Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator??

Mark Yacavone · 09-03-2011, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Stinson

That nova that is in my avatar I have raced for years in true 10.5 heads up racing.

That explains why you don't know what you are talking about here.

Nathan Stinson · 09-03-2011, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

That explains why you don't know what you are talking about here.

What exactly does it explain? please do inform me.

Alan Roehrich · 09-03-2011, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Stinson

What exactly does it explain? please do inform me.

Because you have no idea what Stock Eliminator is all about. You race 10.5, that is nothing even remotely similar to Stock Eliminator.

Chris Barnes · 09-03-2011, 11:51 PM

I don't want to jump on anyone but I totally agree with Alan. As such I honestly believe that the new factory drag cars must be put in Super Stock if we are to respect the system as it exists.

That said, there seems to be plenty of potential to race the new Mustangs, Challengers, (and Camaros) in Stock as presented from the showroom. Even that will be a challenge to the rule makers. I do not understand the resistance to creating new classes, even as a stop gap measure. It seemed to work out okay for the FI deal. Why can't we have our cake and eat it too?

Chris Barnes
Wagons of Steel
Stock 6621

Chad Rhodes · 09-03-2011, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

That explains why you don't know what you are talking about here.

I was thinking the exact same thing.

Lew Silverman · 09-03-2011, 05:37 PM

I wasn't going to add my $.02 to this discussion, because I thought everyone understood what the problem here was, but I guess I was wrong......

What Alan is saying is that prior to 2008, all vehicles that were allowed to run in Stock Eliminator were manufactured for and available to the general public, through a dealer network, and register-able and street legal. In other words if it wasn't showroom available, it wasn't legal for Stock! That changed when the NHRA allowed Ford and Chrysler to certify the CJ's and DP's.

And if I raced a Model T and a musclecar with a bogus HP rating came along, I probably would have been just as disappointed as most of us are now.

The status quo in Stock Class has been twisted in favor of the newer vehicles. The only new cars certified to run are the "specials" available to a chosen few. You can't go to your local dealer and buy a car off the showroom and race it in Stock Class, no matter how much work you do, with the exception of the Camaro, and how many of them have we seen?

Not all that hard to understand, really. No need to get upset. Fix the inequitable HP ratings if you can, or give the new cars a class to race themselves if you can't!

Thanks for listening!

Lew

BadBanana · 09-04-2011, 01:14 AM

In my humble opinion, there is ssooo much wrong with Stock and Super Stock racing today, that it is almost beyond fixing !!!
They need to, once again, give it some track and fan appeal. They need less classes instead of more. Less classes with about 15 or 20 cars in each class at the national events - something for the fans to get pumped about - then NHRA will once again get pumped about it.
To do this they need to get the hp ratings straight, for old and new cars, so they can both compete.......and they need to get the indexs right so only the very best cars can run under, The fans don't want to see, and don't understand, how a guy in a given class can win eliminator when he can run .10 under, when there are other similarly classed cars that can run .90 under, because of the dial under and breakout rules.
We don't want to make S and S/S look like Super Gas and Super Comp , do we???? If you love these cars, you don't !!!
Get the hp ratings much, much closer and fairer and reduce the class indexs so that very few (only the best) can run under. Then fairly make fewer classes There will be more cars in each class and more all-out racing. The fans will love it, the racers who can still compete will love it/ those who can't, won't like it but can go bracket racing in S/G or whatever. Some will leave the ranks and some will return to the ranks because they will be RACING again.
Right now, the only people who like these classses are those who run in it and their friends. The fans don't, and NHRA thinks of it as a "filler" - no more/ no less .... an annoyance, at best.
I guess I have a lot to say after seeing this from the days of the early 60s through today. My opinions won't make everyone happy; but if you're like me you want to line up against cars of equal potential, race hard and all-out, and if you get there first - you win; and if you lose, you go home and work harder, not just change your dial under !!!

Neil Smedley · 09-04-2011, 01:31 AM

You are exactly right in my opinion Mr. Banana. In fact, reading your post fills my eyes with a few tears. I also think the sport is beyond repair..........

BadBanana · 09-04-2011, 01:56 AM

Hey Neil; I knew I could count on you. Not too many of us left !!
How are you doing out there in "bandido land"? Stay safe and say hello to Marilyn for me. I've heard from Paul Dilcher on here and just recently Tony Janes. How did Tony know about Glen Campbell Chev. ? I thought he was a CA boy.
I did the motorcycle ride out rte 66 last June but never made it to Phoenix area. By the time I got to Santa Monica, after riding to Chicago from FL and then Chi. to Santa Monica, I was whipped, so I put the Harley on a truck and flew home. We went through the Okla. City floods and a windstorm in NM, among other things - not bad for someone looking at his 70th B-Day next month. I am now in Wake Forest, NC, closer to my son and grandson.
Would love to meet up with you again and talk about our wonderful trip across the country in 1971 or 1972 with Dean Becker !!!

I'm expecting some "flak" from my previous post from those too young to see what it was like in the early to mid 60s. I remember the first time I was told I "broke out" (at the preNationals meet in Muncie, IN, driiving the '57 Bad Banana). "Broke out what", I said. "You went too fast", they said. "Well, excuuusssee me", I said !!! - "isn't this a race???" At that time you apparently couldn't go more than .20 under the National Record.

BadBanana · 09-04-2011, 02:28 AM

to continue about my first breakout (1964 in Muncie). We had thought we had just won Stock Eliminator over a famous Buick stocker "Big Daddy" or "Daddy" something that I had seen in national Dragster; and Ted Hartman , who owned the Bad Banana was furious (us small town Western New Yorkers had not yet heard of "Brake-outs"); and I had to physically restrain him as he wanted to drive the Bad banana INTO the timing tower.
Being a young college kid at the time, and always hungry, I had made a deal with Ted that every time I ran under the record, I got a Peanut Butter sandwich - so I was happy !!!!
another story here: We didn't have line-locs yet so Ted had put an old hand brake arm, mounter under the steering wheel with a rod down to the brake pedal, so I could use the gas and clutch and, also, hold the car on the line - we, also, had a convex mirror way up on ther front fender so I could see the tire and the staging line.
With the indexs where they are now let's fly into Pomona, get a rental car that fits a good low class, put tires on it and go racing--- and then feel cheated if somone else had an advantage !!!!!
OK, I'll be quiet now !!!

09-03-2011, 11:51 PM	#4
Chris Barnes Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 139 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? I don't want to jump on anyone but I totally agree with Alan. As such I honestly believe that the new factory drag cars must be put in Super Stock if we are to respect the system as it exists. That said, there seems to be plenty of potential to race the new Mustangs, Challengers, (and Camaros) in Stock as presented from the showroom. Even that will be a challenge to the rule makers. I do not understand the resistance to creating new classes, even as a stop gap measure. It seemed to work out okay for the FI deal. Why can't we have our cake and eat it too? Chris Barnes Wagons of Steel Stock 6621

09-03-2011, 05:37 PM	#6
Lew Silverman VIP Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Newport News, VA Posts: 1,435 Likes: 371 Liked 129 Times in 59 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? I wasn't going to add my $.02 to this discussion, because I thought everyone understood what the problem here was, but I guess I was wrong...... What Alan is saying is that prior to 2008, all vehicles that were allowed to run in Stock Eliminator were manufactured for and available to the general public, through a dealer network, and register-able and street legal. In other words if it wasn't showroom available, it wasn't legal for Stock! That changed when the NHRA allowed Ford and Chrysler to certify the CJ's and DP's. And if I raced a Model T and a musclecar with a bogus HP rating came along, I probably would have been just as disappointed as most of us are now. The status quo in Stock Class has been twisted in favor of the newer vehicles. The only new cars certified to run are the "specials" available to a chosen few. You can't go to your local dealer and buy a car off the showroom and race it in Stock Class, no matter how much work you do, with the exception of the Camaro, and how many of them have we seen? Not all that hard to understand, really. No need to get upset. Fix the inequitable HP ratings if you can, or give the new cars a class to race themselves if you can't! Thanks for listening! Lew __________________ Lew Silverman #2070 "The Wagon Master" N/SA

09-04-2011, 01:14 AM	#7
BadBanana Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Wake Forest, NC Posts: 76 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? In my humble opinion, there is ssooo much wrong with Stock and Super Stock racing today, that it is almost beyond fixing !!! They need to, once again, give it some track and fan appeal. They need less classes instead of more. Less classes with about 15 or 20 cars in each class at the national events - something for the fans to get pumped about - then NHRA will once again get pumped about it. To do this they need to get the hp ratings straight, for old and new cars, so they can both compete.......and they need to get the indexs right so only the very best cars can run under, The fans don't want to see, and don't understand, how a guy in a given class can win eliminator when he can run .10 under, when there are other similarly classed cars that can run .90 under, because of the dial under and breakout rules. We don't want to make S and S/S look like Super Gas and Super Comp , do we???? If you love these cars, you don't !!! Get the hp ratings much, much closer and fairer and reduce the class indexs so that very few (only the best) can run under. Then fairly make fewer classes There will be more cars in each class and more all-out racing. The fans will love it, the racers who can still compete will love it/ those who can't, won't like it but can go bracket racing in S/G or whatever. Some will leave the ranks and some will return to the ranks because they will be RACING again. Right now, the only people who like these classses are those who run in it and their friends. The fans don't, and NHRA thinks of it as a "filler" - no more/ no less .... an annoyance, at best. I guess I have a lot to say after seeing this from the days of the early 60s through today. My opinions won't make everyone happy; but if you're like me you want to line up against cars of equal potential, race hard and all-out, and if you get there first - you win; and if you lose, you go home and work harder, not just change your dial under !!!

09-04-2011, 01:31 AM	#8
Neil Smedley Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 163 Likes: 32 Liked 22 Times in 7 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? You are exactly right in my opinion Mr. Banana. In fact, reading your post fills my eyes with a few tears. I also think the sport is beyond repair..........

09-04-2011, 01:56 AM	#9
BadBanana Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Wake Forest, NC Posts: 76 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? Hey Neil; I knew I could count on you. Not too many of us left !! How are you doing out there in "bandido land"? Stay safe and say hello to Marilyn for me. I've heard from Paul Dilcher on here and just recently Tony Janes. How did Tony know about Glen Campbell Chev. ? I thought he was a CA boy. I did the motorcycle ride out rte 66 last June but never made it to Phoenix area. By the time I got to Santa Monica, after riding to Chicago from FL and then Chi. to Santa Monica, I was whipped, so I put the Harley on a truck and flew home. We went through the Okla. City floods and a windstorm in NM, among other things - not bad for someone looking at his 70th B-Day next month. I am now in Wake Forest, NC, closer to my son and grandson. Would love to meet up with you again and talk about our wonderful trip across the country in 1971 or 1972 with Dean Becker !!! I'm expecting some "flak" from my previous post from those too young to see what it was like in the early to mid 60s. I remember the first time I was told I "broke out" (at the preNationals meet in Muncie, IN, driiving the '57 Bad Banana). "Broke out what", I said. "You went too fast", they said. "Well, excuuusssee me", I said !!! - "isn't this a race???" At that time you apparently couldn't go more than .20 under the National Record.

09-04-2011, 02:28 AM	#10
BadBanana Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Wake Forest, NC Posts: 76 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Back from Indy-what's happened to Stock Eliminator?? to continue about my first breakout (1964 in Muncie). We had thought we had just won Stock Eliminator over a famous Buick stocker "Big Daddy" or "Daddy" something that I had seen in national Dragster; and Ted Hartman , who owned the Bad Banana was furious (us small town Western New Yorkers had not yet heard of "Brake-outs"); and I had to physically restrain him as he wanted to drive the Bad banana INTO the timing tower. Being a young college kid at the time, and always hungry, I had made a deal with Ted that every time I ran under the record, I got a Peanut Butter sandwich - so I was happy !!!! another story here: We didn't have line-locs yet so Ted had put an old hand brake arm, mounter under the steering wheel with a rod down to the brake pedal, so I could use the gas and clutch and, also, hold the car on the line - we, also, had a convex mirror way up on ther front fender so I could see the tire and the staging line. With the indexs where they are now let's fly into Pomona, get a rental car that fits a good low class, put tires on it and go racing--- and then feel cheated if somone else had an advantage !!!!! OK, I'll be quiet now !!!