Class win

[Herbie Null]

Mike this is my original POST:Sometimes it is easier to point the finger at others than ourself. We always refer to the old days, in the old days there was just super stock. No GT, modified, trucks and so on. Now with all the single runs, class is a joke. I have seen cars come to a class race and move to a different class just because no one was there in a particular class and they could make a bye run. I have even done this myself, it did not feel real good holding my little WALLY. That is why everyone watches classes with the most car counts, GT/AA-SS/AH-SS/JA there are many more you get my meaning. Instead of adding or removing weight to run from other class cars, now we can do the opposite. We can all move to a class where we have to run heads up for the WALLY, maybe they should not give out class wins for a single bye run period. That would bring back the old days in a hurry, take your licking go home and work on your stuff. Now for the blind fold, ready aim FIRE!!!
I also said:if you chose to build a car that has no one in a class thats your choice. You can still bracket race in the Eliminator, you wont even have a heads up run on race day. Just dont complain about a class WALLY. we wont our cake and eat it too. Mike we can all move up or down a class by adding weight so that there is a heads up run for the class win. If chose to run solo you are still in the Eliminator as long as you make the feild. You just dont get a WALLY for just showing up!

[Mike Carr]

I'd like to agree with most of that. Some of it's not true, at least pertaining to my car(s). From 2001-2005, I raced in Stock driving for Billy Nees, an HF/SA Sunbird, and later an AF/S Sunbird when NHRA screwed up the FWD classes. He built the cars, and allowed me to race them. I didn't have the option on what to drive. I was grateful enough just to have a ride. It would have been totally ignorant of me to go to Billy and say "Build me something else". By your line of thinking, I didn't deserve my three Wally's because Billy didn't build me a car in a class with multiple entrants. Shame on us.

I know all about adjusting weight. With the HF/SA, you could NOT move to another class.. HF/SA was a 27.5 pound class. The lowest of the (then) sixteen FWD Classes. Minimum weight of 2,508. GF/SA was 23.50-27.49 pound class. Minimum weight was 2,168. No way in hell a four door Sunbird like that was getting to 200 pounds lighter than a two door, fiberglass and carbon fiber Pro Stock. Can't make G weight, and there is no IF/SA to drop to. So the car was stuck in HF/SA only.

What do you want done? Should NHRA abolish all the classes that don't have x-amount of annual participants? Should everyone build/buy/borrow a new car so they can compete in a class with multiple entries?

For years, the rule was simple--win Class, you're in. Even later on, the wording was "128 cars--Class Winners + Low ET Qualifiers". Never said anything about how many cars were in a Class. Show up, win Class, you're in. Period. It was that way until 2008.

If it will make you happy, I will take out a loan, build/buy another car, go into a class with three or more cars in it, win Class and hope others in my class show up, so I will then be a deserving Class Winner in your eyes. As far as contigency, it's been around for years, even with all the undeserving bye runs. I got a hundred bucks each year. It was spent before I got home. I had what I wanted--an Indy Wally. I could have cared less about the money. I went for the trophy and bragging rights. Too bad no one else showed up to run me so I could have earned it, in your eyes.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[Herbie Null]

Originally Posted by bigshow2966

But that would really screw the guys who really are the only car in their class. My buddy with the V/SA car is normally the only one on the grounds, and he can still run .6 under at least with the index change and add HP he got last year. I think the only time he has run anyone is when Lane Weber is there, maybe at Denver?

Maybe just make cars stick to the class they pre-registered in, no changing class at the track.

This is the point I was trying to make. If he wanted to win class, he would have built a class car to compete to race other cars, if you chose to build a car that has no one in a class thats your choice. You can still bracket race in the Eliminator, you wont even have a heads up run on race day. Just dont complain about a class WALLY. we wont our cake and eat it too. lol

[Bobby Fazio]

Originally Posted by Herbie Null

This is the point I was trying to make. If he wanted to win class, he would have built a class car to compete to race other cars, if you chose to build a car that has no one in a class thats your choice. You can still bracket race in the Eliminator, you wont even have a heads up run on race day. Just dont complain about a class WALLY. we wont our cake and eat it too. lol

Herbie, first off I remember you from when I was a kid and you are a very good racer!

However, I strongly disagree with what you are saying here. You want us to not win class because no one else is in our class? He runs V/SA, no one else would dare to run that class so why not have him win class? If someone doesn't like that then they should go build a V/SA car and compete against him. Like I said earlier I'm usually the only SS/L car when I'm out there, so what's wrong with my getting the bye run? No one wants to build an SS/L car because first off no one wants a stick car for obvious reasons of consistency, parts abuse, etc. and second it's a tough combination to work with (Believe me I'm pulling my hair out most of the time). Kip Martin has perfected it, I have not.

I know you said in the old days you would run, go home, and work on your stuff.. That sounds cool and I wish I was around back then but I have a feeling back then it was within alot more of average racers' means to keep going home and working on a combo. Am I supposed to sell my car and build a typical chevy or mopar that runs a particular class, simply because everyone else does? Kinda goes back to "If Johnny jumps off a bridge would you?" That would kill any diversity left in Class Racing.

[Herbie Null]

No one ever said class racing was easy, all i was trying to say is that 20 or more solo passes for class is a joke. Do you think they like just giving out Wally's and class money for nothing. Class payouts have all but gone, who wants to hand out money just because the guy showed up at the race. Most class racers will understand what I am saying. It does not matter what you say on this site, you will offend someone and I am sorry this offended you. We can't complain if we do not try to change, the way it has been going is not working. What do you suggest to help class racing survive in the future. We all cant just make solo passes and win class

[Mike Carr]

Originally Posted by Herbie Null

Class payouts have all but gone, who wants to hand out money just because the guy showed up at the race.

Herbie, I'm not sure I follow your thinking, so help me out here.

A racer goes all over to gain the necisary six grade points to be able to compete at Indy. They pay their $300 entry, take their vacation time, show up, race, make their Class Run, win their class, run quick enough, meet all the requirements (ET, weight, fuel, teardown, etc) and are declared Class Winner. Now, just because no one else could/would bother to do the same, that person should be denied their Class Win, even though they met all of NHRA's requrements to do so? because no one else showed up?

Am I missing something here? Should I have paid the entry for the other dozen or so HF/SA's to come race? Should I have talked to their bosses to give them the time off? Should I have tried to raise money to have a shootout to attract more participation? Paid their expenses? Should I have told Billy to build me another car to drive? Should I have borrowed a car for Indy, one that ran in a Class with three or more cars in it? I did all that I could do, and that NHRA required me to do, for me to be a Class Winner. I shouldn't be penalized for circumstances beyone my control (no one else showing up). If you went to Indy, and all the GT/BA racers had entered into the GT/AA Shootout and you were all alone in GT/BA, should NHRA take your Class money and Class Wally away and say "Sorry Herbie, you were a bye run, no Class Win for you. So long, and thanks for coming". I'f I'm missing something, please fill me in.

[bigshow2966]

Originally Posted by Herbie Null

This is the point I was trying to make. If he wanted to win class, he would have built a class car to compete to race other cars, if you chose to build a car that has no one in a class thats your choice. You can still bracket race in the Eliminator, you wont even have a heads up run on race day. Just dont complain about a class WALLY. we wont our cake and eat it too. lol

Mike didn't intentionally build the car in that class to avoid heads-up runs, he built the car because he wanted to race a Slant 6 and that is the only class he fits in. His original plan was to build the car, make it competitive, hopefully set a national record, and then sell it. Well, he's done all but the last, and he is keeping the car because he is having too much fun racing it.

Just so you know, Mike was a Slant 6 bracket racer and had one of the fastest Slant cars on the planet. He wanted to race Stock because so many people told him that a Slant could never be competitive. Good thing he didn't listen to them, huh?