Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Ken, if this belongs in the tech section feel free to move it. But I wanted to get this issue out to as large an audience as possible.

Last year when pulling my car out from the garage for the first time in the spring, I noticed a bit of an odd haze coming up from the engine compartment (thankfully I still had the hood off and saw it quickly). Turns out a -8 braided fuel line was spraying fuel out of the sheath at 60 psi. No abrasion or distress seen on the braid, just the rubber under it had failed. Was concerned but just figured it was an odd ball.

Well yesterday the same thing happened on my dyno just before a pull on a friends engine. Started the fuel pump to check for fuel rail leaks before starting the engine and a huge mist and cloud of fuel was flying out of one of the -8 lines, right near the headers. Had that happened during the pull, I would have had one hell of a dyno room fire on my hands.

In both cases the hoses were the summit branded hoses, and no damage at all to the braid, just a failure of the rubber inside.

I’m changing everything out to name brand hoses once I figure out who doesn’t have them made in China.
I also plan on getting the black “sleeve” stuff to put over the new hoses so at least it won’t spray out if they fail.

Understand all the talk of lithium battery fires, but this is an item which puts way more of us at risk in my opinion.

Kp

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Unfortunately these suppliers are buying goods from China at a fraction of the price that good quality parts cost. Jegs brand fittings and hoses are also from China. The material that was used was not formulated for use with petrochemicals. Chinese parts on a race car are always a risk. I have had similar issues with these items.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Kevin, how old were the hoses?

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I had that happen to my S/ST car the first time out for a new season. Fired it up to back it off the trailer with the hood off and fuel was spraying all over the engine compartment, luckily no fire. Turned out all my hoses were bad and leaking from fuel tank to carb. It was after using the “Trick” racing fuel in the late 80’s or early 90’s. I believe it had some alcohol or another chemical in it and it made all the rubber parts hard and brittle.
Was your fuel checked?

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

you got what you wanted and paid for, JUNK!

Meanwhile, the hoses and fittings in my Firebird are now 21 years old and not one has ever failed! Matter of fact, I’ve never had one fitting nor hose leak in any of my race cars in 32 years. Of course I’ve never used Chinese junk!

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

In both cases about 5 years old, Ang.


Kp

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Thanks for the reply from the forum's biggest A.H., bar none. Congrats.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I have had Aeroquip hose do the same thing, however the hose was at least twenty-five years old.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I personally change out our fuel hoses EVERY 2-3 racing seasons--- The chemicals that are in todays gasoline's play complete havoc on the inner linings on the braided hoses. Many manufacturers like Aero Quip and others "suggest" they be replaced periodically. This offers complete peace of mind as well as knowing that maybe an unseen inner lining has started to deteriorate, no chunks, pieces in carbs or injector passages or leaks in the hoses themselves. Just like tires they get old and may look good but they are deteriorating and could cause problems.--FED 387

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Mine were Russel hoses, maybe 3 or 4 years old.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

say this forum's biggest crying biotch bar none. Congrats.

Now what part of the truth ands the facts don't you like?:p

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I sent this to my son who works at Summit and he'll pass it up the chain.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

there's nothing to pass up. The customer chose to buy junk made in china because it's cheaper than hose ends and hose made in this country.

Summit sells Aeroquip which is made in the USA.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

That's why I like this feature so much;
This message is hidden because 1320racer is on your ignore list.

I'd be no worse off for not seeing any of his threads, adds NOTHING to the conversation.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Adds EVERYTHING to the conversation, the truth and the facts! :p

If you buy Chinese junk, don’t expect it to get the same performance, same service life as the industry leaders who’s products are made in the USA!

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I did a quick check of the Summit fitting/hose end; Made in the USA!

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Fuel line leaks have happened to me at least 3 times in the past 20 years. Racing fuel was in the bladder during winter storage in a heated building. I went to start car in the spring…and voila fuel on the floor. I had to change all the lines from bladder to carb…time consuming and pricey.I would not fault Summit,Jegs or Earl’s. I would fault racing fuel. Since these occurrences, I have totally emptied the bladder and lines during winter storage for the last 10 years. So far…it’s working.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Your quick check resulted in you posting misinformation!

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Hard to tell who actually makes them. When I purchased a new Simpson jacket I made absolutely sure it was made in America. Right in the Summit book, "Made in America" . When I took the jacket out of the box it did indeed say "Made in America" on the outside of the box. BUT, on the lining of the actual coat... Made in Vietnam.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Disagree! I have never emptied my fuel system in any of my 3 race cars in over 30 years and I’ve never had a leaking hose nor fitting..

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

https://proshop.summitracing.com/parts/sum-220890b

Their statement.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I just called the Pro shop and asked if they are off shore and the answer was YES!

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I have always used Earl's for my race car plumbing - and they have generally been very reliable.... I did have hoses spring leaks twice - both times it was fuel lines. Once # 10 main feed and the other a # 8 return line from the pump. Both lines were at least 10 years old maybe a few more than that. I have always run VP C-11 fuel in the class cars. Both times the leaks sprung after the car was stored for the winter. Anyway - does make me think its the fuels we use.
So here is an interesting observation - In the dragster I run C-14.... and here is what I noticed..... When I store C-11 in a VP fuel jug somehow it always leaks out the bottom... seeps through the seam where the two halves are joined.....stinks up the trailer etc...
I can put C-14 in that SAME jug.... leave it in the trailer in the heat for weeks and it doesn't leak or seep out. Figure that one out ! Anyone who wants to see it can come see me at the races.
So I'm guessing certain fuels are harder on the rubber and contribute to these premature failures.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

1320racer--no-name well you have totally lost any credibility -- same hoses for 21 years ??? - not much to be proud of there -

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

he is a legend in his own mind.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Welcome to the Global Supply chain.
Many US companies manufacture overseas. Most have faculties to navigate the sourcing of raw materials to ensure the finished product complies with their specifications in these countries.
However when non manufactures such as " distributors" get sold by a offshore vendor that promises
the same quality product at a lower cost , it attracts interest.
Distributors that import products
under their own brand name may or may not have engineers on staff to provide their offshore vendor / manufacture with clear specification requirements for each product being purchased.
Then once received in the USA, does the distributor have an in-house QC inspection program , PMI ( positive material identification) capabilities etc to confirm the product received conforms to the purchase specifications?
There's costs associated to do all of this to provide a quality product.
I don't think many racers would purchase a distributor branded Rod bolt for their motor would they?

Steve Teeter Stk/SS B/SA 620

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

As I have until about 10 years ago without issue. My only reason for moving away from Earl’s was my unhappiness with their black anodized fittings turning violet in color. I then tried Fragola which IMO are the worse, not only did the have the same issue with their black fittings, but their swivel fittings sieze up frequently. I have since moved to XRP a few years ago on my Dragster and my Firebird’s fuel system from cell to carb is getting all new XRP hose and fittings right now, after 21 years of leak free, trouble free service from Aeroquip hoses and fittings, as part of the rebuild, upgrading and modernization to my Firebird that started December of 2022.

https://classracer.com/classforum/sh...t=86419&page=3

Also note that I have used Sunoco Race Fuels exclusively, all three blends, Standard/110, Supreme/112 my current fuel for both cars and Maximal/116 over the past 30+ years

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Been there done that, unfortunately with a running car, thankfully hood was off after a quarter final. As soon as it fired up it literally went a blaze. The brand of hose has already been mentioned here, and no its not Jegs or Summit, it is from here. I have since switched to using Fragola and not had issues.

This was Boise in 2013 when we had a fire from a fuel line which leaked internally from the rubber. I lost a radiator, fans, coil, water pump and most of the electrical wiring. Also pretty much burned through the front end of the car. Yes I had a fire system that was deployed but with no hood it likely did nothing, it took another 11 extinguishers and a lot of friends to help put it out.

https://i.postimg.cc/j2HX7JJf/IMG-0207.jpg

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

what brand Al? Most leaks are caused by end user assembly, not failure of the fitting or hose.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I've had similar problems with Fragola. I use pretty much all Aeroquip or Earls now and all Aeroquip hose....so far, the hose has worked well with C12

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Anyone using PTFE? If so, care to share results?

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I use XRP. I bought a Fragola fitting once because i heard good things about them I throw it in the trash as soon as I compared it to a XRP.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

yes - on all the gauge pressure lines & of course the brake hoses

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I've always been a fan of Aeroquip hose with their AQP inner tube but I would be surprised if it's still made in the USA. Aeroquip is owned by Danfoss, a Danish conglomerate who has manufacturing facilities all over the world. You also have to remember hose has a life no matter who makes it. I worked on heavy equipment before i retired and have seen hydraulic hose 10 years old that you couldn't bend and if you did, the inner liner would break up and come out in little pieces.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

I'm about to give up on the rubber liner stuff and go to the Teflon lined hose for everything.

Someone tell me a down side to it, other than cost.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

"1320 racer" Why the administrator of this website still allows your obnoxious rantings on hear is beyond me.
You're obviously a legend in your own mind. In everybody else's, your an irritating buffoon.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

If you want a great braided hose designed for motorsports, that will not collapse, that is compatible with all fuels, retains, and does not permeate or leak fuel vapors, I recommend the Goodridge G-Line XF 811 hose. Due to having a full length Teflon liner, therefore, it requires the use of Goodridge fittings also.

Another option is using general aviation steel braided hoses that meet the requirements of MIL-H-83797 or FAA-TSO C53a, Type A such as Aeroquip 601/AE701 hose and it is compatible with AN and MS fittings. A good source for the Aeroquip hose are stores like Aircraft Spruce.

Both of these hoses do not have a shelf life. There are some MIL-SPEC and SAE spec hoses that have a limited life of 10 years.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

nuff said, you're a moron and a hater going back at least 5 years!

I'm here to stay get used to it:p My opinions and advice or no less valid than anyone else posting here.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

Danfoss acquired Aeroquip from Eaton and all products are still made 100% in the USA.

Re: Beware of Summit Branded braided hose!!!
 

After 45 years working on forklifts I can tell you all rubber lined hose will leak no matter who makes it. I have built thousands of hoses from primarily Aeroquip and Parker. Hose when it breaks down will sweat out the liner or pin holes or in the case of hyd. hose burst if the stainless reinforcement gets compromised.

Having 20 year old fuel hose on a race car is not smart.

PTFE hose seems to me is way less prone to failure than rubber used for fuel.
I have a couple street cars I plumbed with that stuff for fuel and has never leaked after many years and sitting with fuel in them.
Fittings are steel and as such heavier and bigger for industrial applications.
PTFE may not have as tight a bend radius also.
This may not work or have the "look" most want on their race car.
PTFE is also trickier to assemble if you use reusable fittings.

I am replacing the fuel line from front to rear on the race car with PTFE and will never have to do it again. The tight bends under the hood and back at the cell will stay rubber but be replaced periodically.