Update E-F/SA Bird Build...

[moparbrown14]

We are building a 74 duster to run in g stock. Hope to make it to indy in may. You guys have got me scared to death about the dreaded tear downs. How often do they tear you down, what happens if they find you illegal. We are not going to set any records, should be about 3 or 4 tenths under. Can't spend that much money just wanting to have some fun.

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by moparbrown14

We are building a 74 duster to run in g stock. Hope to make it to indy in may. You guys have got me scared to death about the dreaded tear downs. How often do they tear you down, what happens if they find you illegal. We are not going to set any records, should be about 3 or 4 tenths under. Can't spend that much money just wanting to have some fun.

Probably not a big concern for you in your situation. They never tear anybody down at a Divisional except for a record.

They tear down a bunch of cars at Indy Nats. but at 3-4 under you won't have to worry about that.

They do tear down the All Stars at that race.
If you are a pretty fair ET racer and you go to every Div 3 event for a full year, and happen to be leading that, deal before the Joliet Nats, you can plan on a teardown.

Another case might be , if you're leading the Div. points after about three races and then you show up at a National race in Div. 3, and they're looking for a few to tear down, you can plan on spending a half of a day with Mr Travis Miller!

All in all ,dreading teardowns is not much of an excuse to not do some NHRA racing.
There ARE plenty of other good reasons to not do this stuff.
Stick around here..You'll see.

[oldskool]

Lots of guys are real secretive about the details of their cars. But Brent has been very open with the details of his build. And I for one, really appreciate that ! So, I'd like to dig a little into one thing he mentioned--the converter.

Because of these wild valves trains stockers can run now, most engines have very little low end torque. And the short stroke engines have very little low end anyhow. So, in order to run quick, the converter must get the engine up into it's power range QUICK.

Brent mentioned the 4000 rpm number and up. So, if the engine's power range is from say 4000 to 6000 or a little over, then a 3000 or a 5000 stall converter would turn a slower ET than a 4000. At least that's my simple country boy thinkin. Now, I know that when you mention converters, everybody starts talkin about torque multiplication, top end efficiency and all sorts of other stuff besides just the stall speed.

So, if it's OK, I'd like to hear from you guys who know about converters. The 1st thing you always hear is I've got to know every detail of your build--stroke, bore, cam, heads, carb, torque and power range, max RPM, rear gear, tire size, weight of car, etc, etc, etc.

But, in this thread, Brent has laid out his build in a lot of detail. So, I'd like to use his build for this converter discussion. If this is out of order, somebody please tell me, and I'll delete this post and ask my questions on a separate thread. I certainly don't want to hijack Brent's thread.

I'll wait til tomorrow to go any further with this, til I hear from ya'll. Thanks !

[HandOverFist]

In my case I depend on ATI to make the determination on torque convertor size/stall...they have an extensive data base and know what works for most any given combo.

[Alan Nyhus]

oldskool: You're doing your homework, as your questions show. I'd sure encourage you to start a seperate thread on your build...you could 'copy/paste' several of your posts into your own thread and go from there.

Looking forward to seeing your Build thread! -Al

[brent flynn]

Oldskool... ATi is definitely one of the best, for Pontiacs , anyway... Ive heard alot of good about PTC, as well. But, i think ATi nailed my converter dead on, for the cam and the rest of the parts that i have... I'd have to do the math, but i trap at 6300 with 4.56 gear , 94'' radial, 116 mph, weighing right at 3500lbs. My car seems to pull pretty good, considering i'm running a 'small' cam(251/256*). and shifting about 5700 or so. This season, im stepping up to a 266/272, and most likely will want to loosen converter another 400-600, possibly. However, im gonna try it the way it is, first, with my lightened 350 trans, and some weight moved around, to the trunk, and see what i get. The new cam will move my power band up some, and will probably be shifting 6000-6200, most likely. Since my heads and intake havent really been worked over, thats probably about all the rpm it will be good for...but hoping that i can pick up another 200-300 at the traps, but may have to go to the 92'' radial, to accomplish that, unless the new cam gives me some HP, and wants to pull up better, in high gear.

[oldskool]

Brent--Thanks a lot for sharing those details of your build with us !

[brent flynn]

No problem Don... half the fun of racing, is talking about it...hehe

I had several people help me with some good advice, along the way...Stock has alot of great guys and gals... Without the help of alot of these people, i probably wouldnt have seen .26 under, with a simple build as mine...
Im hoping to improve .2-.25 this season...

[brent flynn]

Slowly but surely getting ready to work on the car, some more...Heater delete is all done, fender back on... that wasnt alot of fun... Picked up 350 trans last weekend... Probably gonna yank engine in a couple weeks and get ready for a cam change.... will be getting lifters done( limited travel) and getting cam and lifters coated, and will be ready to swap it out. It probably seems crazy to you guys , that im removing engine, just to swap cam...but i may redo my oil pump pickup while its out...and it will be alot easier to degree cam and check P/V clearance. Im anxious to see if new cam, trans, and some weight management wakes the car up a bit... also , gonna work on doin another carb for it, as well. Looking for 11teens!

As you can see, it needs some cleaning...

[Danny Ashley]

If you are thinking about another carb, then think Single Booster. Good news is I have one for sale. Bad news is it's expensive. LOL! Danny