65-85 under.
 

I know that runs under 65 under will no longer be counted in class averages but what does over 84.9 under get you?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

If you were to trigger your combinations enough times for it to qualify for a "review" at the end of the year, there will be a horsepower increase if your average is faster than .849 under the index.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Well that sucks. Am I correct in assuming lots of people will be running slower than they used to on purpose?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

How many runs over 84.9 under trigger a review?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

none, it has to be 2 of 1.00 or more, until it gets to 1.300

Re: 65-85 under.
 

I would expect there will be a lot of discussions in the Lanes before Heads up runs about running to 1,000 ft. The Q sheet will seldom see a 1.0 under #1 qualifer. There will be a bunch seperated by only a couple of thou in the 849 to 825 range.
Calling Stock Eliminator a performance class is in question with these changes.

Steve Teeter Stk/SS 620

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Calling Stock Eliminator "Stock Eliminator" is in question also with all of the changes.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Alas, it's all we have!

Re: 65-85 under.
 

lots of racers have been asking for the AHFS to be changed. Now there is a change. You can still run as fast as you want. You just have to pay the price with a HP hit if you go too fast. I think this is a better situation than lowering the indexes across the board again. I am not sure why the runs under .65 do not count toward the average. All runs except aborted or incomplete runs should be counted.
People complain all the time about 1000 ft racing. Run your cars all out and take the hit and then you can run the full 1/4 mile. Might take a few hits for some combos. People have been playing the game so long that they have gotten used to it as the norm.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

So work on your combo , spend more $ to run faster and get a HP hit for your hard work and lighter wallet? The logic does not work. Why would any one do
this?
Yes the rules have gotten out of hand with what Stock was originally about but there the current rules. Change them to what everyone thinks is best then hire qualified tech inspectors to enforce rules, but Penalizing HP because of your NHRA rules is not the best way to equalize the playing field. (If that's NHRAs goal here).
I would be in favor of a personal index adjustment in heads up situations to level the field.

Steve Teeter Stk/SS 620

Re: 65-85 under.
 

OH YEAH! And the Choir Boys in Stock Eliminator won't manipulate that! Just look at the mess in Comp!

Re: 65-85 under.
 

My combo is rated from the factory at 365.
I would be in favor of treating my 365 factor the same as this one:

Mopar 426 365 291 295 1964

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Would you then be in favor of running a manifold from an Olds that came on late 50s engines along with an AFB that flows 575 cfm in place of your QJ that flows 800 cfm. Would you give up the valve to piston clearance and long stroke that allows you so much more cam than the 426 SW can run.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

So the combo just got horsepower and is still rated 70 horsepower below the factory rating.The Oldsmobile driver just "needs to work on the car".
BTW,I don't get the 800.And it was checked at St Louis by tech.

Gotcha.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

They bring a flow bench to tear down, never saw that.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Why would anyone run the 2206000 intake, when you can use a '68-71 440 HP intake? I certainly wouldn't use the 516 heads either when I could use a 915 that's 19 cc larger on the intake side...

For what it's worth, I have a '65 Coronet 426 SW car, and have had no issue finding those intakes or heads that they were originally equipped with.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

I'd probably use the 2206000 because you could buy one for $135.lol

https://www.bonanza.com/listings/196...Date/842193838

Re: 65-85 under.
 

The Mopar's have always been at a disadvantage. We are stuck running 50 and 60 year old intakes. They make aftermarket heads but good luck getting them. Very little to no aftermarket blocks or cranks.
I guess we'll struggle through.....;)

Re: 65-85 under.
 

OK everybody! Let's have a pitty-party for all of the poor Mopar Racers! Maybe take up a collection.
At least the FFFord Racers don't whine.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Easy there Billy man, I'm just rattling your chain.

But you have to be honest, the Mopar folks have the least amount of parts to choose from. When you go faster than 75 mph, it takes some good parts and pieces.

Have fun and may the force be with you.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

I would say Pontiac folks have the least amount of approved aftermarket parts.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Ya can put any of the B-O-P Racers on that list.
When is the last time a B-O-P Racer got a bigger cam or a change in the weight of the rotating assy.?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Let's go with M-B-O-P as the leaders of Stock oppression. Common issues for all four. :D:(

Regardless, we all try our best with the rules & parts we have. All of us have to be a little crazy for doing this.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Unless it's a misprint,the B of the B-O-P racers have 10.5 compression pistons in 1971,1972,1973 on the engine blueprint specs.

I always thought the 1971 engines started the era of low compression pistons and unleaded fuel.But I might be wrong,as I was only 5 or 6 years old at the time.I know the O got low compression pistons.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

When I was growing up 10.5:1 WAS low compression! :eek:

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Wellllllllllllllllll, the B Racers DO have some friends in high places! AND some (most) of the "legal replacement" pistons DO have very advantageous piston dish volumes.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

No,no M! They've gotten more than their share of "handouts" over the years!

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Does the M stand for Mercury. I can’t believe how much cam and Dove heads they received. Oh fudge I forgot about the 735 cfm carb. I know what CFM stands for us Mo Par’s

Re: 65-85 under.
 

You can build a 1969 Camaro 396/375 without using an original OEM part?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

The Rule Book "enhancements" have enabled this crap. The old guard of the NHRA Rule Book (i.e; Farmer, Greg X and the like) paved a better way of enforcing the rules by employing good qualified people with the dedication to the book.

A great Division Director, as a leader must see rules integrity as the cornerstone, not as an Event Marketing Manager.

Especially D1. Of all places.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Enlighten me, should this be okay?

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Oh, by the way D6 is looking for a DD. How many DD jobs have been posted in the past 24 months? Too many is the answer.
Weak lateral support from the NHRA leadership team is the reason for this turnover ,or is it a change in strategy?
Oh yea, what would that strategy be?

If I would be placing my eggs in one basket at the divisional level it would be racers. End of story. NHRA, stop rapeing your member tracks that support and host Divisional events.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Frank for better or worse the good old days of Stock and Super/Stock are long gone. Those years you talk about were as far as I'm concerned the Golden Years of Stock and Super/Stock. No AHFS and racers that ran their cars every run almost as fast as they could get it to go. I don't remember seeing anyone lifting at the 1000 ft mark to protect their combo. I'm sure a few did but it wasn't the norm.

The heads I have on my car were bought from a GM dealer and have a GM part number on them. I'm not sure if Edelbrock bought the rights to the part numbers or GM subcontracted them out for them to make. But the heads and intake are listed in a GM parts book.

The 396/375 hp combo is not the only one that don't have the original parts that were made back in the 60's. At this point in the life of Stock and Super/Stock there is no going back. I still look at some of the newer cars that race Stock and have a parachute on the back and shake my head. I can't imagine spending almost 100 grand on a newer car from the factory and then have to spend up to 50 grand or more to make it one of the front runners in the class. I laugh when I here someone say they don't want the index's lowered to not discourage any new people trying out Stock. Most of the new people that I have seen start racing Stock in the last few years end up in one of the newer cars. Or in an older car that is already proven. I don't like a lot of the changes but here is where we are. BP

Re: 65-85 under.
 

My point was to challenge the point that Mopar racers are in fact challenged. They don't have as many "options or enhancements" as Chevrolet racers . We all know the reasons why, one of them being GM is and always has been a more sustainable entity than Chrysler Corporation Et Al.
Chrysler's management has been influx for too many years to recall.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

So why fight with a combo you know can’t be the fastest in the class. If that’s what your looking to do. Buy or build the car and combo that is the best for whatever class you want to run.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Glenn,

All I'm looking for is for the rule book to be enforced and an AHFS that works for everyone. I like the performance aspect of Stock Eliminator.

Also congratulations to you! Going fast is not a problem for you!

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Larry, cut it out. Your Holley carbs get to take advantage of all of the same "enhancements" that the 735/780 carbs do. And there's a bunch of Edelbrock carbs that have been "approved" that look awfully clean.

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Ya know Frank, you need to get a Neon! ;-)

Re: 65-85 under.
 

You must be High or miss informed
Mopar has been given more performance enhancement than GM
That’s a fact
Heads intakes
Change the grill different hp
Change tailights less hp
Change grill. Less hp
We need an intake and aluminum heads

Stop throwing stones in your glass house.
Fasts

And by the way with the current ho system
The 396/375 Camaros will be A/SA. AA/SA
By this time next year.
A ruined combo. Fact

Re: 65-85 under.
 

Hey Ponko, let 'em "ruin" it! There's a few other combos out there that need to be "ruined" too.
They spend THEIR money and stretch the rules and do it to themselves. It has become THEIR game and they want to complain about the consequences. They've kinda become the "Wokers" of S/SS. Racers running a mere handful of combos trying to dictate policy to all of the other Racers running any one of a thousand other combos.