'66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction

[Paul Precht]

Originally Posted by treessavoy

Paul,

I had a 1964 Valiant with a 225 and a 4 speed with the 7 1/4. I raced it in stock class and E/mp (cam and 4bbl) at ATCO......broke 5 rear ends in one year...it was truly worthless!

JimR

Hi Jim, how fast was the 225 Valliant, Paul.

[treessavoy]

Originally Posted by Paul Precht

Hi Jim, how fast was the 225 Valliant, Paul.

Paul,

Bone stock with some tuning, on street tires it ran high 16's but every launch was scary, never new when the rear end would give up.

With a 4 bbl manifold, small Carter, cam and homemade headers we got it down into the mid 15's with Atlas bucrons. Oiling was a big problem, if it got starved or oil was low you would lose no. 6 cyl but the starter usually kept the piston from going thru the hood....lol!

JimR

[Paul Ceasrine]

Bill and Alan,
Not sure if you saw the 1966 "Mods For Mopar 273" article by
Eric Dahlquist. With Tom Hoover and Mike Buckle of Chrysler. Article posted February 1966. All detailed info on valve spacing and sizing for the 273, as well as Part #'s. It was the early stages of develpoment for the D-Dart 275 HP.
As crazy as it sounds, they knew that the 9 1/4" Auburn clutch on the
273's were poor, and they were recommending a 9 1/4" clutch from a 1953 Dodge V-8 (Borg & Beck #1220). Hard to imagine in 1966 they were recommending a 13 year old part #, as a performance upgrade.
Paul

[bill dedman]

Paul, I think I do remember reading that article, now that you mention it.

Hard to imagine that Chrysler engineering would put such a poor match for that engine's potential in a vehicle designed for clutch abuse. That is way out of character for that group.

It wasn't the only one, though. Can you imagine how different the street scene would have been through the '60s if Ma Mopar had had the imagination and determination to build
1. A 440, 6-Pack A Body car such as a bare bones 1969 Valiant 2-door sedan, or '70 Duster with that same motor, or

2. an assembly-line available, 340 or 360 motor with heads that had W-2 flow capabilities, solid lifter cams with .550"+ and 260-degree duration at .050"-lift, and a lighter reciprocating assembly?

3. Small blocks with correct lifter-angle lifter bores and 5 head bolts?

It's amazing they ever outran anybody with the truck/tractor parts they put in those reciprocating assemblies (SO heavy!!!) And, the "X" heads had great intake ports, but, the world's worst exhaust ports....

If they'd not been so intent on Hemi technology, at the expense of everything else, it could have been a whole different ballgame out there on the street in '62 thru '71...

All the parts were already right there (with the exception of the cams and the lifter-bore geometry.)

It was almost like they didn't really WANT to win...

Chevrolet had nothing LIKE a 440, 6-pack '69 Valiant.... the 396 Chevy Novas would have been dead meat; they were 200 pounds heaver and had 44 less cubic inches.

Can you imagine a Stage III, Max-wedge/727-equipped '64 Valiant on the street??? In 1964??? LOL!

Somebody ay MoPar was asleep at the wheel... or, didn't care.

Too bad.... It could have been so very different, if they'd concentrated on A-Bodies instead of B-Bodies for the street. Weight = Horsepower....

[Paul Ceasrine]

Bill,
You hit the nail right on the head, with that list.
Ouch!! 5-head bolts per cylinder would have been the problem solver.
We tried every damn head gasket out there, and nothing ever seemed to work for any duration.
A Max-Wedge in a 64' Valiant. Now that would have been one missle that no one could touch. One problem though, I think the only way you could stop it would be to drive into the front-end of a D-9 Cat Bull-Dozer!
I think Chrysler missed the boat on not developing a big-block for the
1970 Dusters and later Demons. Maybe with aluminum heads (Max-Wedge Stage III design) and aluminum intake to lighten the front-end load (ie; L-89 big-block aluminum Chevy heads).
As for 273 head mods. The article states that 1.94" (Chrysler 354 Hemi)
intakes can be utilized, as long as the stem was shortened by .060.
Paul

[ddartdude]

Paul,
I thought that I measured the intake valves on the "Mecum" auction cars engine when I had the heads off it. I thought they were 1.87's. I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. This is one of the slugs in it. No relief for the valves.
Alan

[ddartdude]

Paul,
I was looking through my magazine stash and dug these out. Believe it or not, there were a lot of magazine articles written on the little 273. All these have article on building the 273 engine.

Chrysler Race Bulletin Number 8
273/318/340 CI ----- (340 CI hand written on the coversheet)
Engine Tune-Up Tips
Includes D/Dart engine parts and build up

Hot Rod -- February 1966
Power Mods For MoPar's 273
Has pictures of Koffel's C/FX engine

Car Craft --- March 1966
Fine Pair of Fish
-- Ralph Costa's "The Politician" and The Golden Commando's "Goldfish"
-- No build up, just a comparison of the two cars

Hot Rod Parts Illustrated --- May 1966
Dodge Hemi & 273 Performance Bulletins

Super/Stock and FX Magazine --- June 1966
More dig for the 273 Dart
-- D/MP Dart w/Offy dual quad intake - Carter carbs -- 300 HP

Rodder and Super/Stock --- September 1965
Same article as in SS&FX Magazine --- June 1966

Speed and Custom --- August 1966
Blueprint for Performance -- 273 Drag Secrets Revealed

SuperStock & Drag Illustrated --- May 1967
Spehar's 273 Incher
-- 1966 D/Dart --- "The Politician" --- D/S

Car Craft --- July 1968
Ted Spehar on Mopars
-- 1965 Barracuda --- "The Politician" --- F/SA

Car Life --- July 1970
Mopar Magic

Enjoy
Alan

[dart4forte]

Originally Posted by ddartdude

Paul,
I thought that I measured the intake valves on the "Mecum" auction cars engine when I had the heads off it. I thought they were 1.87's. I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. This is one of the slugs in it. No relief for the valves.
Alan

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