HELP,HELP pontiac gurus

Mike Jones · 10-31-2017, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craiger

UGGGH!!! ok so I can not wring this motor where I want to. Bought a set of Molnar rods so maybe it will live @6200-6400 rpm. It is a street car with a pro-shift nash 5 speed but I like shifting at 7000+ rpm ,looks like I will have to learn to shift at 6200. non-tubbed car will be fun trying to hook up this
torque monster using 1972 technology. Extended lakewood slappers and a decent adj. shock, 9 or 10 inch tires. Doing a street-strip car like we had in 1972. Frame connectors but no cage.

what rear gear ratio?

Mike A114

Bunkster · 11-01-2017, 06:03 AM

Jack Mullins 63 Catalina wagon…389/235…4 spd…SS/U circa mid seventies…

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0212hpp-pontiac-history/

Mullins had what many Pontiac racers might call an aggressive driving style because that is what it took to win. He’d generally leave at 7500 rpm, shifting into Second at 6300, while Third and Fourth were engaged at 6800 rpm. He’d flash through the lights at 7400. “If I was in the final, I’d leave at 8200,” Mullins recalled. At that point I wasn’t worried about going another round. I could pick up 5 or 6 hundredths doing that.” Amazingly, he only had one bottom-end failure. “The crank did come out in three pieces, but that only happened once,” he said.

Dwight Southerland · 11-01-2017, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bunkster

Jack Mullins 63 Catalina wagon…389/235…4 spd…SS/U circa mid seventies…

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0212hpp-pontiac-history/

Mullins had what many Pontiac racers might call an aggressive driving style because that is what it took to win. He’d generally leave at 7500 rpm, shifting into Second at 6300, while Third and Fourth were engaged at 6800 rpm. He’d flash through the lights at 7400. “If I was in the final, I’d leave at 8200,” Mullins recalled. At that point I wasn’t worried about going another round. I could pick up 5 or 6 hundredths doing that.” Amazingly, he only had one bottom-end failure. “The crank did come out in three pieces, but that only happened once,” he said.

That kind of stuff only works if you are from Arkansas. We are way too backwards and ignorant to make "sofistikated" race car parts work..

Hacksaw · 11-01-2017, 09:25 AM

I've always thought that many Ponco engines had bottom end oiling issues. I would certainly research this area before getting in too deep.

Rich Biebel · 11-01-2017, 10:29 AM

Many years ago we had a customer who raced a '69 or '70 GTO Ram Air Stocker
400 manual trans.

It routinely tore up bearings and cranks and we did many of the usual things known to help a Pontiac especially in the bottom end dept.

It also broke driveline parts since the engine made a lot of TQ.

Eventually he put a Turbo-400 in it and I drove it a few times.

I did like that car and it stayed alive a lot better with the automatic trans...

I cannot picture a 389 going over 8000 rpm for many runs back in the era Jack Mullins raced. I saw that car race. The parts availability back then was a long way from what is available today...

mtkawboy · 11-01-2017, 03:05 PM

craiger, I read it and took it the way you intended it, maybe others didnt. You would be a fool to piss off and turn down help from a long time Pontiac racer and Im sure it was not intended that way

11-01-2017, 06:15 PM

I doubt the heads will be big enough to make power that high, or the camshaft.
Light pieces in the bottom end. Your oiling system is the downfall of that engine living up there. Light rotating pieces is a start. Then oiling system mods. Good luck, I hurt a few pieces just trying to get mine to live at 7000.

a pontiac · 11-01-2017, 06:22 PM

If you want to build a replicate a 1972 build expect to run 1972 et 's. A new Pontiac build would include forged crank, good rods {eagle-crower}, light pistons, total seal ring pkg. S/S head porting, 640 or more roller cam and you can see 7500 all day without carrying a broom and dust pan.

11-01-2017, 06:03 AM	#2
Bunkster Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 307 Likes: 0 Liked 43 Times in 10 Posts	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus Jack Mullins 63 Catalina wagon…389/235…4 spd…SS/U circa mid seventies… http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0212hpp-pontiac-history/ Mullins had what many Pontiac racers might call an aggressive driving style because that is what it took to win. He’d generally leave at 7500 rpm, shifting into Second at 6300, while Third and Fourth were engaged at 6800 rpm. He’d flash through the lights at 7400. “If I was in the final, I’d leave at 8200,” Mullins recalled. At that point I wasn’t worried about going another round. I could pick up 5 or 6 hundredths doing that.” Amazingly, he only had one bottom-end failure. “The crank did come out in three pieces, but that only happened once,” he said.

11-01-2017, 09:25 AM	#4
Hacksaw Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Posts: 881 Likes: 206 Liked 308 Times in 173 Posts	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus I've always thought that many Ponco engines had bottom end oiling issues. I would certainly research this area before getting in too deep.

11-01-2017, 10:29 AM	#5
Rich Biebel VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern New Jersey suburbs Posts: 2,314 Likes: 25 Liked 544 Times in 213 Posts	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus Many years ago we had a customer who raced a '69 or '70 GTO Ram Air Stocker 400 manual trans. It routinely tore up bearings and cranks and we did many of the usual things known to help a Pontiac especially in the bottom end dept. It also broke driveline parts since the engine made a lot of TQ. Eventually he put a Turbo-400 in it and I drove it a few times. I did like that car and it stayed alive a lot better with the automatic trans... I cannot picture a 389 going over 8000 rpm for many runs back in the era Jack Mullins raced. I saw that car race. The parts availability back then was a long way from what is available today... __________________ Rich Biebel S/C 1479 Stock 147R Last edited by Rich Biebel; 11-01-2017 at 10:32 AM.

11-01-2017, 03:05 PM	#6
mtkawboy Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Billings Mt Posts: 281 Likes: 182 Liked 54 Times in 18 Posts	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus craiger, I read it and took it the way you intended it, maybe others didnt. You would be a fool to piss off and turn down help from a long time Pontiac racer and Im sure it was not intended that way

11-01-2017, 06:15 PM	#7
Todd Hoven Guest Posts: n/a	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus I doubt the heads will be big enough to make power that high, or the camshaft. Light pieces in the bottom end. Your oiling system is the downfall of that engine living up there. Light rotating pieces is a start. Then oiling system mods. Good luck, I hurt a few pieces just trying to get mine to live at 7000.

11-01-2017, 06:22 PM	#8
a pontiac Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 65 Likes: 3 Liked 36 Times in 11 Posts	Re: HELP,HELP pontiac gurus If you want to build a replicate a 1972 build expect to run 1972 et 's. A new Pontiac build would include forged crank, good rods {eagle-crower}, light pistons, total seal ring pkg. S/S head porting, 640 or more roller cam and you can see 7500 all day without carrying a broom and dust pan.