Is Bob Lang
 

Just curious if he is responsible for the schedule and track prep for all divisional and national events in division one? The reason I ask is so I can talk to the right person.

A little background on myself. I have sponsored race series for the past 14 years. Fun Ford Weekend for 10 years, we owned two classes in that series and NMRA for four years and had one class in that series. We have also sponsored Shake Down in E-Town and a dozen more in events across the country. I have been at almost all the tracks out there and I have been helping 6 or so racers in the NHRA series for the past few years.

This schedule this weekend at E-Town was the first I have seen of its kind where they ran ten rounds of small tire cars with high horsepower back to back, this all being done in about a four hour period. When you have a warm track, I would not say hot because the highest track temp. I saw was 124 degrees. Slippery track you don't put that many rounds of 9 inch tires, you must put some big tire cars in between. Especially the dragsters. They would help allot.

Factory Stock Shoot Out would have been more exciting if the track was working. I am sure Ford, Dodge and GM would have been happier if after first round if most of the guys weren't trying to take horsepower out of the car so they could get down the track. It was an insult to the factory stock class. It was tough enough they ran four rounds that close together in that type of heat.

Tracks prep is everything. I have been at tracks that where over 140 degree track temp and cars were working just fine. I don't know if it was the mixture of the new VP Compound, the balls of rubber leading up to the starting lines or bald spots clear out to the 60 ft. I do know what I saw could have been fixed.

I know of one instance that they were cutting the VP Compound with alcohol and they were using achohol with top end lube in it and that caused bad tracking conditions and caused accidents. It just seems like NHRA has not realized that allot of its Stock Eliminator cars make as much torque as Pro Stock with a 1/3 of the tire and suspension. They cannot blame this on the stock guys. They approved these cars. There is allot of the new and old drivers using them.

This is a very ego driven sport. NHRA being the promoter of these events should work with the sportman ego not against it. After all it cost each individual anywhere from two to five thousand a weekend.

Jim

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Good luck getting any traction with the knuckleheads in Glendora.Seems they could give a rat's sass if any sportsman racer can get down the track safely.Just collect the entry fees
and let 'er rip.
I think Bob tries to do the best he can with what he and the Div 1 crew are handed.That goes for the Nat. event guys also.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

I believe Bob Lang is the guy. At least that's what Danny Gracia told me when I had some words with him after losing to Connelly in the Showdown. I commented to him how I thought the track conditions were a joke. JC Beattie spun, Jack Matyas spun so bad I saw a cloud of smoke, then I went right behind them and did the same thing.

I know NHRA didn't do everything they could have because I was standing right there as the ***** happened. They kept misting the track with their spray without dragging it with the tractor. Before the 2nd round of the Showdown they sprayed and passed the tractor once in each lane. They both went up the right lane and came back in the left and parked. Without surprise both lanes still had bald spots.

Numerous people made comments to the starting line crew but they simply ignored most. The one time I heard a reaction they said they needed to hurry up and stick to the schedule. I'd rather lose a time shot if it meant the track prep would be better.

To make my experience even worse, I had to race Biondo heads up in the 2nd round of the Eliminator and probably would have won if I didn't spin. I'm usually not a sore loser but when it's due to the lack of track prep I fealt I was ripped off. Half of the reason I spun is because I removed all of the ballast from the car to run and support the Factory Showdown. I added my regular weight for the bracket race but needed to remove it again to race Sal.

Anyway, I have a lot to say about it but its not getting us anywhere. What do we need to do to make a difference? Many people were pissed with good reason this past weekend and something should be done about it. We can't keep sweeping it under the rug.

After I lost to Sal I honestly felt like I never wanted to come back ever again which isn't fair to me, my business, my car owners, sponsors, fans, and many more. NHRA is really pushing it if you ask me.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Thank you Jim for what you do sponsoring. As a fan who read about it all it needs to change. I could only go today, Sunday, when the Factory super cars can run in a class to be exposed to fans. Glad I did not take a no pay day from work Thursday now.It was a great day today, but so little sportsman racing. Only semi's and finals. They need to shorten show I guess? for fans attention span? I been here going back to the 80's for the old summer nats in July.
Good luck in all you do. Chris

As a fan since the 80's, I thought today went great. All pro classes were awesome. I did miss more sportsman as they only ran the semis and finals. The show is shortened to acccomidate the newer demographic? shorter attention spans?certainly an easier ride home today After watching telecast rain was a possibility. Still a great day Sunday thank you.
4 points I will make.
1 many drag racers want heads up classes. They are no longer interested in anything brackets to watch or compete. Cecil County had anothershootout Saturday and maybe today too where a lot of locals were. I know that for fact. A few told me. Now NHRA , they included 11.50 index. I like the index classes and they are fun to watch.
2 The young ones today like lowering cars and nice wheels, some graphics and intakes(air filter systems as I would say, they dont) and exhaust are not track kids. They don't like domestics. I work for Lexus, and see it daily with coworkers and customers rides.
3. The economy still stinks and many can't afford this.

4. Alan Reinhart gave the very best heartfelt thank you I've ever seen at the track today. They know people just can't afford the day out, tho June is graduations, proms, bdays month of the year People don't have the disposible income and many are recovering from Sandy and otherstorms also. I was with one today.
I was moved by his speech. Any tape of it?

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

David, I was standing under the tower when they were running factory shoot out. I watched almost everyone spun. I actually thought you broke your transmision. In my opinion the only way to correct the track would to scraped from the burn out box to the 60ft. Then let some big tire cars go down. I watched P.C Richard's Cobra Jet and Holbrook's have a peddle fest. Lord knows NHRA had enough people on the starting line that they could of scraped and had it done in an hour or they could of done it the day before. On Don Fezell's Cobra Jet he didn't want to run the FS class because the weight really disrupts his clutch but by Q2 he was at the FS weight lowered to leave 600 RPM's and took a full turn of base out of the clutch. Still lost a tenth in the 60ft. His first run of class we took another quarter turn of base out of it because there wasn't enough cool down time and the clutch was still hot. Which makes it grab harder. His 60ft. was a 1.49 from a 1.27 in Maple Grove last week. They strength is in numbers well stock was the largest class there and was the run the hardest in the shortest amount of time on Thursday. In the worst track conditions that was NHRA's choice.

Chris, thank you for the kind words. I have always believed in building and sponsoring classes where everybody feels they have a chance. When we had the classes in Fun Ford Weekend we had one starter for ten years. His name was Sammy, every driver trusted him. He had courtesy staging and he got to know the sound of your engine with the RPM launches. He would shut down the starting line to make the track work. In ten years I probably made a thousand passes down his prep track and to be honest with you I don't know if I ever spun. Most of the cars were low ten second to low nine second and they did not have the half the technology NHRA stockers have for suspension. Sammy use to say "spinning will brake parts, piss people off and ruin the show".

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

I thought the Run Schedule was Just Plain Awful !!!!!!

I was at fuel check after my 1st time shot & i hear them say " Stock To The Lanes"

I didn't even get back to my trailer yet to cool down, charge the battery, ect.....

I didn't even bother with the 2nd time run.

" Just Plain Awful."

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

I am not defending the schedule by any means,but what do you think it is like when you win the semi-finals and they are already calling the finals?

Sometimes,you have to get back up there with the car not cooled down and the battery not fully charged up.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

NOTHING will happen to remedy this situation as long as you guys continue to show up to race on whatever junk lang decides is good enough.

What does it take for you guys to stick together and say enough is enough and BOYCOTT the next event?

Only when they lose $ will you get their attention.

When the track is junk from the get go, it's only because it wasn't prepped properly period!

I was in the stands on Friday and watched class car after car after car blow the tires off and not once was the program haulted to attempt to fix the starting line nor did I see lang anywhere near the starting line.

Only after several Pro stock and FC smoked the tires did I see lang walk the left lane to 330 feet.

I have been racing for 22 years and every comment I have ever heard about lang from division 1 racers whether running brackets or class is always the same.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

If Bob Lang is responsible for track prep, what is the job description of the starter? Does the track crew have to get permission from the tower to fix the track, or does the schedule trump everything including track safety?

So, if John Force spins @ Indy he needs to find Jay to express his disappointment in track prep?

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Jim,
Thank you for your considered posts. You should consider creating a network of advertisers and event sponsors.The nhra executives have insulated themselves from the racers and fans to push their greed driven business model. They have developed a take it or leave it program for racers and fans alike. No one should forget that this corporation is still sucking off our tax dollars, at least for the time being. You can get the attention of this outfit only with the combined force that a network has to offer and possibly make a positive impact on our beloved sport.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Jim, I agree with you 100%. The schedule did not work. There was a wait after Super Gas ran for the Stockers to get back. They could have run another class in between and not lost any time. Also your post about the small tire big HP cars was right on. There was NO track prep between or during the sessions.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Pistol Pete,

At events where they have class, I do not think they should throw in another special class like the Factory Shoot out. The stock guys will have to make decisions wether they want to run class or support the factory shoot out. I thought most of the NHRA officials are Racers or Ex-Racers, No Racer wants to turn his car around in anywhere from 5-14 minutes for 6 rounds in a Row. That is what they did on Thursday. Just like a clutch car when the clutches get to extreme temperatures because they are designed to slip, a loose Torque converter can also generate a massive amount of heat. This will lead to hurting the transmission or over heating the fluid and pushing it out onto the track. It was an extremely unsafe decision on NHRA's part to have two rounds of qualifying then 4 rounds of class and four rounds of factory shoot out.


442 Olds,

That is uncalled for too. Races should have at least 45 minute cool down time to prepare, in most cases a car will make it down the track fine back to back passes. But it will struggle to make 6 back to back runs in a row.


1320 Racer,

I agree with you the track prep should have started a day before the race was scheduled. as far as racing in the NHRA series they are the only ball game in town. If you dont play by their rules in their ball park they will punish you. The problem here is that stock eliminator is their largest class, that means there are thousands of stocker racers that want to race. So they are willing to accept the schedule and track prep. This time was the NHRA's choice to leave the schedule as is and the track as is. Like I said before alot of the new stockers that come from Ford, GM, and Dodge have as much torque as a prostock car does. I know they know this. You dont see them calling a Pro Stock back to the lanes in under 5 minutes. They allow these new cars in NHRA so they should make it fair for them too.


Larry Hill,

In every series that I have sponsored Track prep fell under the starters responsibilities. Maybe NHRA should take some of the sportsman entry money and higher a starter just for the Sportsman classes. That Starter works directly with the Sportsman racers.


Bruce Nolan,

Our company has worked with many of the NHRA advertisers and sponsors already in other series. Advertisers are very important to the series as they are to the Racer. Most Racers want to perform as well for their sponsors as they do for themselves. It is important to keep everyone happy, this is a very ego driven sport and its not good to bruise egos. Because bruised ego's typically walk away. We had a class in Fun Ford weekend where we gave away a brand new Truck to the class champion and a free two year lease to the runner up. This was because we worked with the advertising company and the Ford Virginia Truck Plant. We brought them to an event and got them involved going to the event a day early, sitting them in our vehicles, let them start the race vehicles and gave them all team shirts. I know alot of racers this weekend spent extra time with their sponsors and people that helped them out and get to the event. So you want to perform well for these sponsors/people. The NHRA just made it impossible with the schedule and track prep.



I wonder if it is possible If Bob Lang would jump in on here and explain the Division 1 side of the story. Maybe Bob has no say at national events. It would be nice to interact with one of NHRA's top guys on this matter. I know I spoke to an official that was mixing the traction compound he said sometimes it takes a while to get the mix right. Then he said the only thing they need to do is take more clutch out of the cars. Which 90% of the cars there were probably Automatics! I spoke to him long before the Pros ran and infact it was a day before they ran. I hope Bob will help all the racers in this situation after all this is Division 1 and we dont want other divisions making fun of us do we?:D

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Pete, go up early and have time. I do.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

My car was fine ..didn't spin once ..lol Now I agree the track was not great..but look at the weather it was like living on THE SUN..It was cool that they ran class Thursday..But at Etown racing is from 10.00 to 6.00..gotta get it done Track temp is 120 PLUS all weekend..Now about the factory shootout cars ..You guys are running a 9 inch tire making 850 to 1000+ HP..in horrible conditions..I feel bad for everyone that spun ..you too Bo.
But this is NHRAs call ..Etown works better on a regular bracket day than last weekend..
Ed this is what we do ..been there done the bracket racing..We go cause we love racing..

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

My cars would not go down the track , in the first round of super stock we pulled 12 degree's of timing out , lower the rpm 600 and did a light burn out tires 128 , track 126 and loosen the front end all the way up . Still the car would not move off the line . It was pretty much the same in the FCS , I did not get a single clean run

I talked to a official on the starting line and he knew what was wrong and had suggestion's how to fix it , he said his ideals were rejected by NHRA brass and stated he was only a "pee ion " and could not do anything . He was disgusted with the track condition and since he was on the line he was getting a rash of shi* from everyone .

I support David Barton's stand but we should direct our complaints to the main man in charge Tom Compton and not the officials that we race with every week . They can only do so much with what they have to work with. My guess is that NHRA is cutting cost at the sportsman racers expense to save money

As a paying customer I know I cant make any money racing , I know when I figure out my cost it cost me a $700 a run with all my expenses to go to the races but I go . But when it gets to the point were the track is not prepped like a NHRA track that's when I really start to ask myself if it's really worth it .

I like hanging with everyone one at the track, racers and officials and both are not happy with what happened at Etown this past weekend . This is happening a lot more often now . Last year I packed up and left the Bristol D2 event last fall the track was worst then Etown .

Just my rant

But as Bob Bender told me this weekend keep smiling

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Jim

I did not comment on the Factory Class Cars.....

I just commented on the run schedule.

If i was down to the semi finals i wouldn't complain that they called me up.
That's a totally different scenario.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

I believe that all National event track prep is handled by the NHRA and not the division or track personnel. This scenario played itself out a few years ago at Atlanta, where the track personnel told NHRA that VHT was their compound weekly and at the division race and that VP didn't agree with their surface. Even offered to use their own supply for them to prep the track with. Tough luck, VP it was and I remember that it was so bad that a golf cart could blow the tire off. Anybody remember stockers spinning the tire past half track. If you were there you would remember it in eliminations. Qualifiers were not much better.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Track temp isn't the problem. I've raced on many hot tracks and I've never seen such a pitiful starting line. I remember a couple years ago at Indy the air temp was over 100 degrees and there were no traction problems like this. So how can you blame it on track temp?

I understand the officials may not have complete control of the situation but they just stand there acting like we're crazy for even looking at it. Some people were booted off the line because they were simply looking at the lanes before their cars arrived. If the track was any good you wouldn't have to get a preview.

Where do we go from here? Who's making the decisions? Can we all stand up and make a difference? Would enough people stand up to make a difference? I don't need to support NHRA, especially if they are not supporting me. It kills me to think I would have to go somewhere else but I can't keep wasting time racing on ***** tracks. Unlike most, I do depend on this sport to make money.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

James no one loves racing more than me! That said, the track temp wasn't the issue and it wasn't only cobra jets like Bo's cars blowing the tires off. Larry Pappas doesn't make 600 HP and he smoked the tires. I also watched big tire super stockers like Peter Biondo and Ron Morehead blow the tires off along with dozens of other stock and super stock racers. Bottomline is the track wasn't prepped properly and NO attempt was ever made to fix it while I was there Friday.

BTW, one of your friends and competitors told me on Friday that he comment to an official about how the track was a joke and was told "you can blame bob lang for that"

BTW 2, Saturday's weather was worse if anything and I dead hooked every pass at my home track with a 120+ degree starting line!

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Bob if you can defend that schedule at all then you are a glutten for punishment! Also your car will hook being the first car out.....ours will not and we need wait for a little bit of rubber. We where not able to get parked wed night since they stopped at 6pm, with 2 hours of daylight left. Then why would anyone only put one class in between Stock when there was plenty of others to run? Someone who either doesn't like Stock or doesn't have a clue about actually racing a car had to make that schedule. Although I can say the sched was out early, I even printed it a week earlier and never said a word or thought about it. So shame on me. After killing ourselves to get the stocker down 3 times (or once and spun twice), it was time for Super Stock and the COPO never was able to move an inch even leaving at 2900 off the foot brake. Twice due to track and once my own fault. 4 days at the track, two cars, and 3 solid passes total. I can think of better things to do with 4 days.....

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

As an observer, I'm just curious if anyone actually spoke to Bob about this issue.
We all know that E-town has a curfew, mix that with the strong number of Stk/SStk cars not to mention the possibilty of weather (I know at my house it rained on and off several times during the weekend with pop-up storms) and the unforeseen (track clean ups).

I guess what I'm saying is, if I have an issue with someone/something I talk to that person, in person, and not bring/bash it on the internet.

Asking who's in charge is fine, critizing something, you need to find out the facts first, in person.

Don't get me wrong, I know the track was less then optimal but I think "asking" first may help find the answer.

OK, now you guys can bash me. ;-)

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

"OK, now you guys can bash me. ;-) "

pentastarrail,

I'm sure no one up here wants to bash you. This thread is not about bashing.

Bob Lang has been invited into this thread to tell us what he thought about the track prep and the Schedule. It is best for everyone to hear this not just one individual that either went up to and spoke with or called him on the phone. There is an extreme amount of intellegent racers out there, we have doctors, engineers, contractors, speciailists in all kinds of feilds. Maybe there is something we can do to help.

If you walk around the pit area most all the stock and super stock guys that I meet are more than willing to help each other with their cars, feed each other, there is a big comradery at every event. The only time that changes is at the starting line. Then its every man for themselves. Thats what makes this a unique sport. We are not on the starting line right now so maybe Bob Lang can tell us why so many people had trouble with traction and the schedule this weekend. Like I said, maybe there is something we can figure out together. Bob has more experience with starting lines than I do, so what he can explain to us about last weekend can only help. Besides he is the boss of Division 1. I think it would be cool if he reached out to his racers here.

Jim D'Amore

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

we got a better chance of seeing god and moses!

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Just curious, what IS good track prep? I was in attendence at Maple Grove for the LODRS event and the prep looked pretty standard to my untrained eye - spray, then drag. It must have worked since I didn't see any spin from anything 8's and slower. TAD qualified a 5.2x and TAFC a 5.4x so it was obviously good for them as well.

So is the trick to use the right compound, then drag?

I remember last fall at the Dutch, I saw a lot of scraping at the starting line and can't say there was much of that if any last weekend. So I guess there's a sweet spot for the right amount of rubber as well.

So again, what's ideal for a Stocker and higher HP cars (excluding nitro) that works for both?

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Might ask the Div 4 track prep guys. Only reason I had my car back-halved was for out of div races. I was fine on 10.5" tires at all Div 4 races. And, we do have hot starting lines when it's over 100 degrees around here.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Jim,

Hang in there bud you're doing a good job in the rough'n tumble world of no name posters.

By asking you to set up a network of advertisers and sponsors, I did not mean to conduct business as usual. I would like to see you gather up all the advertisers and sponsors you can to develop a group that can work with the racers to identify common issues with the way nhra is conducting its business. We have a great group of dedicated racers who are willing to work hard to help change the way this organization conducts its business. The starting line is an important tip of a very big iceberg. nhra has squandered a fortune on bad business decisions while enriching the executives who have caused these blunders in the first place. In just one horrendous decision, they arrogantly squandered millions of dollars on the Pro Stock Truck case while their executives fly around the country in leased jets. All the while, raising the cost of racing and not increasing the payout. They subvert their own rule structure to accomodate the huge OEM egos while puking on the men and women who have supported this sport for 40+ years. Sure, they will eventually run it into the ground and leave town but it is our job to prevent that from happening. And that's what you can do by setting up a network of advertisers, sponsors and racers. Thank you for your concern.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Jim - Yes , Mr.Lang has been invited to discuss with this group but after reading most of the posts if you were him would you join in ? I doubt it - sounds more like a lynch mob than a discussion group .Many racers who were actually there are upset and it seems to me that they want to blame someone and hang 'em high .Sure , even I wasn't happy as I didn't make it down the track once but to blame all of it on someone who for many years has prepped tracks all over the country successfully . I really don't know exactly how hot the track surface got at its highest point by I personally witnessed 134 degrees - and that by any standards is way past good adhesion .

I doubt very many of Mr.Langs' critics have his experience ............We all know how easy it is to be a Monday morning quarterback .

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

So jack since you were so quick to take them at their word and thank them, now since you've experienced their efforts, not hooking once and losing first round because of the deplorable track conditions, what you got to say now?

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

JC, I was not defending the schedule. I was just being a smart *** to Pete. I know the fast cars all had problems. Sorry.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Ed, you just "stirrin the pot" for fun or do you have actual input here?

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

From what I've seen and read, dragging the track is most times more important in terms of frequency of its use vs. spraying the track. Too much spray results in the upper rubber layers coming up to easily resulting in tire spin. Dragging in a sense helps the rubber bond with the surface allowing the tire to grab the surface instead of pulling it up. The other part of maintaining the surface is having an eye for rubber build up in the first 200ft or so of the track surface. It needs to be scraped when this happens. I believe those are the keys but I'm sure there are many more nuances to the process. Somebody please correct me if I my thoughts were incorrect.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

So how many time's have they (bob and crew) did it wright.This one got away on them.I'm sure they tried.The heat,big power on a 9" tire and the pro cars,some times thing don't add up and sh!t happens.that's racing.

only my 2cents

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

One thing I can say is that I was there and everything I've written is from first hand knowledge obtained from being a participant ..............

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

jack, don't be so defensive, it's understandable you're not happy about not getting off the starting line once in 4 attempts nor how you lost and now feel foolish after prematurely thanking lang. The question now is what are you and your competitors going to do about it so it doesn't happen again? Meanwhile, I was there, spoke to numerous participants including your driver who did NOT have any problem getting off the starting line. My knowledge is based on what I saw with my own eyes and what I heard with my own ears!

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Interesting reading here..I'm curious guys, no one has mentioned whether the track was treated with VHT or not. If they were using VP, then I understand all the problems.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

They will do nothing. Nothing but to complain on here.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

I am pretty sure, it was VP. Friday night I walked up to the tree with the beagles and it was the decent but not great stick stick stick stick, based on what I saw watching other cars in Super Stock in qualifying on Thursday it wasn't great. Two cars up car got sideways right at the first hit. My dakota with its 9 inch tire and short 112 wheelbase isn't as track prep sensitve as say the wider, longer wheelbase, and higher HP drag paks and camaros, so it hooked. Too bad I didn't bring the gremlin, if it spun the tires, then you know its a down right horrendous track. It would be good to know if anything has changed, in the past, I always thought national event track prep was beyond reproach, and you could plan on hooking plain and simple, maybe get stuck because the track was so sticky and slow down, but certainly not spin.

Eric

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

Please do not put words in my mouth as I certainly do not feel foolish thanking Director Lang ...........If you were really one of us ( Stock- S/S guy ) you'd get it .

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

You guys may have experienced different, but I have never been on a VP prepped track that was much, and the heat seemed to effect it worse than VHT. We had some tracks around here try it a couple of years ago. Thankfully they changed back. Really big tire & stick cars seem to be OK on it.

Re: Is Bob Lang
 

When I was getting teched they were getting ready to use vp traction compound. Track was good for our 305 stocker but anything with power had trouble. Most of comp. and SS were spinning as well as the new high HP stockers. Track temp was as high as 138 on my gun.
I think the track is prepped for the nitro cars and everyone else has to adapt including PS