Modified Stock and MX

[John Scott]

Just curious how many cars are running in these classes:

SS/ES, SS/FS, SS/GS, SS/AX, SS/BX, SS/CX, SS/DX, SS/EX, SS/VX.

[Tim Kish]

Recent years:

(1) car running both SS/ES and SS/FS in Div 5
(2) cars running SS/GS (one currently for sale) over the last couple years

SS/AX-SS/CX - maybe 5-6 different cars over the last couple years

(1) SS/DX a couple years ago since has been converted to a comp car.
(1) SS/EX only been one car since class was formed, NHRA made index so stiff he couldn't qualify or have a shot a class combo and having been one of the faster cars to come from the Sport Compact series he should have been capable (factory supported program)

SS-VX - maybe 5-6 different cars over the last couple years

[Jim Caughlin]

Tim's stats are about correct. Actually I have two cars that I run in /ES and /FS. I'm currently building a SS/CX chassis but it's a year or more out. There is a SS/DX car that will be out next year, possibly a second.

So what are you getting at? I'm going to speculate that you're proposing a 'Dick Butler' here and suggesting that classes be eliminated that are under populated. This is none of your business. What class do you run? Maybe we can vote on eliminating it next? Why stop there, there have probably been years where there was only one SS/P or SS/GM and probably other classes like that, let's just pick them off one at a time, no one will complain. I have been racing in SS 4 cylinder classes (not just occasionally but a full schedule of divisional and national events every year since '86) so I think I have a little bit of a track record on this matter. In case you don't recall, the 4 cylinder SS classes got downsized once already which was OK, I was involved in working with NHRA to streamline the revision but I'm not OK with it happening again. Here's my vote: Let's quite voting on eliminating classes that affect someone other than ourselves.

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019
SS/ES national record holder
SS/FS national record holder

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by Jim Caughlin

So what are you getting at? I'm going to speculate that you're proposing a 'Dick Butler' here and suggesting that classes be eliminated that are under populated. This is none of your business.

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019
SS/ES national record holder
SS/FS national record holder

Wow, relax. I was asking because I like the classes Jim. I didn't think it would be such a sensitive question to ask. Since it's none of my business I'll leave it there.

I'm going to stop there before I use words that get me kicked off this site. Have a nice day Jim.

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by Tim Kish

Recent years:

(1) car running both SS/ES and SS/FS in Div 5
(2) cars running SS/GS (one currently for sale) over the last couple years

SS/AX-SS/CX - maybe 5-6 different cars over the last couple years

(1) SS/DX a couple years ago since has been converted to a comp car.
(1) SS/EX only been one car since class was formed, NHRA made index so stiff he couldn't qualify or have a shot a class combo and having been one of the faster cars to come from the Sport Compact series he should have been capable (factory supported program)

SS-VX - maybe 5-6 different cars over the last couple years

Thank you Tim. I appreciate YOUR response.

[Geerhead55]

Ouch Jim,, why don't you tell him what you really think? In all fairness, all Mr. Scott asks is for approximant car counts in a few SS classes. He doesn't say what he is "getting at", offer an opinion or state an agenda,, yet he gets completely blown out of the water by your statements,,, kind of harsh, don't you think?
True, these might not be the most heavily populated SS classes, and I'm glad you participate in them ( I've seen you race many times over the years), but just because a person comes on here and asks a question, that person doesn't deserve the treatment you just afforded Mr. Scott. Unless you know something we don't know, that's my 2 cents. By the way I'm looking forward to seeing the new car when you finally bring it out,,, take care.
Danny Durham

[btrc]

As long as we are talking about compacts I have a question. Are there any classes where you can still run a Mazda rotary? I just took a quick look through the rule book and didn't see any. I used to run one in C/MC many, many years ago and this thread go me thinking.

[Jim Caughlin]

Am I a little sensitive on this subject, oh yeah. A few years ago my expensive SS/AC car almost became an equally expensive bracket car when NHRA decided to eliminate Mod Compact so I have some experience with downsizing. Fortunately, in fairness to NHRA, we were able to resolve the issue. It seems like on a somewhat regular basis, someone gets on Class Racer (usually not even a current racer) stating that there are too many classes and proposing their ideas on eliminating classes that they don't like. Any time I see a thread starting with a request for car count in particular classes, it's usually the precursor to proposing another downsizing. If that wasn't the case here, I apologize but understand my sensitivity on the subject, I've been beat up before and not going to be happy about it happening again.

Regarding rotary motors in Mod Compact, good question, not sure about their legality in Mod Stock. At one point they had their own class and were then absorbed (sound familiar) into the piston engine classes with some sort of multiplier to determine an adjusted cubic inch size.

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by Jim Caughlin

Any time I see a thread starting with a request for car count in particular classes, it's usually the precursor to proposing another downsizing. If that wasn't the case here, I apologize. Jim Caughlin
SS 6019

I get it that you are sensitive but you don't have to loose it every time someone asks about the class you run in.

Instead, I'd like to hear how awesome it is. Can you tell us about your new car, or is it too top secret?

[Dick Butler]

Originally Posted by Jim Caughlin

Am I a little sensitive on this subject, oh yeah. A few years ago my expensive SS/AC car almost became an equally expensive bracket car when NHRA decided to eliminate Mod Compact so I have some experience with downsizing. Fortunately, in fairness to NHRA, we were able to resolve the issue.

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019

Jim, Since you referred to a "Dick Butler" I guess I am allowed to comment. I think you missed the NHRA result. You are still allowed to be a "bracket car" at NHRA events. You are still expensive and are just pleased to attend and race the bracket program where you are called a "class Car" because there are letters on your window.
NHRA wants your money for entry at their meets instead of Saturday night at a local event so they give you some letters you can use to gain entry to the events. All the cars in the country which run brackets do not live up to your level of quality but if NHRA needed the money and had the time I assure you a "class" letter would be arranged to get them in the gates at Points meets. Just remember when the shoe polish goes on your window you ARE in a bracket race, regardless who sanctions it.
When you race 6 or 8 cars heads up of similar lettering you are in CLASS race.

Yes if a class is tried by NHRA for a year or two and does not populate that might be important indication of lack of need for the class. That is for organization to decide. Remember Pro Stock Truck... Mod was eliminated for some reason. I do not know but I imagine to thin the number of eliminators.

For accuracy, I have been proposing a class or rule variation in a current class that would INCREASE the number of racers but allow the costs to be cut by cutting the Extreme technology demanded to stay current and competitive. Allow you to cut expenses and still be competitive in a class setting.