs cut short, like only one versus three at a regular 3 day points meet. Several times we had to race first round in the dark at 10 PM because they are afraid to use the Sunday rain day. However the Norwalk race had so many rain delays that they had no choice but to use Sunday. Please....NO DOUBLES for Division 3.

Joe Santangelo · 06-24-2025, 09:27 PM

No. They are a FANTASTIC idea.

GTX JOHN · 06-24-2025, 09:29 PM

We love Doubles, they save us a lot of travel
expenses and time!

e vassar · 06-24-2025, 09:38 PM

I love them!
If we lose anymore tracks in D4..we might have a triple.

JeremyDuncan · 06-24-2025, 10:50 PM

Not a Fan of the doubles. Bigger car count divisions should not be having doubles. Especially Wednesday to Saturday.

Also it makes zero sense to run Alcohol Car at doubles. Norwalk usually draws a crowd at Divisonal races. There couldn't have been 100 paid non crew/family spectators for the whole week and weekend at Norwalk. After extensive rain delays they still gave Alcohol cars three qualifiers on Friday and completed their eliminations on Saturday. While SST, STK, SC,SS,& SG only got one qualifier for second race.

Many people bring up an aging participant base, however if you cater to retirees you can't expect younger racers to join the divisional races.

GTS340 · 06-24-2025, 10:51 PM

We are blessed with out west weather. Very few weather delays. We have class run offs in Vegas and Bakersfield. Life is good!

Paul

Lenny5160_v2 · 06-24-2025, 11:49 PM

I like them, but I can certainly sympathize with arguments against them. Vacation days being one, but especially one qualifier for the second event for classes that have non-qualifiers going home without racing.

BIGG18c · 06-25-2025, 10:11 AM

Other than Brainerd my closest divisional is 550 miles one way, doubles are the best option for me cost wise.

Perko · 06-25-2025, 10:22 AM

Wonderful idea.
When considering my travel distances from central Wyoming, closest divisional is Acton Montana. Any others at least 450 to 900 miles away.
Weather and days off are always a problem regardless of location or event.
But the two grade points in two races without additional travel expense is a plus.
Steve

BKSG1198 · 06-27-2025, 07:28 AM

I think no matter what you're going to not make everyone happy; we have to face it the tracks that want to host a divisional event are becoming few and far between and they have to make money also, so big car counts like the 600+ at Norwalk last weekend help and would have been more if VMP wasn't going on. You also have to look at the fact of we basically need 7 / 8 grade points to enter a national event, and I can see the quotas probably going down even more in the near future, it's all about cost factors, I can see each NE going to 3 days (except Indy) because less days to pay employees and these tracks somewhat taking a stand to say we aren't making money on these events. When I sat down and did my 2025 schedule I said no Leb Valley or Epping but double Norwalk, Numidia, VMP and that gets me 6 GP and add Cecil and MG to the mix to get me 8 at only 5 weekends of traveling compared to 8 weekends of traveling. Yes, the Wed / Thursday & Fri/Sat kind of stink for the working man but if they get weather like we had in Norwalk we have Sunday to fall back on to complete the event. I know in D1 we are looking at Thursday to Sunday and at the rate we're going in the NE with weather, no doubt I see one of those events going to Monday unfortunately but I love the doubles personally.

06-24-2025, 09:15 PM	#1
George Wright Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 185 Likes: 10 Liked 408 Times in 35 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? I attended a double in Vegas a few years ago and enjoyed it very much. Doubles work great for divisions that don't have high car counts. I have also attended the St. Louis double a few times and most recently the Norwalk double. Not good. Too many cars. We always get our allocation of qualifying runs cut short, like only one versus three at a regular 3 day points meet. Several times we had to race first round in the dark at 10 PM because they are afraid to use the Sunday rain day. However the Norwalk race had so many rain delays that they had no choice but to use Sunday. Please....NO DOUBLES for Division 3. __________________ George Wright https://9500rpm.com Last edited by George Wright; 06-24-2025 at 09:18 PM.

06-24-2025, 09:27 PM	#2
Joe Santangelo Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: MARLBOROUGH CT Posts: 163 Likes: 228 Liked 207 Times in 20 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? No. They are a FANTASTIC idea.

06-24-2025, 09:29 PM	#3
GTX JOHN VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Boulder City, Nevada 89005 Posts: 2,741 Likes: 2,830 Liked 2,513 Times in 701 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? We love Doubles, they save us a lot of travel expenses and time! __________________ John Irving 741 Stock 741 Super Stock

06-24-2025, 09:38 PM	#4
e vassar Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Posts: 384 Likes: 68 Liked 272 Times in 108 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? I love them! If we lose anymore tracks in D4..we might have a triple.

06-24-2025, 10:50 PM	#5
JeremyDuncan Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 267 Likes: 1,199 Liked 355 Times in 80 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? Not a Fan of the doubles. Bigger car count divisions should not be having doubles. Especially Wednesday to Saturday. Also it makes zero sense to run Alcohol Car at doubles. Norwalk usually draws a crowd at Divisonal races. There couldn't have been 100 paid non crew/family spectators for the whole week and weekend at Norwalk. After extensive rain delays they still gave Alcohol cars three qualifiers on Friday and completed their eliminations on Saturday. While SST, STK, SC,SS,& SG only got one qualifier for second race. Many people bring up an aging participant base, however if you cater to retirees you can't expect younger racers to join the divisional races.

06-24-2025, 10:51 PM	#6
GTS340 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Las Vegas, Nv Posts: 878 Likes: 285 Liked 1,359 Times in 415 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? We are blessed with out west weather. Very few weather delays. We have class run offs in Vegas and Bakersfield. Life is good! Paul

06-24-2025, 11:49 PM	#7
Lenny5160_v2 Member Join Date: Feb 2023 Location: Inver Grove Heights, MN Posts: 179 Likes: 496 Liked 226 Times in 97 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? I like them, but I can certainly sympathize with arguments against them. Vacation days being one, but especially one qualifier for the second event for classes that have non-qualifiers going home without racing. __________________ Tony Leonard S/ST 56 S/C 53

06-25-2025, 10:11 AM	#8
BIGG18c Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2021 Location: North Dakota Posts: 47 Likes: 22 Liked 43 Times in 18 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? Other than Brainerd my closest divisional is 550 miles one way, doubles are the best option for me cost wise. __________________ Grant Christianson C521 S/G,S/C, S/PRO

06-25-2025, 10:22 AM	#9
Perko Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Wyoming Posts: 9 Likes: 1 Liked 15 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? Wonderful idea. When considering my travel distances from central Wyoming, closest divisional is Acton Montana. Any others at least 450 to 900 miles away. Weather and days off are always a problem regardless of location or event. But the two grade points in two races without additional travel expense is a plus. Steve

06-27-2025, 07:28 AM	#10
BKSG1198 VIP Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Vineland, NJ Posts: 2,643 Likes: 96 Liked 1,308 Times in 399 Posts	Re: Do you think the divisional doubles are a good idea? I think no matter what you're going to not make everyone happy; we have to face it the tracks that want to host a divisional event are becoming few and far between and they have to make money also, so big car counts like the 600+ at Norwalk last weekend help and would have been more if VMP wasn't going on. You also have to look at the fact of we basically need 7 / 8 grade points to enter a national event, and I can see the quotas probably going down even more in the near future, it's all about cost factors, I can see each NE going to 3 days (except Indy) because less days to pay employees and these tracks somewhat taking a stand to say we aren't making money on these events. When I sat down and did my 2025 schedule I said no Leb Valley or Epping but double Norwalk, Numidia, VMP and that gets me 6 GP and add Cecil and MG to the mix to get me 8 at only 5 weekends of traveling compared to 8 weekends of traveling. Yes, the Wed / Thursday & Fri/Sat kind of stink for the working man but if they get weather like we had in Norwalk we have Sunday to fall back on to complete the event. I know in D1 we are looking at Thursday to Sunday and at the rate we're going in the NE with weather, no doubt I see one of those events going to Monday unfortunately but I love the doubles personally.