Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

A pretty grave violation but I guess the majority rules. You throw these guys out you dont have a show. To top it off, change the rules and let-em race. Big names and slap on the wrist and wallet. Wow. Just wow!

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...099&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...097&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...096&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...095&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...094&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...093&zoneid=132

https://www.nhraracer.com/content/ge...092&zoneid=132

Feel bad for the competitors that played by the rules. Much more succesful to cheat and win and pay the fine. The new NHRA. Get you some

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Worst part about this is no-one knows how long they have been doing it...no-one runs these classes to make $$$(payouts are brutal, especially in Factory X). Most, if not all these guys are racing for trophy and Championships....there is grey...and then there is black and white. Unless all the people involved do not know how to count up to 34, they are blatantly cheating. $2500bucks is a drop in the bucket....some guys have millions invested(including rigs, cars, spares, testing +++). Strip these guys of all of their points for the entire season...example must be made...these classes are already hanging on by a thread! IMHO

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Kevin, you're dead on with a 0

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

So does that mean Stanfield will loose his first person to double up at the US Nationals title. Does the the runner up in Factory X now become the 2024 Champ?
Think of the tens of thousand of dollars spent by the rest of the class only to be beat by teams with illegal Parts.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

NHRA has allowed this to happen and is catering to this environment! And don't think for one second that it's only a problem in Factory Stock and Factory X, it's ALL of the eliminators! We are given rules to adhere to which are (supposedly) overseen by the Tech Dept. and then the Tech Dept. isn't funded well enough to make sure that the rules are being adhered to.

and youze guyz can't understand why I can't take this stuff seriously anymore.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I see that the fines go towards funding the Safety Safari. From NHRA statement of action, "The fine will be dedicated to enhancing the capabilities of the Safety Safari". I've heard/read plenty about how the tech/inspections aren't funded well enough to police rules effectively. Given that these are rules violations in the performance of race car, why not send the money collected from these fines to enhancing the capabilities of tech and inspections?

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Someone needs to remind Aaron Stanfield where to mail the Wally and the purse.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I?m very surprised at this. All those guys know what they are doing and the blower pulley is the easiest thing in the world to check on those cars and they know that. I can?t help but wonder if there was/is some confusion over the spec and all the recent ?level the playing field ? changes ????

Kp

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

THIS^^^ that said there's more cheating in Stock and Super Stock :D

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Hey, what's the problem? It's the same amount of teeth either way.


Yes, that was sarcasm. It hurts to see racers I respected a lot being caught with this. No doubt we might hear "but the other guys..." but that is never a defense even if it was happening.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

This is blatant cheating. Not gray area stuff. Building something to make it look different. Not sure how you are able to go to the next race and look at your competitors in the staging lane.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I think this is covered in chapter two of the Jerry Eckman rule book. Look what cheating did for him. My only question, " How good can you feel about winning when you know you are cheating?". NHRA is not helping enforce the rules with a mickey mouse fine. Cheating racers should be barred from racing for a year. If they want the automobile manufacturers involved in these classes, then they are going to have to do a much better job of enforcing and policing the rules. If not, these classes are dead on arrival. Maybe just pump the motors for cubic inches and then let the racers do whatever they want with blowers and pulleys etc. Let's make it a real free for all. Maybe call it Factory Bar Fight.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Soo...
Was this the same infraction for all of the above mentioned cars?
Seems a lot of people making same "mistake"...
Any common denominators?

Asking for a friend...:cool:

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Alex Laughlin has a post regarding that from Geoff Turk on Facebook. I tried to post it here, it's too long. This thread answers the "why is he posting this" thoughts.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I read it here, it's the 8th post down.
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar...t-indy.569029/

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Why was one participant disqualified, with loss of all points and a fine, while the others were allowed to make corrections and continue racing, were fined, but only lost 100 points?

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Same teeth! Yes.
A few years ago when I was Tech director for our Local college go cart race I ran into the similar alterations to the drive sprockets to pick up the gear ratio.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

That is a very good question.

From what the Turks said the pulley had the right number of teeth but was a larger diameter. A pulley that they had fabricated. They said it also had a cover on it to make it harder to see.

No one has been able to tell me if the infraction was caught before racing, during or after.

It would seem like NHRA needs to modify the rules to set a diameter as well as a tooth count.

Bill

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

The N.H.R.A. Technical Dept. has completely lost any integrity it may have had before this debacle and at the biggest event of the year no less.
Lonnie Grim must restore confidence in the process of enforcing the Rule book. It won't be easy.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

The rule book hasn't been enforced in decades!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Everyone goes a little "extra" to get an advantage but this is blatant in your face cheating.

1320, you would be the first one screaming if you where in the other lane.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

This right here is the reason you don't cheat. You get caught, your past and present will be tarnished, forever.

The Stanfields had everything to lose and very little to gain. Greg's world championships and everything that family has done up until this point is questionable. Its not a question of if they cheated, merely a how. And I don't want to hear NHRA's fault as the rule didnt state diameter, just number of teeth. Its not like they didn't know what they were doing was illegal. Blatant cheating

Rest In Peace Howard Stanfield, I'm sure after this your lying face down. Tarnishing the Stanfield name for history. Very sad

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Wrong, I'd be cheating too like the many that are.:p

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

No doubt, because you're incapable to winning straight up.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I would think the folks in question would be out for a year with a $25,000 fine that said we don?t want you back!!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

You can say the same about many of your heros and competitors :p

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

There must be a part number and corresponding spec for the sprocket right? This is amazing.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

While I applaud the tech dept for finally doing SOMETHING. I am disappointed in the decision for some simple fines and some points.

They were allowed to fix the issue and continue with the event (my impression of the releases on NHRA race).

If this were any common sportsman racer and not associated with a name in sportsman racing, the outcome would be different.

Last year, a D7 sportsman racer at Dallas won first round of the Allstars at Dallas and was DQed for a wheelbase infraction. Why wasn?t this racer allowed to ?correct the issue??

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

The comments about the pulley having the right number of teeth but a different diameter doesn?t make sense because you have to have a certain pitch between teeth to match the pitch of the belt. So if the jackshaft pulley had 32 teeth, and the blower had 32 ( I don?t even know if that was spec at the time, just an example) and you made the jack shaft pulley larger diameter you would need a different pitch belt. And then you also need to make the blower pulley the same diameter to match the pitch of the belt. So nothing at all gained?

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I'm guessing that it would depend on how "tight" you could get the teeth on the belt to hug the jackshaft pulley and how "loose" you could get the teeth to hug the blower pulley and still work. I can't imagine there being a great difference in diameter but........

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

I thought they had the correct pulleys, but the positions were reversed. Big pulley on the jackshaft and small pulley on the blower and it would spin faster.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

that is what I was thinking reading between the lines.

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

My understanding is there was 32 nubs on the outside so the counting could be done and the teeth where spaced out where the belt rode to catch the cogged belt correctly, close to 1/2" or a 36 tooth. Pretty smart design as apparently it has been in use since mid season last year and passed tech several times. Looking at all the numbers from the races from last year to Indy is easy to see who all had something extra under the hood in FSS and FX Mph and ET don't lie. We did not run our FSS car after Las Vegas race last fall because we were not competitive there. We laughed and said all year we would have to swap the rear pullies to run the cars in show down . Well now we know that was the truth. We have been working all year trying to get our engines better to make more HP since we were down 4-5 mph with the FX cars prior to Indy. Now we know the 80hp we were looking for was never gonna be found. I believe I lost 3 races last year to pully-gate 2024, and 3 this year. This makes my win at Norwalk this summer all that much more rewarding. My lose to Aaron in the finals at Indy was a legit lose. He clearly out drove me as I brought my worse pass of the weekend to the final. Now since the engine in the car was ran Sunday in Greggs car then switched Sunday night before he raced Alex and I, well that is another story in its self. The rules are the same as Pro-stock, once a engine makes a pass in one car it can not be used in another car at same event. But since the engines were never teched in with the serial numbers as should have been it was left go. Again I guess some people think rules are more of a suggestion then the standard.....

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

The rules don’t apply to certain people. I’m pretty sure they aren’t the only classes they have “bent” the rules in over the years. They seem to be untouchable when it comes to tech, tear down, etc!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Bryan Worner...KNOWS!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Sad at this development all the carnage and drama to fx and fss while this went on. People made decisions based on being down horsepower and losing. Shame on Nhra tech as counting teeth on a pulley, a space on a pulley, even if no teeth are there, should be counted if you didn?t pick up the increased diameter by eye.

How do the Stanfields look their fellow racers in the eyes from here out. This isnt a misinterpretation of the rules. Would be with 2 black eyes if I were in those classes wasting my time and $$$

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

With a smile and business as usual!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

Since multiple offenders were in on the scheme perhaps NHRA should mandate that ONLY NHRA STAMPED AND SERIAL NUMBERED APPROVED pulleys may be used. ALL pulleys must be registered as to serial number. The serial number and NHRA logo must be easily readable. Makes no difference on what make of engine being used or the type/brand of supercharger ONLY an accepted pulley is legal. No modifications of any type whatsoever to the pulley can be done WITHOUT NHRA written approval. If the pulley is modified from the OEM specs NHRA will have to approve the modification. NHRA will further keep a record of ALL pulleys and serial numbers as well as who owns them. If the owner/driver/engine builder no longer has the pulley in their possession( car/engine is sold)or the pulley is damaged beyond repair then the pulley MUST be re-registered to the new owner BEFORE it can be used in NHRA competition. Pulleys MUST BE used in the ORIGINAL position that they were designed for such as a lower must be used as a lower an upper must be used as an upper NO SWITCHING positions ALLOWED

IF YOU GET CAUGHT USING ANY PULLEY OTHER THAN A NHRA SERIAL NUMBERED AND REGISTERED PULLEY, the results are : FIRST OFFENSE: Automatic 1 year suspension for the driver and/or the car owner, $10,000 fine payable immediately , forfeiture of all points , all illegal parts will be immediately confiscated. If they are dumb enough to commit a second offense LIFETIME BAN for the driver and the car owner in NHRA activities plus a $25,000 fine payable immediately.


Do you think this might stop it??? FED 387

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

As it has been said before
Don?t ask for permission
Ask for forgiveness
They knew better than to ask.
Grey area REALLY!

Re: Fine them and then make it legal. Wowwser
 

As a fan from Down Under I find it difficult to believe a few things.

1. The NHRA didn't specify the OD of the pulleys (as well as tooth count) to ensure this didn't happen. (Or the temptation there to explore a grey area of the rules) I am sure there are other classes with toothed belts that have explored this in the past and NHRA would have closed the loophole?
2. Specify the pulleys had to be marked and manufactured by Magnuson, or have an NHRA approval number on it.
3. Inspect these critical components after every pass with fuel and weight, considering it is a 10 second job to measure the OD with a Vernier and count the teeth to see if there is any distinctive gaps between the teeth.
4. Question why covers had been put over the rear drive belt (covers were mentioned in this thread earlier) as the cover is there to hide something and not protect the driver when there is a windscreen and firewall between the driver and the pulleys.

This has tarnished my view of racers and engine builders that I look up to in the /FS, /FX world as I have built my GM car using the /FS rules as inspiration.