NHRA 2020 Rule Amendment SS Intakes??? - Page 7

dannyboy · 12-12-2019, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSDiv6

One interesting fact is that as discussed earlier, one of the first users of intake manifold adapters in the 1970's was Ed Hamburger on his Mopar 340 and 360 Super Stock engines. The adapter allowed Ed to use a SBC intake. Therefore, since the 1970's NHRA has been allowing spacers and adapters in Super Stock class.

As a matter of fact the Ed Hamburger and Bruce Bachelder (former NHRA Tech Rep) Mopar used the adapter with the SBC intake until Offenhauser came out with the SBM Port-O-Sonic intake.

I beg to differ with you, We, Brian Bachelder, Bruce Bachelder, and myself, Dan Chipman campaigned the 74 Duster, 71 Duster and 72 Demon with Ed's engines and parts and set many records and class wins without any Chevrolet Manifolds. Ed flew me to the world finals when he ran the Duster with Carlos Lawrence to test manifolds and none of them were Chevy's. He may of tried them on the W-2 heads in Super Modified.

Billy Nees · 12-12-2019, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nolongerracing

NHRA TECH has no balls!!!!!

Ya know, as much as I hate to say this, NHRA really had no choice with this. I like to think that they realized with the kind of lead times needed to get a set of heads and intake done in this day-and-age that they couldn't make a ruling like this with less than 2 months lead time going into Pomona.
BUT, there are an awful lot of "issues" that I would like to see put on some kind of a realistic time frame.

jmcarter · 12-12-2019, 10:23 AM

You’re right Billy, they really had no choice but defer changes that would so drastically impact a number of racers. Proactive SRAC reps canvassed racers for impact statements (as they did on the potential oil retention device) plus I’m sure NHRA got plenty of additional inputs, some of it in the four letter variety. It would be interesting to know just how many Super Stockers would have been impacted (~10-15%??) if the rule had stood as originally stated. In any case several it would have been terrible to cut out any Super Stockers (yes, some bias but my favorite class).

nolongerracing · 12-12-2019, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Ya know, as much as I hate to say this, NHRA really had no choice with this. I like to think that they realized with the kind of lead times needed to get a set of heads and intake done in this day-and-age that they couldn't make a ruling like this with less than 2 months lead time going into Pomona.
BUT, there are an awful lot of "issues" that I would like to see put on some kind of a realistic time frame.

Do you think they will stick to the "new" rule 10 months from now? I doubt it. Racers start threating "lawsuits" scares the hell out of them! Maybe all the legal racers should do the same. The majority of the heads in question came from one place. I would say less than 1% of superstock racers had them. Looks like 99% will pay the price again next year.

Jason · 12-12-2019, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nolongerracing

the majority of the heads in question came from one place.

bingo!!!!!

SSDiv6 · 12-12-2019, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nolongerracing

Do you think they will stick to the "new" rule 10 months from now? I doubt it. Racers start threating "lawsuits" scares the hell out of them! Maybe all the legal racers should do the same. The majority of the heads in question came from one place. I would say less than 1% of superstock racers had them. Looks like 99% will pay the price again next year.

Wrong and you full of it!
The issue is not isolated to Chevy engined only or a single engine builder. There are other makes of engines dealing with the same issue and other engine builders also.

As I said in an earlier post, angle milling and the use of spacers/adapters has been taking place since the 1960's.
The only rule NHRA has established is to not modify the valve cover and intake bolt location as long it is not a SS/AH car.

SSDiv6 · 12-12-2019, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannyboy

I beg to differ with you, We, Brian Bachelder, Bruce Bachelder, and myself, Dan Chipman campaigned the 74 Duster, 71 Duster and 72 Demon with Ed's engines and parts and set many records and class wins without any Chevrolet Manifolds. Ed flew me to the world finals when he ran the Duster with Carlos Lawrence to test manifolds and none of them were Chevy's. He may of tried them on the W-2 heads in Super Modified.

My apologies, my comments were based on information i was given many years ago when i crewed a a few Mopars that had Ed's engines with the Chevy intake during the early 1970's.

ron morehead · 12-12-2019, 12:28 PM

I'm gonna jump in on this one since there are UNINFORMED creatures out there. Our Heads that are in question are roughly 2-2 1/2 years old its the Gen 3 stuff. If these modifications are illegal why did it take this long for them to say this when they NHRA saw this configuration Long before Indy this year. If You so called racers think that we are .15 ahead of everyone except Zavala is all in the head design you need to quit right now because you have no work Ethic. The individuals that are the SO Called engine builders that are complaining are more interested in racing instead of being in the shop, on the Dyno or at the test sessions working with there customers instead they are promising there customers that this will work or that will work and all the customers are doing is lining their engine builders pockets. NHRA should have warned or stopped this design 2 years ago the first time they saw this JUST like the did to the HEMI design. Stop whining and get to work.

SSDiv6 · 12-12-2019, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ron morehead

I'm gonna jump in on this one since there are UNINFORMED creatures out there. Our Heads that are in question are roughly 2-2 1/2 years old its the Gen 3 stuff. If these modifications are illegal why did it take this long for them to say this when they NHRA saw this configuration Long before Indy this year. If You so called racers think that we are .15 ahead of everyone except Zavala is all in the head design you need to quit right now because you have no work Ethic. The individuals that are the SO Called engine builders that are complaining are more interested in racing instead of being in the shop, on the Dyno or at the test sessions working with there customers instead they are promising there customers that this will work or that will work and all the customers are doing is lining their engine builders pockets. NHRA should have warned or stopped this design 2 years ago the first time they saw this JUST like the did to the HEMI design. Stop whining and get to work.

Well said!

Bob Smith · 12-12-2019, 12:54 PM

[QUOTE== NHRA should have warned or stopped this design 2 years ago the first time they saw this JUST like the did to the HEMI design. .[/QUOTE]

Well said Ron, there is no substitution for hard work!
But why should it have been stopped if it is legal. Or is it not really legal? This makes it sound like the rule was broken and NHRA should have said something instead of the engine builders and racers just not breaking the rule in the first place.

12-12-2019, 10:23 AM	#63
jmcarter VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Richmond Hill GA (and Port Ludlow WA) Posts: 4,122 Likes: 1,978 Liked 2,707 Times in 853 Posts	Re: NHRA 2020 Rule Amendment SS Intakes??? You’re right Billy, they really had no choice but defer changes that would so drastically impact a number of racers. Proactive SRAC reps canvassed racers for impact statements (as they did on the potential oil retention device) plus I’m sure NHRA got plenty of additional inputs, some of it in the four letter variety. It would be interesting to know just how many Super Stockers would have been impacted (~10-15%??) if the rule had stood as originally stated. In any case several it would have been terrible to cut out any Super Stockers (yes, some bias but my favorite class). __________________ Jim Carter 2340 Super Stock 2340 SST/2340 Stock Last edited by jmcarter; 12-12-2019 at 10:27 AM.

12-12-2019, 12:28 PM	#68
ron morehead Junior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 72 Likes: 0 Liked 110 Times in 12 Posts	Re: NHRA 2020 Rule Amendment SS Intakes??? I'm gonna jump in on this one since there are UNINFORMED creatures out there. Our Heads that are in question are roughly 2-2 1/2 years old its the Gen 3 stuff. If these modifications are illegal why did it take this long for them to say this when they NHRA saw this configuration Long before Indy this year. If You so called racers think that we are .15 ahead of everyone except Zavala is all in the head design you need to quit right now because you have no work Ethic. The individuals that are the SO Called engine builders that are complaining are more interested in racing instead of being in the shop, on the Dyno or at the test sessions working with there customers instead they are promising there customers that this will work or that will work and all the customers are doing is lining their engine builders pockets. NHRA should have warned or stopped this design 2 years ago the first time they saw this JUST like the did to the HEMI design. Stop whining and get to work.

12-12-2019, 12:54 PM	#70
Bob Smith Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coeymans, NY Posts: 133 Likes: 209 Liked 129 Times in 33 Posts	Re: NHRA 2020 Rule Amendment SS Intakes??? [QUOTE== NHRA should have warned or stopped this design 2 years ago the first time they saw this JUST like the did to the HEMI design. .[/QUOTE] Well said Ron, there is no substitution for hard work! But why should it have been stopped if it is legal. Or is it not really legal? This makes it sound like the rule was broken and NHRA should have said something instead of the engine builders and racers just not breaking the rule in the first place.