Ukraine

[RonP]

I'm surprised there is not a thread on this topic.
I for one, am very impressed at how well the Ukrainians are defending their homeland.
They are definitely outgunned, and doing a hell of a job with what they do have.

1) Do you think we should be helping more than we are?
2) Do you think we should enforce a no fly zone over Ukrainian held territory?
3) It seems to me the Russian military is far over-rated
4) Or are the Ukrainians under-rated?
5) For those who respond, let me know if you do or do not have military training or experience (I am no & no myself).
6) If yes to #5, what branch of service and when & where.

What are other thoughts and opinions?
Not to turn this into an argument between political parties.
I think our present administration is too slow to react,....resulting in more deaths.

Ron

[L.Fite]

I too think the Ukrainians are holding up well until now...
How long they last is the question, no doubt they have the will...
Putin has backed himself into a corner, He has no option but to win if he is to remain in power.

So...

1) What is it we can do?...
The Ukrainians have soviet style equipment and training, Our stuff does not interchange, and depending on the system, they are untrained and it's to late for training...

Sending "advisors" is tricky (you then have Americans in harms way, and potential for it to drag us into a war)

How hard do you want to poke a bear sitting on 6000 nukes?

2) My heart says yes, but my brain says, probably not a good idea
How will Putin react to a direct confrontation from the west?
(see #1 above)

Putin won't use nukes until he feels he will loose power...
Where is the point he begins to feel he is slipping...
Then all bets are off.

3) Probably...

4) Possibly, they are fighting for their country and their land, they are a proud people...

It's not like they are fighting for some one else's jungle/desert...

Ukraine has been fighting for it's existence ever since the first people landed there.

I hope they can prevail (without dragging the world kicking and screaming into W.W. III... )

[jmcarter]

Like many I’ve been a bit ambivalent about this despite my sense of outage over what Putin is doing. We’ve made such a mess of so many foreign policy decisions in the past. Perhaps Vietnam being the worse case but Afghanistan being the most recent. We stayed on the sidelines while thousands were killed in Syria, many despite the crossing of a certain “red line”. But I’ve always detested a bully and the surest way of encouraging them is to take ineffective measures to deter them. I read again John Domme’s famous poem and think we need to redouble our aide to Ukrainian peoples and enforce a No Fly Zone and then let the chips fall where may.

No man is an island,
Entire of itself,
Every man is a piece of the continent,
A part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less.
As well as if a promontory were.
As well as if a manor of thy friend's
Or of thine own were:
Any man's death diminishes me,
Because I am involved in mankind,
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell
tolls;
It tolls for thee.
*

[Eddies66]

I do not doubt for one second that NATO, the US included have had boots on the ground and have had since 2014. The Russian have not changed their tactics since WWII. It is obvious to me that the Ukrainian Forces have. I wish them only the best.

With regards to the use of nuclear weapons, Russia has little interest in sending nuclear bombs to Ukraine. Moscow is only 800 kilometers from Kyiv for example. Putin would put his own capital at risk of radioactive fallout. I do not even speak about the Russian army on the ground in Ukraine which would be irradiated. Is it in Putin's interest to put his own army at risk?

I don't think so.

The use of chemical weapons is a strong possibility. I do not believe in nuclear weapons, even if we cannot rule out any possibility

[Eddies66]

Originally Posted by RonP

I'm surprised there is not a thread on this topic.
I for one, am very impressed at how well the Ukrainians are defending their homeland.
They are definitely outgunned, and doing a hell of a job with what they do have.

1) Do you think we should be helping more than we are?
2) Do you think we should enforce a no fly zone over Ukrainian held territory?
3) It seems to me the Russian military is far over-rated
4) Or are the Ukrainians under-rated?
5) For those who respond, let me know if you do or do not have military training or combat experience (I am no & no myself).
6) If yes to #5, what branch of service and when & where.

What are other thoughts and opinions?
Not to turn this into an argument between political parties.
I think our present administration is too slow to react,....resulting in more deaths.

Ron

Military experience: 24 years Marine Corps. MOS 2362 and 5715 Tactical Nuclear Weapons Tech and Officer in Charge of a Nuclear Ordnance Platoon. Beirut 84 and Desert Storm 91.

[r429469]

I would wager there are some things the US is doing that is not privy
to the news reporters and independent journalists.

[Eddies66]

Originally Posted by r429469

I would wager there are some things the US is doing that is not privy
to the news reporters and independent journalists.

You could bet the farm on that one!!

[RonP]

It appears to me that the perpetual bombing of eastern Ukrainian cities will accomplish breeding life long enemies of Russia. Not to mention that Stalin starved the Ukrainians back in the 1930's too.

Looks like Finland and Sweden are next to join NATO.
The Finns were at war with Russia twice during WWII,...the Winter War and Continuation War. I don't remember the details, but Russia annexed a significant chunk of Finland at the end of WWII,....and Poland for that matter.