Lack of integrity

[danny waters sr]

Originally Posted by dwydendorf

Wrong, the Cobra Jets were available from Ford Dealers as complete running cars. They did not come with a vin tag but show me in the rule book where it says that all cars racing stock eliminator must pass a DMV requirement. The Drag pak cars may be a different story but the Cobra Jets could be driven but were not street legal, which is not a requirement for stock eliminator. Ford prioduced 50 plus cars, were available thru Ford dealers , were drivable at the time of purchase, end of story.

No vin to prove the year model ,not needed so claim any year ? just asking...

Plain and simple. It's a factory race car. All the best parts Ford and Mopar could muster up are in these cars. Yeah it's cool and I am glad they did however in MY opinion they do not belong in stock. Are they going to let the old Hemi Dart/Cudas in stock? That was a factory race car. Even in SS they will be untouchable for quite some time. Guess we gave up the right to an opinion or vote with NHRA long ago......


BP

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by dwydendorf

Wrong, the Cobra Jets were available from Ford Dealers as complete running cars. They did not come with a vin tag but show me in the rule book where it says that all cars racing stock eliminator must pass a DMV requirement. The Drag pak cars may be a different story but the Cobra Jets could be driven but were not street legal, which is not a requirement for stock eliminator. Ford produced 50 plus cars, were available thru Ford dealers , were drivable at the time of purchase. It is hard to beleive that nobody complained about the rule for the oem's to produce 50 special units, even though it has been in the rule book since at least 1998.

Yes, and you and others still compare these new cars to L-88, ZL-1, and L-72 cars, which were street legal which was originally a requirement for Stock Eliminator. The truth is, until the rule was recently rewritten, most people assumed cars had to be street legal production cars to be allowed in Stock Eliminator. And for the most part, that was implied, if not outright stated, in the rule book.

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Dean Roberts

Jack, your response is bitter and you missed some important facts so I will fill in the blanks.

1. bob found a car that was actually built and had been in the book for 20 years, GM did not put a paper car into my class

All cars in the guide are built, at least 50 of them. There have been GM paper cars. Ford and Dodge did, in fact, build these cars by the letter of the NHRA rules to fit in Stock, and anyone had a chance to get one, or you can build your own. Who cars how long they have been around? An underfactored car is just that, and it doesn't matter which class or how long it's been hiding in the books. I'm not arguing that they are underrated.

2. bob has not been helped or encouraged by GM to kick my ***

Only because it he runs cars that no one cares about. He picked a class to take advantage of the system, good for him. BTW, Ford and Dodge did the same thing. If you don't think GM was thrilled about racers kicking butt with underrated LT and LS cars you are misinformed or one-sided.

3. bob is a great racer and a nice guy, if someone was gonna end my reign as U/SA hitter at least it was bob... not some prick with a couple of million dollars and a Ford racing jacket.

So someone is a prick because they have done well in life and have money to spend? Have you been to an NHRA race lately and seen the rigs, cars and paint jobs? That would account for 3/4 of the sportsman pits, so 3/4 of the racers are pricks? I think there are a lot of DP and CJ racers who love the brands and want to be a part of history. They may not understand NHRA racing they way you do, but they spent the money and want to run the balls off these cars. Wasn't that the original intent of the class?

I agree that Bob is a great racer and like Billy Ness and Neil Smedley, they are good at looking at combinations.
The truth is there is a different angle to the inception of Bob's combination that only a few know.

Bob's combination, although the car was manufactured with the EFI Oldsmobile engine, was never in the books from the beginning. Neil Smedley is the person that came up with the possibilities of how such combination would run in Stock.

I did some research on the combination and got all the data sheets from the engineers at Cadillac Motorsports at the time. They were still involved in drag racing with the FWD cars. During a discussion with Bob Dennis, he said he would like to explore this combination in SS class. I provided Bob with copies of the documents and we both submitted the information to NHRA.

NHRA did not approve the engine combination and said it was too old of an engine to be approved. Even Travis said the same thing on this board when this subject was brought up on this board many years ago.

One year later, Randy Mans approached me as asked me if I still had the data because he had talked to his division director and also Bob Lang and they told him they would take a look at it for approval. Randy got the information and later on, the engine combination was added to the books. Neil Smedley also talked to Bob about this combination and I consider Neil the person that came up with the combination.

So, in a nutshell, it is who you know at NHRA to get things approved.

As regards to those that spend money in their cars, there are many successful racers outside of this sport and have the money to do and build whatever they please. Many of you would be doing the same if you had the resources. Therefore, I consider criticism of the way their spend their money on their cars out of context.

[Michael Beard]

So, in a nutshell, it is who you know at NHRA to get things approved.

I heard a story about one guy who requested HP off of a combo and the answer was "Not if YOU'RE building it!"

with the olds motor rated at 35hp less in the caddy than it is in an olds.

Um... can someone explain to me how an engine makes a different amount of horsepower in a different body (sans a fresh-air system)?

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

I heard a story about one guy who requested HP off of a combo and the answer was "Not if YOU'RE building it!"



Um... can someone explain to me how an engine makes a different amount of horsepower in a different body (sans a fresh-air system)?

Although it is an Oldsmobile engine, it is a Cadillac application specific only. It was not available on any other GM models. The engine is the same version and specs of the carburated Oldsmobile version for the applicable years,. However, the Cadillac version has a Throttle Body with the injectors on the intake runners.

[Bob Pagano]

Dean Roberts the ZL cars and vettes were not in stock till they restarted AA, the old rule was 500 mim production