Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

A few points in Darin’s post hinted at something I was sleeping on last night and thought I’d pose the question to catch opinions of other racers.

Would it make sense, or could it be possibly done, to run Stk/SS in a similar format that Competition Eliminator is running? Basically placing the brunt of the excessive number under on the driver, not the Combo. So it doesn’t penalize the masses, just the offender.

I’m not saying it’s a solution, I’m not a multi decade veteran, but I thought it’s a start to some sort of discussion on an issue that seems to be happening yearly. Kinda sucks when an entire combo is affected by a singular agenda.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Justin,
With all due respect, we're racing in a performance category. How does outperforming your competition with the same combination get considered excessive or make one an offender? That's what class racing is all about, and its what a lot of us multi decade veterans live for.
In my book that racer deserves 2 things - A teardown, and recognition of accomplisment if legal.
Performance should be incentivised, not punished.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

That concept would be a hard NO for me.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

I find it interesting that a class like Comp, which is very performance oriented, had this concept put on it and was just curious if it would work for Stk/SS. I'm all for getting maximum effort out of our Combos. Every point Darin made, would clearly be more ideal.Totally agree with you Jim, teardown and recognition are greater. I'm trashing my spitball kit now:rolleyes:

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

There is a huge difference between super stock/ stock and comp eliminator. Comp is a flat out first to the finish line category. They do have index's but have no break out in effect. The fields in comp are very small in comparison to stock and super stock. The cost to race a competitive comp car is much higher and much more difficult. Comp is in a much worse situation than stock and super stock as far as the health of the overall class.
I think there was less than 10 comp cars at the division race in Orlando a couple of weeks ago. Last week at the baby gators there was less than 15. Last I checked there is 17 comp cars entered in the Gatornationals. Most of us dont want stock and Super Stock to end up like Comp Eliminator.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

So, a return to "first one to the finish line wins" is not wanted? When my dad ran, it was off the records and no break-out, Class Racing, not "bracket racing".

You could do this today by implementing a strict HP factoring system to automatically factor all runs for a season, (and get EVERY combination corrected to about -1.1). NHRA could reset to "even this out" for all combos so, no more break outs, no more ridiculously under-factored combos, etc.

THEN you could run- no breakout to the finish line.
You could always have a bracket race combo event if you don't want to compete in a performance based event. I bet all the races would be within a few hundredths after this was allowed to "run-in" for a couple of seasons.

Accurate HP factors would return Stock and SS to its true roots.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

AND... Stock and SuperStock almost died! How many budget cars are in Comp? Hint...none. If you want to run Comp then I'm all for it...go run Comp!

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

I DO NOT believe that a “First to the finish” is the way to go! I should have been clearer in my intent of this thread.

If I understand Comp rules correctly, they are given leeway to go way under, blasting the index to qualify. It’s when they go under their index by a set dot number (.6xx?), during Eliminations they get penalized with a personal ET adjustment.
So by that account, I thought what if that were applied to a Stk/SS racer going an absurd one under (-.1.xx) number, face a penalty then and there at that race, and only that race, and not get the entire combo readjusted at the end of the year. Essentially acting like AFHS but not enforcing an average. What -1.00 number do you think is outrageous? We all know that some divisions have environmental variables that are more favorable than others. It’s just an idea….

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

So, as I see the problem, we have a performance based class, where improving your performance can lead to penalties. Usually, the faster cars
are accused of having one of two things, a) Rich Owner b) Mechanically
intelligent owner. These seem to be the cars that get the most penalties.
Conversely, with the advent of the Index System, some people quickly
figured out the could build cars for obscure or low populated classes,
for a relatively reasonable amount of money, and be as competitive as
anyone. That sounds like a relatively reasonable approach to bring the
two groups together. The budget mined Racer can race with the best of them and have an equal chance to win. So a win for the budget or Mechanically challenged Racer. This helps maintain strong participation
in the class, as most can "Play". But, no reward for the Well To Do Owner,
or the Mechanically Gifted. Here is their reward. Leave everything the very
same as it is, with one exception. Qualifying no longer has AHFS. Period.
And Qualifying will Award Qualifier 1 thru 5 qualifying points. 1 gets 5, 2 gets four, all the way until # 5, who gets one. Don't worry, it won't really affect points races as much as it may appear. The better drivers have a better chance to get points in later rounds than the usual top qualifiers. I believe it makes things more interesting. If you have already posted an idea or response to an idea, please share your thoughts. If you haven't posted an idea or responded to one, don't criticize my idea until you post yours for me to critique. J.R.

Re: Don't run Stock/Super Stock like Comp
 

Agree with incentivising and rewarding exceptional qualifying performance.
I'd be happy to see all, or none, of the qualifying passes count toward AHFS. Currently only the fastest qualifying run is used for averaging.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Administrative nightmare. NHRA has already diluted tech. to minimum. They would not want the headache.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

$100K for a used COPO, $ 120K for a Mustang, $8,000 for a good trans. $3,000 for a set of decent heads, $5K+ for a competitive set. $10,000 for a rust-free chassis that has not been worked on. Most racing wheels and tires now cost more than a cheap used car. Motorhome, enclosed trailer, travel fuel, entry fees- weeks off work multiple times a year- tell me, who is this budget racer you refer to? I don't see 10 year old pick-ups and open trailers littering the pits at DIV & National events. The entire class is not for the middle class; it's upper or wealthy only already. The guys that have owned the same car since new could sell them now and pay off a mortgage (almost). Not complaining, just stating facts. Bracket racing is out of control, too. Pure Stock may be an option again for these few budget racers. It just ain't cheap, period.

Adjust indexes over 18 months and restore the roots of "class racing".

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Here's my set-up. I race on a pretty tight budget with some help from some very good friends. I probably could find a way to do it completely solo but the help with parts and things of that nature go a long long way. 20 y/o truck with an open trailer and stocker that I've built just over the last year and a half. It took me a while to save up and accumulate all this stuff, but pretty much everything I have is mine and I don't make lots of money. Just lots of late nights and saving money by doing as many things myself as possible.

If you love racing like I love racing, you will find a way to get to the race track, whatever it takes.

https://i.postimg.cc/4xKRwGFZ/IMG-6580.jpg

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Dawson, you’re the unicorn and one of the very few 20 something’s running a class whose participation is dominated by the social security and Medicare crowd. That said, if you had the disposable income for a motor home, nice enclosed trailer, a COPO, Cobra Jet or DragPak, that’s what you’d have.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Oh abso-freakin-lutely, in a heartbeat I'd have a toter and a stacker. Maybe one day after I hit the lottery.

Never thought I'd be so honored to be called a unicorn lol.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

You don’t need to hit the lottery, just keep working everyday while pursuing greater opportunities and the money will be there for that stacker, motor home and top shelf stocker but will the class be there? I say no. Maybe it’s combined with super stock and the name changed to “bracket stock/super stock” ;)

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

I hope 1320 doesn't moonlight as a counselor on the "Suicide Hot Line"

J.R.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Stock eliminator was created in 1955, and has been supported by performance oriented racers and auto manufacturers ever since. I don't know how long bracket racing has existed, but the Christmas tree wasn't introduced until 1963.
The fact that so many racers of means and experience along with the OEM'S continue to invest so heavily in Stock eliminator is an indication of viability, not impending death. Stock & SS will continue to evolve as they always have.
It's a Class racing thing that outsiders don't understand, even if their friends do.

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

The inevitable demise of class racing is a fact that the social security and Medicare crowd refuse to believe yet they’ve seen the rule changes over the past 50 years dilute their class from truly stock eliminator to bracket stock not to mention when they look around the lanes they see mostly gray hair guys.

That said, my advice is to enjoy what you have, while you have it and stop complaining about rule changes and every decision the NHRA makes. Stock Eliminator of the 1990s ain’t ever coming back no mind of the 1970s!

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

All of the hard working young people will be rocking grey hair soon enough. If they too have a little disposable income in their twilight years, who's to say they don't have some aspirations to run with the COOL kids?

Re: Run Stock/Super Stock like Comp??
 

Young people as a whole have no interest in cars much less organized drag racing with handicap starts. It is no longer COOL to do what we do and hasn’t been for decades Those few young people over the age of 21 racing today are mostly 2nd and in some cases 3rd generation racers and many of them bracket race too. Again, walk the lanes with your eyes wide open.