Black Tuesday? - Page 4

Toby Lang · 12-13-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Cour

It's not about any of your concerns. It's about you taking your stocker and running superstock.

Well, it looks like it's about your concerns though. Why not just make a rule that says if you have entered a car in Stock this year you can't enter it in Super Stock later or something similar.

Quote:

It's about the guys running at the bottom with "stock" parts now having to actual purchase performance parts from the dying contingency companies.

Aren't the guys at the bottom the ones you want to run heads-up? What's wrong with people running at the bottom with stock parts? How does it effect you?

Quote:

C'mon Toby, it's not a conspiracy against the "brake pedal bandits," it's simply a business decision.

Yes, sounds like a good business decision to drive customers away.

-Toby

7423 · 12-13-2009, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Cour

Charlie-

Until they stop allowing stockers to enter superstock. Filling the fields before some poor sap with a superstocker could enter, then you're right, no reason, based on your example. I just think that when a "legal" stocker can run eight tenths under in superstock, there's a problem somewhere. Just my opinion.

BTW, nice meeting you in Pomona.

Valid point about the stocker at .8 under in SS. SOOOOOOOOOO, just give those combos hp, why nail an entire class for a few hot rods that like to show off??
The pleasure was mine meeting you Sean

7423 · 12-13-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toby Lang

Well, it looks like it's about your concerns though. Why not just make a rule that says if you have entered a car in Stock this year you can't enter it in Super Stock later or something similar.

Aren't the guys at the bottom the ones you want to run heads-up? What's wrong with people running at the bottom with stock parts? How does it effect you?

Yes, sounds like a good business decision to drive customers away.

-Toby

I agree Toby, it would drive me away.

Mark Yacavone · 12-13-2009, 09:40 PM

Good reasons:

I must have heard this one a hundred times..whenever someone brings up doing away with heads up runs in eliminations : "It's supposed to be a performance based eliminator"

Think about this. A guy can go to Indy and be 180th qualifier (dead last) @ .06 under. He's a full second away from the slowest qualifier.
That same guy can go to the very next National event and win it.

Something's wrong with this picture.

Big Road · 12-13-2009, 10:24 PM

Do you know what kills me about this .You guys bitch and moan about moving the indexes do you know what stock and super stock is A PERFORMANCE CLASS. if you want to bracket race go to your local track and stop bitching If you want to race nats and divionals make your car faster!!!!!

Bob Don · 12-13-2009, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Yacavone

Good reasons:

I must have heard this one a hundred times..whenever someone brings up doing away with heads up runs in eliminations : "It's supposed to be a performance based eliminator"

Think about this. A guy can go to Indy and be 180th qualifier (dead last) @ .06 under. He's a full second away from the slowest qualifier.
That same guy can go to the very next National event and win it.

Something's wrong with this picture.

Mark - That guy doesn't have to wait for the next national event. He could have a hell of a weekend with no heads up runs and win Indy THAT week! That's why they have an eliminator. Otherwise, they'd just issue checks to the lowest qualifiers.

The way I see it, the "performance based" aspect is that you have run a certain number to get in the show. Once you're in, anyone can win.

Sean Cour · 12-13-2009, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toby Lang

Well, it looks like it's about your concerns though. Why not just make a rule that says if you have entered a car in Stock this year you can't enter it in Super Stock later or something similar.

Aren't the guys at the bottom the ones you want to run heads-up? What's wrong with people running at the bottom with stock parts? How does it effect you?

Yes, sounds like a good business decision to drive customers away.

-Toby

What are my concerns Toby? Seems yours are mine. Go ahead and get some kind of rule change like the one you suggested. I'm sure some of the TSR would love that, especially coming from you.

I don't care who I run heads up. If I can't beat them, I work harder on the car, or myself, until I do. You can run as much "stock" parts as you like. It just makes it easier to beat you, if I get the chance to run you heads up.

Yes, it actually does sound like a good business decision. Put some pressure on the racers that don't participate as highly as the others in the purchasing of performance parts. Isn't that a big carrot in why you race, Toby, the contingency payouts?

Bryan Broaddus · 12-13-2009, 10:52 PM

Yea I don't see any down side to lowering the index. Should be .5 if they want to keep Stockers out of Super Stock but .3 would be a start.

I have to agree this is a performance class and the cars should have to run like it. This should not be a simple bracket class. How many current cars could not run a new index that is -.3 lower.

I don't think it is a money deal either. Everyone used to run under the index with stock cranks, rods and valves before they relaxed the indexes back in '92-'93 or when ever it was.

Heck with all the new rules changes maybe they should think about lowering them .8. That would make it interesting. Certainly see more ice in the lanes and cut out a bunch of sandbaggers. Oh yea one more thing. If you don't run the index you don't qualify.

Mark Yacavone · 12-13-2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Don

Mark - That guy doesn't have to wait for the next national event. He could have a hell of a weekend with no heads up runs and win Indy THAT week! That's why they have an eliminator. Otherwise, they'd just issue checks to the lowest qualifiers.

The way I see it, the "performance based" aspect is that you have run a certain number to get in the show. Once you're in, anyone can win.

Bob, I meant to say non-qualifier. They only allow 128 cars to race at National events.

novassdude · 12-13-2009, 11:10 PM

Quote:
It's about the guys running at the bottom with "stock" parts now having to actual purchase performance parts from the dying contingency companies.

This is stock eliminator. Maybe if NHRA had kept the stock in the eliminator we would not ne in this position.

I really hope that my new motor will run the new index since I followed the rules and built a stock motor per the rules.

12-13-2009, 09:40 PM	#34
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,809 Likes: 2,900 Liked 5,113 Times in 1,948 Posts	Re: Black Tuesday? Good reasons: I must have heard this one a hundred times..whenever someone brings up doing away with heads up runs in eliminations : "It's supposed to be a performance based eliminator" Think about this. A guy can go to Indy and be 180th qualifier (dead last) @ .06 under. He's a full second away from the slowest qualifier. That same guy can go to the very next National event and win it. Something's wrong with this picture. __________________ "We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for." Will Rogers

12-13-2009, 10:24 PM	#35
Big Road Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 55 Likes: 0 Liked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Black Tuesday? Do you know what kills me about this .You guys bitch and moan about moving the indexes do you know what stock and super stock is A PERFORMANCE CLASS. if you want to bracket race go to your local track and stop bitching If you want to race nats and divionals make your car faster!!!!!

12-13-2009, 10:52 PM	#38
Bryan Broaddus Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 104 Likes: 2 Liked 18 Times in 4 Posts	Re: Black Tuesday? Yea I don't see any down side to lowering the index. Should be .5 if they want to keep Stockers out of Super Stock but .3 would be a start. I have to agree this is a performance class and the cars should have to run like it. This should not be a simple bracket class. How many current cars could not run a new index that is -.3 lower. I don't think it is a money deal either. Everyone used to run under the index with stock cranks, rods and valves before they relaxed the indexes back in '92-'93 or when ever it was. Heck with all the new rules changes maybe they should think about lowering them .8. That would make it interesting. Certainly see more ice in the lanes and cut out a bunch of sandbaggers. Oh yea one more thing. If you don't run the index you don't qualify. __________________ Bryan Broaddus 7568 STK ,SS

12-13-2009, 11:10 PM	#40
novassdude Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: usa Posts: 752 Likes: 204 Liked 136 Times in 49 Posts	Re: Black Tuesday? Quote: It's about the guys running at the bottom with "stock" parts now having to actual purchase performance parts from the dying contingency companies. This is stock eliminator. Maybe if NHRA had kept the stock in the eliminator we would not ne in this position. I really hope that my new motor will run the new index since I followed the rules and built a stock motor per the rules.