Not for Nuthin' But Close! - Page 19

jmcarter · 02-22-2021, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

Hey all of you "Dime Rocketeers"! We got a mention on the latest Class Racing Today podcast! The one with the Autumn Greene interview. Good kid and a determined Racer. We need more like her!

Amen Billy, I was pitted next to Todd and Autumn at the Baby Gators last year...good people. Everyone should read Todd’s build thread, the dedication and passion is very evident.

Billy Nees · 03-09-2021, 10:00 AM

The header is done and on the car! This is the most obnoxious sounding thing that I've ever played with. Gotta love it!
I'm hoping to get to Cecil on Saturday if my tuner/driver isn't busy.

Billy Nees · 03-14-2021, 08:50 AM

So............... what is a header worth on a 21ST Century, high-tech car??? I was shocked.
More later.

Glenn Briglio · 03-14-2021, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Nees

So............... what is a header worth on a 21ST Century, high-tech car??? I was shocked.
More later.

Still waiting holding my breath!!!!!!!!

Tom Meyer · 03-14-2021, 10:19 AM

Sport compact cars were going around Bristol 1/2 mile dirt in 21 seconds, same as the cup cars in 1961. Track record for cup is now 14 something on asphalt. Come on Billy I am going to say you picked up 17 with the header. Tom

Billy Nees · 03-14-2021, 12:06 PM

The last time we had it out the car ran it's best run to date. 2.149 60ft, 9.638 @ 71.55 1/8th, 15.085 @ 89.88 1/4.
The air was about 200ft. better yesterday and by noon the wind wasn't a factor. With the new header in place, we started with the factory tune back in it as to try and not hurt anything. After sneaking up on it all day it finally went 2.133 60ft., 9.594 @ 71.63 1/8th, 15.055 @89.43 1/4.
So it picked up ........nothing......
It does seem to be falling off after the 1/8th and the numbers support that. It wants a few degrees less timing and about 5% more fuel with the header.
Back to the drawing board!
Doug, drawing boards are what designers used to use before lap-tops.

OBTW, anybody with any comments/advice, please feel free.

Tom Meyer · 03-14-2021, 02:21 PM

We tried different exhaust manifolds and pipe sizes with no help, that did nothing. Now we could bolt on a 2.4 intake manifold [bigger] using everything else the same and pick up 10 HP. Do you think with two exhaust valves per cly and OE the uses a anti reversion cone in the exhaust pipe that by adding a cone in each tube would help? Also tube size would play a big part.

Mark Yacavone · 03-14-2021, 10:59 PM

Billy, I probably told you this, but when we got the Monte, we took it to the track, completely stock, 200K on it, 2.91 gears..just some shorter street tires.. It only ran in the 16's but enough MPH to run the index in DF/S.
The last run, we took the complete exhaust of the car, from the cat. , back... It should have picked up something, just from the weight loss....It picked up NOTHING!
I kinda figured it couldn't richen itself up, accordingly, so the lean-ness killed it.
Yours sounds like a torque, or lack of it, situation. I wouldn't take the header off yet. Unless maybe back up on the exhaust, and change the final drive and put a fairly tight 245 mm converter with the lock up plate removed....If it likes that, then go back to the header..Just a thought or two..

Billy Nees · 03-15-2021, 07:40 AM

Oh, we can richen it up enough. When we made the first pass, we put the OEM tune back in it (20% more fuel) and it didn't like it one bit. After making little changes and making little progress and looking at a busy day when we weren't going to get many more runs, we put the 15.08 tune back in it and it went a 15.108 but the MPH is down. Next run we added 5% fuel and removed 3* of timing(now 26*) and it went the 15.055 but still 1/2 MPH slow from last year even with 200' better air. Without breaking down the whole time slip, it ran it's all-time best ETs and MPHs in the 1/8th by a good amount and lost more and more to the 1/4. It doesn't seem to be a torque problem. Next time out, we've got to try lowering our shift points(6700) at least on the 2-3 shift. The OEM specs are 140 @ 5600 and 150 @ 4000 (and it IS still stock) so we might be at a point where we're just too far past the peaks.

Mark Yacavone · 03-15-2021, 12:56 PM

I didn't mean to imply that yours was lean. I know you've got a handle on that
FWIW, The Monte didn't like to be rev-ed up either, even with the headers..It dropped off rapidly at 5700.

03-09-2021, 10:00 AM	#182
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,218 Likes: 3,091 Liked 6,772 Times in 1,519 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! The header is done and on the car! This is the most obnoxious sounding thing that I've ever played with. Gotta love it! I'm hoping to get to Cecil on Saturday if my tuner/driver isn't busy. __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS Make tech "TECH" again!

03-14-2021, 08:50 AM	#183
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,218 Likes: 3,091 Liked 6,772 Times in 1,519 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! So............... what is a header worth on a 21ST Century, high-tech car??? I was shocked. More later. __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS Make tech "TECH" again!

03-14-2021, 10:19 AM	#185
Tom Meyer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pierce NE Posts: 900 Likes: 51 Liked 301 Times in 105 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! Sport compact cars were going around Bristol 1/2 mile dirt in 21 seconds, same as the cup cars in 1961. Track record for cup is now 14 something on asphalt. Come on Billy I am going to say you picked up 17 with the header. Tom __________________ Tom Meyer 5240 SS Stock ???

03-14-2021, 12:06 PM	#186
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,218 Likes: 3,091 Liked 6,772 Times in 1,519 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! The last time we had it out the car ran it's best run to date. 2.149 60ft, 9.638 @ 71.55 1/8th, 15.085 @ 89.88 1/4. The air was about 200ft. better yesterday and by noon the wind wasn't a factor. With the new header in place, we started with the factory tune back in it as to try and not hurt anything. After sneaking up on it all day it finally went 2.133 60ft., 9.594 @ 71.63 1/8th, 15.055 @89.43 1/4. So it picked up ........nothing...... It does seem to be falling off after the 1/8th and the numbers support that. It wants a few degrees less timing and about 5% more fuel with the header. Back to the drawing board! Doug, drawing boards are what designers used to use before lap-tops. OBTW, anybody with any comments/advice, please feel free. __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS Make tech "TECH" again!

03-14-2021, 02:21 PM	#187
Tom Meyer Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pierce NE Posts: 900 Likes: 51 Liked 301 Times in 105 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! We tried different exhaust manifolds and pipe sizes with no help, that did nothing. Now we could bolt on a 2.4 intake manifold [bigger] using everything else the same and pick up 10 HP. Do you think with two exhaust valves per cly and OE the uses a anti reversion cone in the exhaust pipe that by adding a cone in each tube would help? Also tube size would play a big part. __________________ Tom Meyer 5240 SS Stock ???

03-14-2021, 10:59 PM	#188
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,414 Likes: 2,579 Liked 4,447 Times in 1,693 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! Billy, I probably told you this, but when we got the Monte, we took it to the track, completely stock, 200K on it, 2.91 gears..just some shorter street tires.. It only ran in the 16's but enough MPH to run the index in DF/S. The last run, we took the complete exhaust of the car, from the cat. , back... It should have picked up something, just from the weight loss....It picked up NOTHING! I kinda figured it couldn't richen itself up, accordingly, so the lean-ness killed it. Yours sounds like a torque, or lack of it, situation. I wouldn't take the header off yet. Unless maybe back up on the exhaust, and change the final drive and put a fairly tight 245 mm converter with the lock up plate removed....If it likes that, then go back to the header..Just a thought or two.. __________________ We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for..... Will Rogers

03-15-2021, 07:40 AM	#189
Billy Nees VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: On a hilltop in Pa. Posts: 4,218 Likes: 3,091 Liked 6,772 Times in 1,519 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! Oh, we can richen it up enough. When we made the first pass, we put the OEM tune back in it (20% more fuel) and it didn't like it one bit. After making little changes and making little progress and looking at a busy day when we weren't going to get many more runs, we put the 15.08 tune back in it and it went a 15.108 but the MPH is down. Next run we added 5% fuel and removed 3* of timing(now 26*) and it went the 15.055 but still 1/2 MPH slow from last year even with 200' better air. Without breaking down the whole time slip, it ran it's all-time best ETs and MPHs in the 1/8th by a good amount and lost more and more to the 1/4. It doesn't seem to be a torque problem. Next time out, we've got to try lowering our shift points(6700) at least on the 2-3 shift. The OEM specs are 140 @ 5600 and 150 @ 4000 (and it IS still stock) so we might be at a point where we're just too far past the peaks. __________________ Billy Nees 1188 STK, SS Make tech "TECH" again!

03-15-2021, 12:56 PM	#190
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,414 Likes: 2,579 Liked 4,447 Times in 1,693 Posts	Re: Not for Nuthin' But Close! I didn't mean to imply that yours was lean. I know you've got a handle on that FWIW, The Monte didn't like to be rev-ed up either, even with the headers..It dropped off rapidly at 5700. __________________ We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for..... Will Rogers