ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers - Page 7

55 Chevy · 06-01-2008, 01:45 AM

So lets just say N.H.R.A. drops all indexes by .2 so that the guy now running -1.39 is -1.19. But he will no longer be on the brakes cause he wants do be # 1 qualifier so his car is now -1.35 & close to be getting hit again if he is not careful. What now?
Would someone please tell me what the problem is with getting rid of the trigger or lowering it to say -1.6 & leaving the indexes where they are? That way the fast guys could go hard all the way & still qualify near the top where they do now. The guys at bottom are unaffected.

Bruce Noland · 06-01-2008, 07:46 AM

-1.60 for an automatic hit does not help class racing because the trigger for reviews is still -1.15 at national events.

99% of all the races are all-run events. The slower racers still have at least three options on the lower indexes; not in any particular order.

1.) Work on your car.

2.) Pick another combination.

3.) Seek relief from the current ahfs god if you are really into a dead end combination.

stefan callender · 06-01-2008, 07:46 AM

Plus NO ONE is watching the qualifying sheet lately, The guys qualifying at the top are mostly modified cars now. The guys that can go 140 plus.(MPH) Soon this will be dominated by comp cars. Something else for you guys to bitch about. No one will ever be happy. By the way, SS engine guy, who are you, and what car do you run? By the way, you wont find my name on a qualifying sheet, so dont ask.

Arnold Greene · 06-01-2008, 11:10 AM

First of all, I haven't raced NHRA in three years, so my opinion doesn't count for much. It appears to me that the burden(ahfs) in stock and superstock is being placed on the wrong group of people. Why should someone be penalized for using the rules, determined by the sanctioning body, to go fast? This is the goal in a performance class. If a combination in a particular class is deemed not competitive, then take 5 horsepower (or whatever # is deemed appropriate) off the combination. Let these folks work at that weight to get competitive just like the fast guy had to work. Don't just add weight to slow the fast guy down. That's how we ended up with 3700# Camaros and Cudas.

Like some have said, class racing may not be for everybody. It is not a 'right' to be able to run the index, much less, go fast. The way the system works now, you might as well do away with the class designations on the windows, and just put on the dial in.

Larry Munk · 06-01-2008, 11:46 AM

How about this one. Lets do like was done before. No car older than 15/20 years old in stock. All the antiques can go to super stock or the car shows. Put the comp cars where they belong. And while you're at it drop the indexes .4.

Jim Wahl · 06-01-2008, 01:15 PM

Larry,
Why don't you just say you only want GM cars in competition? Then they can dominate Stock as well as Pro Stock. Comp, and Super Stock. Won't be any need for factors then huh? Jim

Lynn A McCarty · 06-01-2008, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Noland

-1.60 for an automatic hit does not help class racing because the trigger for reviews is still -1.15 at national events.

99% of all the races are all-run events. The slower racers still have at least three options on the lower indexes; not in any particular order.

1.) Work on your car.

2.) Pick another combination.

3.) Seek relief from the current ahfs god if you are really into a dead end combination.

Bruce,

You miss the main point of your own premise. How much must you hit to bring a 1.6 under combo into check? I know one engine that has been hit 45HP since 1996. It is still one of the softest combos around.

The real issue is that AHFS is better than nothing, but it really doesnt address the real problems. It is statistically invalid, and statistically ineffective for the gross inadequacies. If a car runs 1.6 under and it isnt grossly done in a mine shaft, it probably should get at least 30HP or 40HP.

Do you know how bogus an engine has to be average 1.15 under? All events follow a 6-sigma spread around the average. So that means 1/2 the cars run faster than 1.15 under? How truly bogus!

The current system is wrong and needs to be changed. I have described some appropriate measures many times.

Larry Munk · 06-01-2008, 02:18 PM

Actually Jim I'm a Ford guy. They still make a rear drive car.

Jim Wahl · 06-01-2008, 02:23 PM

Me thinks there was a dig there somewhere. I'm used to that kind of thinking. jim

Chad Rhodes · 06-01-2008, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry Munk

Actually Jim I'm a Ford guy. They still make a rear drive car.

so does GM

06-01-2008, 01:45 AM	#61
55 Chevy Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Calgary,Alberta area Posts: 229 Likes: 23 Liked 16 Times in 14 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers So lets just say N.H.R.A. drops all indexes by .2 so that the guy now running -1.39 is -1.19. But he will no longer be on the brakes cause he wants do be # 1 qualifier so his car is now -1.35 & close to be getting hit again if he is not careful. What now? Would someone please tell me what the problem is with getting rid of the trigger or lowering it to say -1.6 & leaving the indexes where they are? That way the fast guys could go hard all the way & still qualify near the top where they do now. The guys at bottom are unaffected.

06-01-2008, 07:46 AM	#62
Bruce Noland VIP Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,855 Likes: 83 Liked 444 Times in 145 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers -1.60 for an automatic hit does not help class racing because the trigger for reviews is still -1.15 at national events. 99% of all the races are all-run events. The slower racers still have at least three options on the lower indexes; not in any particular order. 1.) Work on your car. 2.) Pick another combination. 3.) Seek relief from the current ahfs god if you are really into a dead end combination. __________________ Bruce Noland 1788 STK

06-01-2008, 07:46 AM	#63
stefan callender Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: zoo york Posts: 572 Likes: 3 Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers Plus NO ONE is watching the qualifying sheet lately, The guys qualifying at the top are mostly modified cars now. The guys that can go 140 plus.(MPH) Soon this will be dominated by comp cars. Something else for you guys to bitch about. No one will ever be happy. By the way, SS engine guy, who are you, and what car do you run? By the way, you wont find my name on a qualifying sheet, so dont ask.

06-01-2008, 11:10 AM	#64
Arnold Greene Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 135 Likes: 0 Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers First of all, I haven't raced NHRA in three years, so my opinion doesn't count for much. It appears to me that the burden(ahfs) in stock and superstock is being placed on the wrong group of people. Why should someone be penalized for using the rules, determined by the sanctioning body, to go fast? This is the goal in a performance class. If a combination in a particular class is deemed not competitive, then take 5 horsepower (or whatever # is deemed appropriate) off the combination. Let these folks work at that weight to get competitive just like the fast guy had to work. Don't just add weight to slow the fast guy down. That's how we ended up with 3700# Camaros and Cudas. Like some have said, class racing may not be for everybody. It is not a 'right' to be able to run the index, much less, go fast. The way the system works now, you might as well do away with the class designations on the windows, and just put on the dial in. __________________ Arnold Greene IHRA/NHRA 2420 A/S, B/S

06-01-2008, 11:46 AM	#65
Larry Munk Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 135 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers How about this one. Lets do like was done before. No car older than 15/20 years old in stock. All the antiques can go to super stock or the car shows. Put the comp cars where they belong. And while you're at it drop the indexes .4.

06-01-2008, 01:15 PM	#66
Jim Wahl Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Central Florida Posts: 5,844 Likes: 666 Liked 683 Times in 129 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers Larry, Why don't you just say you only want GM cars in competition? Then they can dominate Stock as well as Pro Stock. Comp, and Super Stock. Won't be any need for factors then huh? Jim __________________ Jim Wahl....NHRA #2239 S/SS - IHRA # 8 Stock, D2 Stock Champion (forever I guess) 2019 Baby Gators Stock Champion 2009 NHRA D2 National Open Stock Champion 1982 NHRA D2 West Palm Beach LDRS SS Runner Up Past President, Southern Stock / Super Stock Association. Last edited by Jim Wahl; 06-01-2008 at 01:19 PM.

06-01-2008, 02:18 PM	#68
Larry Munk Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 135 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers Actually Jim I'm a Ford guy. They still make a rear drive car.

06-01-2008, 02:23 PM	#69
Jim Wahl Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Central Florida Posts: 5,844 Likes: 666 Liked 683 Times in 129 Posts	Re: ATTN Sportsman Council Members and Racers Me thinks there was a dig there somewhere. I'm used to that kind of thinking. jim __________________ Jim Wahl....NHRA #2239 S/SS - IHRA # 8 Stock, D2 Stock Champion (forever I guess) 2019 Baby Gators Stock Champion 2009 NHRA D2 National Open Stock Champion 1982 NHRA D2 West Palm Beach LDRS SS Runner Up Past President, Southern Stock / Super Stock Association.