Best Pontiac Powered Stockers

[Rat Patrol]

Originally Posted by oldskool

And here's a little more. These are the class winners at the '71 Indy race.

The guy posting said he had to guess at some of the cars. Anyhow, it shows that Truman Fields won D/S, in his '68 Bird, & Arnie Toftland
won I/SA in a '71 Lemans.

NHRA Junior Stock

In '65, Leroy Stutzman picked right where Don Gay had left off in '64, winning the A/S class.

NHRA Junior Stock

Would any of you Pontiac gentlemen have a pic of Leroy Stutzmans 63 Pontiac, named ‘Mr Pontiac’ ?

[DeuceCoupe]

Originally Posted by oldskool

On P-14, the 7-11 Packer Pontiac is mentioned. The caption for the pic of that car explains how some of the big Pontiacs were shipped with a 348hp engine under the hood, but had lots of upgrade parts in the trunk, with which a guy could build his motor to run at 368hp.

They say that car was totaled in a towing accident, in '62, but not before scoring a class RU, at the '62 Nats, running 12.90's.

Apparently Packer sponsored several big Pontiacs back in the early '60's. Here's one with 7-16 on it. The 2nd pic is of a recreation of that car that was totaled.

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2007/1...gstrips-again/



The 3rd pic looks to be a recreation or rstoration of a later year model, with 7-11 on it. The 4th pic is of a silver '63 Cat. Don't know how accurate these cars are to a car that was actually raced. Also don't know if some are actually a restoration of the original race car.

This article says the silver "Swiss Cheese" car set a C/S nat record in '63, @ 12.27.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/drive...ction/9658243/

This is a great thread, not just for Pontiac but for all the NHRA results & entry sheets.

I remember reading the Swiss Cheese C/S story before.
Always wondered:
* How could a Swiss Cheese car (a couple dozen made?) run in NHRA Stock ANYTHING?

* How could it run in C/S=10.60 W/P back in 1963-65?
The car would have to be ballasted from its 3300 lb Swiss Cheese weight up to 4300+ lb to fit the C/S class. You could drop an entire extra 421 engine & trans in the trunk & the car would still be too light for C/S class.

The C/S=10.60 record as Sep 1963 was 13.25 at 107.65 by Broadhead's 60 Catalina 389 Super Duty.

As of April 1965, the C/S=10.60 record was reset, again by Broadhead's 60 Pontiac, at 12.94 at 110.29.

These are both slower than the Swiss Cheese 12.27 ET, in whatever class it was run. I thought about C/FX instead of C/S but the car is way too light for C/FX.

It would really help history if we knew the real story on the Swiss Cheese cars running in NHRA (maybe in B/FX?), how they ran, what class this car ran its 12.27 in, etc.

[oldskool]

Well, I may have mentioned that Bruce Noland has a '69 Firebird Stocker. He was suppose to debut it a year or 2 ago, but, as far as I know, never did.

I just recently looked over the Stock pre-entry list for the upcoming US Nats. Bruce is listed with a C/SA '69 Trans Am.

https://www.nhraeventreg.com/ListEve...II1&cc=8&rn=17

If that happens, it will be the 1st '69 Trans Am Stocker that I've heard of, certainly the 1st in the modern era. Even tho it's not an original T/A, it'll still be cool & will be a one-of-a-kind Stocker.

The only active '69 Bird Stocker I know of belongs to long time Pontiac racer John Schloe. I've read that he ran a RAIV engine, 'til he cracked a head. Has run a D-port 400 since then. He still runs 10's with it. But, because of the NHRA hp factors, the '68 Birds are more competitive. But, a '69 is fine, as long as you don't have a same-class heads-up run, against a strong car.

IIRC, the only 2 engines available in a '69 T/A were the RAIII & RAIV. The RAIII has a terrible hp factor. Maybe Bruce can race it long enuff to get the hp factor reduced. OR, maybe he has a set of the rare, high dollar RAIV heads he's gonna race.

So, anybody here have the latest news about Bruce's Bird ?

Looked for Bruce's FB page. There I found some pics of his '69 T/A. It has an alum factory intake on it, or maybe a reproduction. So, I suppose that means he's gonna run a RAIV engine. Lookin forward to seeing how it does. Hope he runs it at Indy.

[muel7]

[QUOTE=oldskool;619695]Well, that's a very interesting post, which brings up more questions.

(1) So, what happened to the 2nd '72 Lemans or GTO, that is NOT the one you're talkin about. TWO cars & TWO drivers were mentioned on the same Q-list. Any info on the other car ? Did it also belong to either the Axemakers or the Reulands ? In fact, on that same Q-list, there was another '72 Lemans, driven by Jon Wacholtz. Anybody know anything about it ?

Just to clarify your confusion, there has only ever been one car, which is the brown '72 GTO that we still own. Dad (Dave Reuland) and the Axemaker brothers are first cousins, which was how the team came to fruition. They began racing locally in the '70s, and began building the GTO in '76-77. The four of them would switch driving duties when they were available. At a later point the '71 Formula HO Bird was acquired and added to the stable. The driving arrangement continued mostly until the turn of the century with both cars. Denny eventually went out on his own and got another GTO which he still has and plans to race again this year, dad got full ownership of the original '72 GTO, and the Bird remained Ken's. Wacholtz was a family friend, a tile-man from Austin, MN, and a real good friend to Denny until he passed away a few years back. He was a big Pontiac guy with a massive collection. Last I heard his car that was on the sheet was acquired by an owner overseas and it still goes down the track.

In 2003 dad stepped away from racing and sold the GTO to a local racer, while the Axemakers sparsely raced as well. The history has already been said before, but we asked Ken to drive the Bird in '07 and drove it for 10 years. Dad reacquired the GTO in '08 and we made that into our secondary car for myself when I started in '12. As the Bird was the better HO car, we used that for the National Events and dad and I would switch as drivers.

Now, as for why the Brainerd race in '15 shows the Bird but we actually raced the GTO. Simple, the Bird developed some motor issues the night before we left, and we had to use the GTO. Unfortunately I ended up snapping teeth off the ring gear in the final Q session and was unable to make eliminations. The GTO has had a couple different iterations of paint schemes over the years, from all brown to the last look of brown, orange stripes, and cream hood. Currently it is being repainted to factory cardinal red with black stripes. However, as this is the backup to our '11 Challenger, it will probably not make any appearances at National or Divisional events.

[oldskool]

As most know, Brad Burton is one of the most successful Pontiac Stock racers. Yesterday, he added to his LONG list of race wins, with a win in the Stock/SS combo race, at Yellowstone.

https://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCS...er=30#indextop

Brad's Mom was also in that race, & made it to the semi-final, driving the Burton '74 Formula Stocker ! She only recently began driving it.

[oldskool]

Bruce Noland entered his '69 T/A in the Maple Grove div 1 race.

Here's the proof !

He ran a 10.622 in E-1. That's .778 under, which is pretty respectable, especially for the 1st race.

"...10.622 124.17..."

Unfortunately, Bruce cut a slow light & got treed in E-1.

But hey, we now have another solid 10 sec Pontiac powered Stocker !

[oldskool]

Randi Lyn Shipp won Stock at the div 3 race @ Beech Bend, in her '67 Bird !

https://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCS...UMMIT#indextop

[Frank Castros]

Very nice job by Bruce, great car and I can't wait to see it painted.

[oldskool]

"...It would really help history if we knew the real story on the Swiss Cheese cars running in NHRA (maybe in B/FX?), how they ran, what class this car ran its 12.27 in, etc."

I just read that post. Probably can't answer all the questions. But, I'll share some pics & info I have that might shed some light on it.

Have pics of the Royal Pontiac car that Jim Wangers drove. In one of the pics, he is running against a Stan Long Pontiac B/FX Pontiac, probably running for the B/FX class win, which Jim won, at the '63 Nationals. I'll post the list which shows his ET, which was 12.59. Also have a pic of what appears to be that same car, with A/FX on it.

Also have pics of the Anderson Pontiac car, with Arlen Vanke driving. I don't know how many cars these big dealers had, that looked exactly the same. So, I can't say if they had different cars for different classes, or just made changes to meet different class requirements. Also don't know how the different tracks classified the cars. I'm guessing that some track tech guys probably put the swiss cheese cars in a Stock or SS class, if they weren't running the FX classes there, so all the cars could race. There were probably lots of mis-classed cars before that time & since.

The last pic shows Arnie's car, with A/FX on it. He ran lots of different classes, with several cars.

Note: Bottom line is that you can't believe everything you read online or in print. Also, this stuff happened almost 60 years ago. So, who can say EXACTLY what's true & what's NOT true about all the details from back then.

Here's some stuff about the 421SD engine that some may enjoy.

https://www.nhra.com/news/2021/421-n...orever-footage

[oldskool]

Sorry to see that Bruce Noland is NOT driving his '69 Bird at Indy. His ride is listed as a '71 Vette.

Hope the DRC info is wrong. Bruce is #100.

https://www.dragracecentral.com/DRCS...er=30#indextop