Virtual Class Racing

[Gary Smith]

With the covid-9 crisis shutting down all real world activities, I'm putting this out there to test the waters. With my software development and lifetime of drag racing experience, I have been working on and off (more off lately unfortunately) on creating a highly detailed drag racing simulator that incorporates very realistic driver experience, highly complex technical mechanical modeling as well as very detailed graphics and audio. I'm not talking about a "game" but a very rich in detail program that could closely resemble reality (i.e. flowbench data, genuine mfr part numbers, cnc specs and design criteria, open chassis modeling, OEM body and frame specs) the iRacing community has already proven the ability to model such detail. Unfortunately most current developer teams who've attempted similar programs with drag racing have fallen far short of the mark. Some feature somewhat complex mechanical features but lack realism in terms of dynamic performance (graphics and sound). Others incorporate far better graphics and sound packages but are geared towards arcade users and lack any sort of quality mechanical detail. From my experience in the flight simulator circles, an endeavor this ambitious would require group effort and a lot of input. The variables and data management alone would be a massive undertaking. The question is how popular would it be with real racers? Thoughts?

[Jim Caughlin]

It would have to include such realistic features as slamming on the brakes at 1000' during qualifying, sandbagging during eliminations without locking 'em up at the stripe and tossing ballast on the return road to avoid an accidental 1.2 under qualifying run. Now you're talkin' real racin'

[jmcarter]

We could try it but unless Bill Rink wins SS/MA the whole deal would be invalidated.

But seriously, without the smell of race gas and burning rubber along with the sound of a Max Wedge (pick your brand but you probably get the idea) I wouldn’t see the point. Know the iNASCAR thing was fairly well received but those are just millionaires playing with their toys. Not trying to throw a wet blanket on your idea because I applaud your thinking outside the box, just MHO

[Lenny5160]

There wouldn't be massive appeal, but among racers I have to think it would be quite popular.

The ability to 'dumb it down' a little bit to allow any modifications, bracket racing, maybe even throttle stops would help increase the audience.

I was a tester back in the late '90s when Bethesda Softworks was making Burnout, Burnout PCE, etc. I wasn't officially involved with the project but I kept sending them email with all of the stuff that was wrong so they started sending me advance copies and updates to ensure that things were correct.

I go to a party every spring at a computer-savvy racer's shop, where they set up 8 old Windows 98 PCs on a network complete with steering wheel/pedal setups, and we run a bunch of races on those old games all night for money and a homemade 'Wally' type trophy for the grand champion.

A modern equivalent game/simulator that runs on modern hardware would be phenomenal!

[Mike Taylor 3601]

Originally Posted by Lenny5160

There wouldn't be massive appeal, but among racers I have to think it would be quite popular.

The ability to 'dumb it down' a little bit to allow any modifications, bracket racing, maybe even throttle stops would help increase the audience.

I was a tester back in the late '90s when Bethesda Softworks was making Burnout, Burnout PCE, etc. I wasn't officially involved with the project but I kept sending them email with all of the stuff that was wrong so they started sending me advance copies and updates to ensure that things were correct.

I go to a party every spring at a computer-savvy racer's shop, where they set up 8 old Windows 98 PCs on a network complete with steering wheel/pedal setups, and we run a bunch of races on those old games all night for money and a homemade 'Wally' type trophy for the grand champion.

A modern equivalent game/simulator that runs on modern hardware would be phenomenal!

that has been the case with any drag racing games etc. my whole life is the dumbing down or lack of makers knowing reality of drag racing.
so I say smart it up

[Lenny5160]

Originally Posted by Mike Taylor 3601

that has been the case with any drag racing games etc. my whole life is the dumbing down or lack of makers knowing reality of drag racing.
so I say smart it up

I don't disagree with you, but there are a lot more of 'them' than there are of 'us'. Keep the advanced stuff in for those that want it.

[Gary Smith]

Originally Posted by Lenny5160

There wouldn't be massive appeal, but among racers I have to think it would be quite popular.

The ability to 'dumb it down' a little bit to allow any modifications, bracket racing, maybe even throttle stops would help increase the audience.

I was a tester back in the late '90s when Bethesda Softworks was making Burnout, Burnout PCE, etc. I wasn't officially involved with the project but I kept sending them email with all of the stuff that was wrong so they started sending me advance copies and updates to ensure that things were correct.

I go to a party every spring at a computer-savvy racer's shop, where they set up 8 old Windows 98 PCs on a network complete with steering wheel/pedal setups, and we run a bunch of races on those old games all night for money and a homemade 'Wally' type trophy for the grand champion.

A modern equivalent game/simulator that runs on modern hardware would be phenomenal!

Bethesda Software's program was a nice attempt. But they needed real racers with real hands-on experience as part of the team. iRacing has taken the same approach as Microsoft FS and xPlane development practices. I was thinking the same approach since there are a ton of geeks over in the Outlaw/Lights Out group. This wouldn't be just class cars, but the ability to build and tune in a very detailed format. The intent is to have it complex enough to incorporate much of the details of a stocker or super stocker...using NHRA stock car classification guide as a spring board. The amount of work, especially with graphics development, would require mind boggling hours, which is why I'd like to see an "open" source/shared file format similar to MS Flightsim. The modeling technology is so much further advanced today than it was when Bethesda made the attempt. And their source was protected. Here's an example product I had in mind for the "build" features...it would be far more advanced than this though. https://steamcommunity.com/app/645630

[Gary Smith]

Originally Posted by Lenny5160

I don't disagree with you, but there are a lot more of 'them' than there are of 'us'. Keep the advanced stuff in for those that want it.

I fully agree. Just like MSFS, there are ways of breaking down the settings between "arcade" mode all the way to advance. An example: select a ready built PMR or Gary Jennings '92 Camaro (would include features those guys would normally offer at a certain given time), and a Mike Keown or maybe an RWR ZQ3 350 (if that's a competitive hp combo), weight and select a class (guessing GT/HA). Or the user can get into the build details such as rear end housing choice, dimensions, 4 link style, shocks frame style, body panel weight, mild steel or chrome moly tubing, thickness, engine mounting hardware, mounting points, etc.). Engine build would be just as simple or as detailed too...head casting #, port and chamber shapes, volume...the engine shaping could import AutoCad compatible files, cam specs, etc.. Another feature could be closed source component data, allowing engine builder proprietary details to be entered, or engine parts created from without giving away shape and spec data.All graphic design work that goes into modern games and simulators are generated from AutoDesk compatible files or similar programs used in commercial CNC process. Sound files are just as advanced, using actual recordings from matching combos. It's taken iRacing several years to end up where they are today. Can't see any reason why drag racing program couldn't end up just as advanced.

[vic guilmino]

I personally love that type of thing I'd love to see somebody do something with it if you need any help call me

[dartman]

Originally Posted by Jim Caughlin

It would have to include such realistic features as slamming on the brakes at 1000' during qualifying, sandbagging during eliminations without locking 'em up at the stripe and tossing ballast on the return road to avoid an accidental 1.2 under qualifying run. Now you're talkin' real racin'

that's funny