NHRA seeking input on Delay Boxes/Switches - Page 5

trailertoad1 · 04-19-2007, 09:35 AM

You are right. Get rid of two steps in Stock. FOOT BRAKE ONLY, keep it pure.
Spec buttons could be the best answer for S/Stock and Comp. At least then if you are doing the way it was intended you don't have to worry about somebody inventing a 1.00 hydraulic pressure bleed switch that they claim is no delay box....at least in their minds.

Don't forget to vote by tomorrow at www.nhra.com

Just an old geezer who still gets to the strip every week.

Bunkster · 04-19-2007, 09:45 AM

They ought to fix that dammed "worst red light" thing before messing with this.

As long as both cars in handicap racing arent't treated equally, nothing is worth fixing.

pro7474 · 04-19-2007, 09:49 AM

Guys, better really think what you are wishing for, remember the good old days before the long throw buttons? That was when we had regular blubs with a FILAMENT that you could see lighting and going out and racers could adjust themself. Now we have LEDs just on/off

We all will now go to a National event with the tree set at a 4.70 full tree and then next week we will be at a divisional track with a little more/or less rollout and a true 500 tree and WHAT DO YOU DO?

Michael Beard · 04-19-2007, 10:02 AM

Jeff Lee writes:
>> I'm getting ready to back-half / 4-link the car. It has been pulling left for some time now. Even what I think is an extreme amount of pre-load on the left Cal-Track bar doesn't fix it. Shock settings, weight bias , roll-out all indicate a car that should pull right if anything.

Jeff, check the brakes, and see if one is hanging a little! That happened to Travis Womble several weeks ago. Also, Chip Johnson had been dealing with a similar issue with his Hot Rod car this year. They found that one of the suspension mounting points was two inches higher than another!

Just to put in a quick note in the Mayhew vs stockracer debate... Mayhew was #3 in the world last year... must've done SOMETHING right, even if he is the best bad driver I've ever seen. ;-) For stockracer, congrats on your stats... averaging 4 rounds/race is typically enough to win a championship. With those figures, your round win percentage often comes out around 80%. Impressive!

Re: buttons, I drove a high 9-sec Super Stocker, leaving at 7,000 with a short button. It was far more difficult to hit the tree with that than with the Five-Oh button, which I was able to 'dial-in' in three passes to my sweet spot on the tree. With a spec short button, I think you might see more 'traditional' Super Stockers in the future... there'd be a tradeoff between having a great spot on the tree, and being able to chase everyone with a super fast car, in my opinion.

$.02,

Michael Beard
Staging Light Graphic Design & Printing
Duck Tape/Loctite Racing
J/CM '80 Volare 360 Magnum - World Record Holder

Randall Klein · 04-19-2007, 10:26 AM

I too was going to quickly vote no, but like Jeff Dona, I would like to know what spec release button they have in mind...to me, that is a mechanical release, not electronic

The LED's and more night rounds are a problem with the short buttons.

Just my opinion

Randall Klein

Boo · 04-19-2007, 10:34 AM

From what I see here the main concerns are people "cheating"- namely going off of the top bulb, and secondly- stick guys being at a disadvantage because they have less adjustment.

What if we were to do this; NHRA ?staggers? the tree. This means that the time the top bulb stays lit, varies slightly from run to run. Instead of the bulb being lit for .5 tenths (as it currently is), it would stay lit for lets say .46 one run and for .54 the next run (or anywhere in between). Now if a driver even tries to ?cheat? and leave off of the top bulb he will not be successful. His reaction times would be all over the place and he would place himself at a huge disadvantage.

Now NHRA and racers wouldn't have to worry about racers going off of the top bulb. If a guy wants an adjustable button and a stick guy wants a delay box for adjustability with a clutch release system, let it happen, as long as everyone is going off of the bottom bulb like we were intended to. Same for automatic guys with adjustable buttons. Bottom bulb, no cheating and a fair playing feild for all is what we are after here,,, right?

A spec button isn't a bad idea either but is does open the door to people still hiding stuff. Let people use what they want to for adjustability (track to track you need adjustability and clutch guys too) but stagger the tree to elliminate the thought of cheating. This concept has been used before and with success.

04-19-2007, 10:55 AM

Prestage bulb, Stage bulb, one Amber, green and red, won't need a box then!

woodro josey
I miss Buster Couch and Lex Dudas.

Owen S Quirion · 04-19-2007, 11:03 AM

.500 Pro Style tree fixes everything. Looks more consistent to the spectators too.

Owen S. Quirion
BF/S 1985 Pontiac Grand Am

Dick Butler · 04-19-2007, 11:14 AM

Woody,
Respectfully a one bulb tree could kill the handicap system. I ran on that in the early IHRA days and the fast car left on the slow car llight with better chance to react just dial in at the amount needed to USE the slow car light. Maybe it could be done with practice but...

Dick Butler 3529

STREET ROD · 04-19-2007, 11:25 AM

Woodro has the best Idea on the tree but why not get rid of ALL of this electronic , air, and hyd. crap from the 2-step to the multifunctional delay box and throttle stops in the so called .90 classes and ALL of the performance classes? Why use release buttons longer than your dick? Why add more **** to the pile? Make it simpler and LESS expenseve again. Learn how to drive your combo or take up golf instead! The average FAN might come to watch sportsman racing again and it just MIGHT get more TV time and save sportsman racing from themselves. Just my .02 cents.

04-19-2007, 09:35 AM	#1
trailertoad1 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 3 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You are right. Get rid of two steps in Stock. FOOT BRAKE ONLY, keep it pure. Spec buttons could be the best answer for S/Stock and Comp. At least then if you are doing the way it was intended you don't have to worry about somebody inventing a 1.00 hydraulic pressure bleed switch that they claim is no delay box....at least in their minds. Don't forget to vote by tomorrow at www.nhra.com Just an old geezer who still gets to the strip every week. __________________ Tow with a motorhome? Prevent damage to the frame, floor and sidewalls. Adds stability, safety and better handling to your towing combination.

04-19-2007, 10:02 AM	#4
Michael Beard VIP Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 4,060 Likes: 0 Liked 13 Times in 9 Posts	Jeff Lee writes: >> I'm getting ready to back-half / 4-link the car. It has been pulling left for some time now. Even what I think is an extreme amount of pre-load on the left Cal-Track bar doesn't fix it. Shock settings, weight bias , roll-out all indicate a car that should pull right if anything. Jeff, check the brakes, and see if one is hanging a little! That happened to Travis Womble several weeks ago. Also, Chip Johnson had been dealing with a similar issue with his Hot Rod car this year. They found that one of the suspension mounting points was two inches higher than another! Just to put in a quick note in the Mayhew vs stockracer debate... Mayhew was #3 in the world last year... must've done SOMETHING right, even if he is the best bad driver I've ever seen. ;-) For stockracer, congrats on your stats... averaging 4 rounds/race is typically enough to win a championship. With those figures, your round win percentage often comes out around 80%. Impressive! Re: buttons, I drove a high 9-sec Super Stocker, leaving at 7,000 with a short button. It was far more difficult to hit the tree with that than with the Five-Oh button, which I was able to 'dial-in' in three passes to my sweet spot on the tree. With a spec short button, I think you might see more 'traditional' Super Stockers in the future... there'd be a tradeoff between having a great spot on the tree, and being able to chase everyone with a super fast car, in my opinion. $.02, Michael Beard Staging Light Graphic Design & Printing Duck Tape/Loctite Racing J/CM '80 Volare 360 Magnum - World Record Holder __________________ Michael Beard - NHRA/IHRA 3216 S/SS

04-19-2007, 11:03 AM	#8
Owen S Quirion Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Captiol District of New York Posts: 71 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	.500 Pro Style tree fixes everything. Looks more consistent to the spectators too. Owen S. Quirion BF/S 1985 Pontiac Grand Am __________________ BF/S 1985 Grand Am 3.0 V6

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04-19-2007, 09:45 AM	#2
Bunkster Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 307 Likes: 0 Liked 43 Times in 10 Posts	They ought to fix that dammed "worst red light" thing before messing with this. As long as both cars in handicap racing arent't treated equally, nothing is worth fixing.

04-19-2007, 09:49 AM	#3
pro7474 Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 52 Likes: 0 Liked 3 Times in 1 Post	Guys, better really think what you are wishing for, remember the good old days before the long throw buttons? That was when we had regular blubs with a FILAMENT that you could see lighting and going out and racers could adjust themself. Now we have LEDs just on/off We all will now go to a National event with the tree set at a 4.70 full tree and then next week we will be at a divisional track with a little more/or less rollout and a true 500 tree and WHAT DO YOU DO?

04-19-2007, 10:26 AM	#5
Randall Klein Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Lincoln, Nebraska Posts: 785 Likes: 45 Liked 316 Times in 67 Posts	I too was going to quickly vote no, but like Jeff Dona, I would like to know what spec release button they have in mind...to me, that is a mechanical release, not electronic The LED's and more night rounds are a problem with the short buttons. Just my opinion Randall Klein

04-19-2007, 10:34 AM	#6
Boo Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 7 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	From what I see here the main concerns are people "cheating"- namely going off of the top bulb, and secondly- stick guys being at a disadvantage because they have less adjustment. What if we were to do this; NHRA ?staggers? the tree. This means that the time the top bulb stays lit, varies slightly from run to run. Instead of the bulb being lit for .5 tenths (as it currently is), it would stay lit for lets say .46 one run and for .54 the next run (or anywhere in between). Now if a driver even tries to ?cheat? and leave off of the top bulb he will not be successful. His reaction times would be all over the place and he would place himself at a huge disadvantage. Now NHRA and racers wouldn't have to worry about racers going off of the top bulb. If a guy wants an adjustable button and a stick guy wants a delay box for adjustability with a clutch release system, let it happen, as long as everyone is going off of the bottom bulb like we were intended to. Same for automatic guys with adjustable buttons. Bottom bulb, no cheating and a fair playing feild for all is what we are after here,,, right? A spec button isn't a bad idea either but is does open the door to people still hiding stuff. Let people use what they want to for adjustability (track to track you need adjustability and clutch guys too) but stagger the tree to elliminate the thought of cheating. This concept has been used before and with success.

04-19-2007, 10:55 AM	#7
LILWJ Guest Posts: n/a	Prestage bulb, Stage bulb, one Amber, green and red, won't need a box then! woodro josey I miss Buster Couch and Lex Dudas.

04-19-2007, 11:14 AM	#9
Dick Butler VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Richmond Indiana Posts: 1,196 Likes: 5 Liked 32 Times in 19 Posts	Woody, Respectfully a one bulb tree could kill the handicap system. I ran on that in the early IHRA days and the fast car left on the slow car llight with better chance to react just dial in at the amount needed to USE the slow car light. Maybe it could be done with practice but... Dick Butler 3529

04-19-2007, 11:25 AM	#10
STREET ROD Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 13 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Woodro has the best Idea on the tree but why not get rid of ALL of this electronic , air, and hyd. crap from the 2-step to the multifunctional delay box and throttle stops in the so called .90 classes and ALL of the performance classes? Why use release buttons longer than your dick? Why add more **** to the pile? Make it simpler and LESS expenseve again. Learn how to drive your combo or take up golf instead! The average FAN might come to watch sportsman racing again and it just MIGHT get more TV time and save sportsman racing from themselves. Just my .02 cents.