D/Dart in Stock

[Paul Ceasrine]

W J,
Hard to find exact information on the 65/66 Valiant and Darts,
especially Formula-S and GT equipped cars.
Paul

[Paul Ceasrine]

W J,
The 65' and 66' Valiants were not available with the Formula S
Package. Only available in the Barracuda's.
But the 273/235HP Commando engines were available, and equipped with the special single exhaust system, with the chrome-tipped resonator.
The Valiants may have been available with the Performance Group
Package though?
As for the D-Darts in stock. I don't think anyone would want to go through the effort of putting one together, document ET-times, to prove to the
NHRA that it should be re-rated, with a more favorable (proper) HP rating.
I guess it will have to stay.
Paul

[W J]

Thanks Paul, called my old friend that ordered/owned that '66 Valiant 273/235 Commando Convertible car, and he said the car had a "Rally Pack Pkg"?? He thought it included some different shocks/maybe a HD suspension piece or 2, quicker steering, the wider 14" steel wheels, and the Goodyear Bluestreak tires....Maybe someone else reading the post who really knows these Hi-Po '65-6 Valiants can enlighten us more on these cars... WJ

[Paul Ceasrine]

W J,
It was actually called the Performance Group Package. I have to dig up the Code #, which I have somewhere, along with exact options.
It was similar to the Formula S Package on the Cuda's. Only difference,
no "S" badging of course, tachometer, and no GoodYear Blue-Streak tires. They could be ordered as an option.
Here's the #'s.
65' Valiant 273/235HP convertibles.
235 produced. (156 Automatic).... (79 4-speeds)
What's rare. A late-year produced 65', with an 8 3/4" Sure-Grip Posi.
The early ones only came through with a 7 1/4".
Oh... This is the D-Daert page............Mi' dollente'
Paul

[W J]

Starting to look like the D-Dart/Valiant thread....The lowly Valiant wants it's own thread, Paul.... They say nothing revs like a built 273....WJ

[dart4forte]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

Bill,
I think the only information that the NHRA has listed on the 66' D-Dart is that it was listed from the factory as a Super Stock Package.
It was listed in the car description from Dodge as equipped with
a Super Stock 66 Engine.
S.C. 364 (Special Order Engine)
That's what the NHRA is going by?
But, in 1966 the only Super Stock class in the NHRA was S/S or S/SA.
Of course the car is listed as a D-Dart. And designated for the D/Stock
class by the NHRA. As built, the car met the legal requirements.
Weight 2946 and horsepower 275.
Whether 50 cars were actually built is still debateable. Back then, it appears that as long as a VIN #'s list with 50 cars produced was sent to the NHRA, the car could be approved for the class designated. Nobody did any in depth investigation. Some paper-shuffling probably occurred
on the D-Dart production, accidentally-on-pupose.
The D-Dart, (Super Stock Package) is really a misnomer. Now, if the
current 273/235 was (re-rated to 210 HP), maybe and quite possibly the
273/275 D-Dart could at least have a (250 HP re-factor). At least, thats
a start in the right direction. But, who wants to run that car. Are they
any 1966 Darts left in America. Probably easier to find a DeLorean
PC

accidentally-on-purpose.

This from the Dodge Technical Service Bulletin, April 18, 1966

" This bulletin covers a general and detailed specifacations on the 1966 Maximum Performance Drag Package. The first four digits of the car serial number LO23 identify these cars."

Also describes the engine "The engine is basicly the 273 cu. in, hi-performance model modified for maximum performance"

Also an ad from Walker Dodge in Canoga Park, CA ciyca 1966; " The limited production Drag Package Dart. Stock from the factory with 273 CU IN. Rated At 275HP. Dodge Built only 50 Of These Cars....
Stock equpiped with" and the ad goes on with the basics of the car.

[dart4forte]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

W J,
That question just might get me to start jumping out of airplanes
Never saw a 273/235 Commando in a 65/66 Valiant convertible. Though I would imagine some were produced.
An old high-school friend of mine had a 65' Dart GT (white w/black convertible top (with the plastic rear window, that would yellow due to
sun exposure) with a 273/235 Commando. An automatic on the column.
Not sure of the interior color. But, it came with a non-posi rear. I do remember the one-wheel spins.
The car still sits in a garage in Jefferson Valley, NY.
The 8 3/4" Sure-Grip was not available until 1966.
OLDRIDE.com may have info on the convertible Valiants.
Paul (Pull the Rip-Cord)

Saw one over at the drags in Bremerton, WA last year. It was a 4-speed car. The guy was the original owner.

[dart4forte]

Originally Posted by bill dedman

Sorry, John; I misunderstood. Paul Wong is.... well... let me put it this way: you'd have to look long and hard, and would probably ultimately fail, to find anybody with more knowledge of the 273 motor in ANY of its permutations, than Paul.... seriously.

If he says a combination will or won't "fly," it's very likely it's because he has been down that road, already, TWICE, and has first-hand experience... unlike dilettantes like me, who only knows what he reads.

Thanks for your comments.

There's no doubt in my mind of Paul's credentials. I follow his efforts every year and am amazed at what he can do to get those cars to run that fast.

[dart4forte]

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine

I thought you guys were talking about D-Darts.The only difference between a 273 Hi-Po (235 HP) and the 273/275 HP (D-Dart)was the camshaft (Cam-Craft .495/.505 lift / 284 duration), and Racer Brown 250 lb. ratedvalve springs.The carburetor was a Holley 600 cfm-rated, vacuum secondary unit, as opposed to theCarter 500-cfm AFB unit on the 235 HP rated engine. To allow for the Holley carb butterflies to open, the stock cast iron intake wasmodified (a free-breathing flow intake as Chrysler put it), the throat openings were bored out an additional 3/16".It really doesn't sound like a 40 HP improvement over the 273/235 HP Commando.I think the NHRA currently rates the 273/235 HP at (220 HP). As someone posted earlier, the D-Dart engine should be re-rated.Not that it would matter, because who in the hell would try to run this car in stock class, and be competitive. Not at 275 HP.Paul (Former 273/235 HP racer)

Paul,

I agree except the Holley was a 4160, list 3778 rated at 750 cfm. This is the carb off the 65 race hemi.. Also, didn't the motors have a spacer for the butterflies to clear?

[Paul Ceasrine]

W J,
Yes this is rally a D-Dart thread.
But since you brought the 273 Commando's up. Yes they could wind.
Didn't want to bring this up on this thread. But back in May 1968,
my father bought my mother a 67' Barracuda Fastback, yes with the
273 Commando, 4-speed with the console. Yellow, with black interior.
It was equipped with the Performance Group. HD rear-suspension,
HD torsion bars, Front Sway-bar. Sure-Grip 3.23 Posi.
6.95" x 14" white walls with deluxe wheel covers. Yes with that special singl-exhaust with the chrome-tipped resonator. No, it was not a Formula-S.
Cost, $2735, from McNulty Chrysler-Plymouth, Carmel, New York
Only 4000 miles on it. The sales managers wife didn't like the
4-speed. Either did my mother, it was a horrible long-throw
Inland shifter, with the reverse trigger (equipped with a rubber-band
tension thread). A real pain, when utilized with the console.
Paul