attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers gone
 

In case you haven't noticed NHRA and IHRA, we the S/SS RACERS are dropping like flies either due to death or debilitating illness and we are not replacing ourselves. Even son and daughter legacy racers are diminishing in frequency. I cringe before logging onto Class racer fearing there is another new R.I.P. or prayers needed thread about a dead or sick class racer. Don't you NHRA and IHRA, ever ask yourselves why there is hardly any new blood coming into our ranks? Or how come there are so many die hard veteran class racers who are quitting or remain parked?
It isn't only about the financial expense, which is substantial. It is more about the"fun factor" and rewards which you, the sanctioning bodies combined, have managed to take away from class racing by constantly changing the rules and/or adding "enhancements". No racing for class at all anymore in IHRA and no class win money reward or any recognition to speak of from either sanctioning body. How about eliminating divisions altogether in the case of IHRA. This plus increasing our expenses in some way shape or form every year without increasing our compensation. I don't think that the NHRA S/SS pay outs have changed since 1980 Why does NHRA find it necessary to continue adding classes at LODRS events the new index class car counts are nothing to write home about and just how many more fans have snowmobiles put in the stands? IHRA isn't much better these days seemingly following NHRA's lead at every opportunity raising fees and expenses. And how about those cheesy $2.00 plaque's when we did have class racing in IHRA? Why couldn't we get one of those iron persons for a IHRA class win? I'm still not certain of the sex of the new ones. LOL
Ok, NHRA and IHRA - are you hoping we just die off and fade away? The Detroit manufacturers are deeply involved in Class Racing now with the new muscle, but where will the drivers of these cars come from if there aren't veterans to guide them?

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

I can say that part of the problem is the classes themselves. it is getting way too expensive to build a class car. Most "kids" roll thier eyes that it will cost 10K plus to build a 12 second car.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

May I add, who's going to tech the class cars. Who in my generation has the knowledge to make sure these cars are correct for what is being claimed. Unfortunately the writing is on the wall, enjoy it while you can. I know my kids do.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alex,
We had a similar thread going a few months back where we beat this subject to death (if you'll pardon the expression)
The consensus was...
just kidding ...there wasn't one.

http://classracer.com/classforum/sho...tructing+Stock

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Sorry to re-hash a Topic or beat a dead horse Mark but the passing of Chris Economacki and Brett Velde along with my own unpredicted illness put me over the top

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alex,

Don't mean to correct you! But, Jeff Velde not me passed away! I read your post and I had to make sure I was still alive. LOL . Building a car as we speak! We'll be back out there. The economy and raising 4 kid's has slowed my program down. But it will get better! See you a Tony and the races.




Bret Velde

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alex , I agree with most of what you say, but there are a few races where we all continue to show up. The sportsnationals come to mind. Also the d3 and d1 points races continue to draw pretty well. I think the biggest drop off are national events and for me they are just not that much fun. I also think that having the new cars in the same classes as the rest of us has hurt attendance. All that being said, we are all getting older and for me it's just not as much fun as it used to be.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alex - Maybe instead of dropping over like flies we should be taking better care of ourselves i.e. better and more often exams , more trips to the gym , a few less adult beverages - I could go on and on .........many of us are going to an early grave needlessly .

As far as replacing ourselves its never too late - next trip to the track take a young person along .............We , the veterans need to guide the next generation .

As far as tech goes - every single division needs new blood - this is a great way for the next generation to get involved - they are begging for new people .Sure , the pay is low and the hours are long but the return is rewarding - if you know someone with potential send to your division director - we'll all be glad .And they will train ............

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alex, hope you read the posts on re do of SUPER MOD. Many thoughts on starting over at al LOWer tech and price to get the cars back out.
Got to keep kids into cars also.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Jack, you just hit a button. Very few will take the time to teach a young person about our sport. Some just go try on their own but very few. The future of our sport is passing the history on to the next generations. Open up your shop to younger generations and teach them how to work on engines, set up a car and take it to the track. I enjoy working with my son and grandsons, 13 and 6. I have about 6 young men who come in the shop on week nights, after they get off work, and work on either the race car or on one of the classics. Three have engines on engine stands and are learning to build their own engines. You are correct take young people with you to the track, give them some small part to do at the track. Intoduce them to your old friends at the track

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

This is my fourth year and I would consider myself a new racer. I didn't get into it because I was all that interested in racing, but I did it to spend more time with my dad who races. The bug has bit me hard.

I can say with a bit of confidence that the new cars were coming out at the time I started and had created zero interest for me in choosing a car due to the expense. The route I chose was expensive enough.

There were some other barriers for me that were put at ease because of my teammates. The ability to put together a competitive car was made easier due to my dad's knowledge and experience. The learning curve for driving was certainly steep, but I cannot thank the Emmons enough for their patience.

Only speaking for myself, but I would say that I would have never taken to drag racing due to the expense alone if there weren't some other factors mentioned that played in my favor. I know of a couple of new drag racers that are getting very discouraged because of the struggles to be competitive and the overall costs. I don't see this changing anytime soon.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Chew on this:

A wealthy contractor got the bug and bought a new Mustang; its been run a few times and its a dog...1 second off. Its been massaged twice at over $10K, and is at another shop right now. The owner has other issues as well, health, work.....but: I cannot imagine him going to the track at 7 or so, getting the car ready, making two time runs over a 8-10 hour period, leaving the track between, oh say, 5PM and 8PM, and then having a 6AM wake up call the next morning....a man of this stature will want to have some leisurely fun, a nice dinner out at a restuarant, at a normal eating hour and then a few refreshments

The fun meter is pretty low when you spend 10-12 hours for 2 runs, if that, and who of us haven't experienced the excitement of a 10PM time trial with dew on the windows and on the track....someone once said they are trying to put 10lbs of classes in a 5lb sack


Now, you may say, racing ain't for this guy, and your right...the question is where are new racers coming from, the entry level cost (discounting dime rockets), is too high to be competitive for the younger crowd, the older guys with deep pockets may be like the above contractor, not passionate enough to put up with the crap like we do....pit space with shin high grass or dirt about a mile from the action, fees for this and that, uneven tech, bad track prep, unfriendly track personnel, misfactored cars ruining your combo and on and on

Why do it? To paraphrase Robert Duvall in Apocolypse Now: " I love the sound of open headers in the morning "

Drag Racing: a disease for which there is no cure

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

You guys missed a great one this last weekend at St Louis.Great track,weather.Didn't have to be there till friday,racing on saturday only a 6 round race.Less than 60 Stockers,and SSers????Also great cookies supplied by Div. 5 tech Dept.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

A lot of this right on, it's about seat time lets see 10 to 12 hour days for 24 seconds of seat time? What is the cost per second? I know several racers that have left Drag Racing for Sports Car racing just for a lot more seat time. Ask Terry Earwood about the seat time difference.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Oops sorry about that Bret, obviously I meant your uncle Jeff

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

You know, it really is a shame that what we love just isn't important to the casual car guy anymore. With so much to entertain you on TV or the web, things that require effort go toward the bottom of the list. The only way to improve interest in class racing, is to make it cheaper $$$$ and create awareness. You need to promote and/or advertize your entertianment product to have it thrive. It's a real shame to look at the seats on thursday at a national event, They're empty!

You can't sell any food,T-shirts, etc to an empty seat. FREE ADMISSION on Wed-Thur and reap the profit from there. A portian of the fans will want to see the pros on Friday and pay at that time. Or if they want to go in the pits, they can pay a fee. Now you have introduced new folks that would not have paid to get in, and some will come back again. And maybe a few will want to try and compete. Just think of what it would do for the racer, racing in front of a big crowd like you made it to Sunday. I would think that would bring a few cars out from the garage as well. Although when I was racing (on track), I never saw the stands because I was fully focused on the task at hand!

Class racing needs a good shot in the arm to enhance interest momentum of the new cars, and to keep alive the old cars! This starts with a creative approach done by everyone that loves the sport. Take care of it....while we still have it....be progressive

As far as health goes....I ride a bicycle at the track...It's easier to park...gets through the crowd better....don't cost a nickel! Nuff said

Wade Mahaffey

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

My son is 24 now. He has always helped me since I bought my SS car in 06. At first he wanted to turn his 70 Nova into a B/S car. After awhile of seeing me drown trying to build then maintain my car he said no way. He races dirt track now. He loves it runs every weekend. Local no travel and way cheaper than a stocker. He is putting the Nova back on the street. He is still trying to get me to switch to a LS engine to run GT. LOL

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

I think it has to do with several factors.
1) The old Diehard Gearheads are leaving.
2) New Blood come on. Most new blood racers have a delay box in mind instead of a weight break.

3) I think the economy has finally caught up with the Diehard Gearheads too.

Lots of these racers would only attend 10-20 races a year, so racing was still in their budget somewhat, more than the local weekly bracket racer, or Big Buck racer.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Here we go again with another "Why are we losing class racers" thread.

Do any of you people know how much money a young person makes?

If you are a great worker with a good job after rent, utilities, insurance, gas, cell phone bill, internet, food etc you might have $20 per week.

There is no "stock" anymore. The A/SA record is faster than "The Grump" & Sox & Martin pro stockers ran when I was young. That's right folks. Faster than the faster pro stockers in the country. Could you afford a pro stocker back then? No, and young people today can't afford a "stocker".

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Don't forget to give that young gear head a ride around the pits in a open header class car ! ;)
I was interested in race cars before my free ride, but afterwards I was hooked !


This is my first season running in IHRA Stock, but it took me 30 years to get to do it, so cost is a big issue for alot of the younger gearheads.
Plus, for the same cost, alot of the younger guys can run heads up classes in the NMRA and NMCA without fear of going "too fast"...

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Rick,
I agree.
I've got a 24,22,20 year olds that all still live at home.
One can't keep a job.
One leaves for the Army in 3 weeks.
One works 30 hrs a week for minimum wage.
They can't buy gas and Lunch forget about racing.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

You got it Rick. Bottom line is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and lots of it. Even the well off are feeling the pinch umless they have "STUPID" money to begin with.
Wade I hate to say this but there was no one in the stands watching the .90 cars either back in the day unless it was friends or family. Not trying to be funny but just telling it like it was.
I remember when Allan Johnson was about 4 or 5 years old at the track with his dad Roy with his 2 IHRA S/S cars. Today because of an oil business he is racing Pro Stock or whatever you want to call it today. That takes the "STUPID" kind of money plus major sponsorship.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Bottom line is stock class racing ceased to be entry level racing a long time ago compounded by the economy in which college graduates cannot make enough money to pay back their college loans or even find a job period . Do you really think class racing is going to draw new members from that. Wake up ! Class racing is surviving on money made a long time ago and it is slowly drying up. It is what it is ---Reality !

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Today's stockers and (especially) super stockers are pro classes. With exception of the rare dime rocket as noted there's no way a guy can put together a quality stocker on a young man's salary. A huge percentage of all the competitive stockers in the country have engines built by the same 10 or so engine builders and they are not cheap, in earlier times a good local engine builder could at least have a chance. Stock racers by nature have pushed the envelope that brought it to this point along with the many high dollar race teams. I try not to let it bother me but it can be intimidating to see a stocker show up with a motorhome that is worth more than my 2 race cars, tow rig and house combined. What's a 20 year old kid with a pickup truck and a 78 Camaro bracket car, that want's to race stock, think when he see's today's stocker teams, he's got a better shot at dating a supermodel.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Jack, You and Rick are just wrong!

If you were right there would be lots of young people racing in S,SS......and they aren't there.

I teach pool to a lot of the kids around here and after discussions ALL of them could care less about drag racing, most don't know what it is!

All they care about is the newest IPhone, best Xbox game, loudest tin can muffler and the biggest car stereo and is it has more than 4 cylinders they don't understand it.

And yes, I've taken some of them to grudge race night and they spent most of the night playing games on their phones.

Truth is, I'm glad I'll be dead before they end up running the country. Not a single one of them has any ambition to better themselves.

JimR

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

THE ECONOMY!!! Nobody can afford to come racing, because of the high cost to get in, and good jobs are very scarce. The weekly bracket programs are not doing as well either, Im sure if the NHRA was around in the 30's they wouldnt have had good attendance at the races either. We are not that far off. When and If our economy starts coming back, we might see growth again,

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

So very true Jim, this country's future looks pretty grim. Local colleges send their students to my store to do community service and many cant even put a kitchen cabinet on a hand truck and roll it out the door without detailed instructions, build a race car, yeah right. Their lives revolve around their cellphones, nothing is more important to them.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Paul, I gotta agree, I felt that way in the beginning, but after seeing how long the races go on if you happen to get rain, that motorhome may be a necessity not a luxury.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

I understand that many of the current racers are older or retired and are having their fun spending their money, God bless them, it is intimidating though for the little guy or the beginner which adds to the low interest from the new blood, as young people are very competitive and when they see it's out of their league they move on. On a side note, and no disrespect to anyone who owns one, a 300K motorhome is not the only option to get through a rainy Saturday. A 20 year old kid may be uncomfortable at a company party with the wealthy owners, same story for the beginner in class racing.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

I feel like a broken record,but I'll repeat my mantra:
We are not a car culture society anymore.There's too much competition liesure spending.
Oh yeah and the present generation,for the most part,could care less about drag racing,
especially class racing.There intrests are in foreign FWD cars and text messageing till
their fingers are numb,like their brains.
Flameo awayo.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Paul I have a friend who races SS. He told me one time that your car doesn't know what trailer it came to the track in at the starting line!

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

It's knowledge/money which prohibits young people from entering stock/superstock. Spending $20k to $40k on a competitve car is not something most young people can do or are willing to. On top of that where is the help from current class racers? If these classes are to survive current racers are going to have to bring in new blood.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Alan YOU hit the nail on the head in my opinion as far as running NMRA and NMCA heads up classes. If I wasn't raised around Stock Eliminator racing there is NO WAY I would spend the money I'm spending to build a mid 10 second Stocker. For the money I'm spending to build a mid 10 stocker I could build a mid 8 second Hot Street car or a mid 9 second Mean Street car and from what I remember when I was running NMRA's Open Comp (10 years ago) the payouts with contingency put NHRA to shame and its true heads up racing. Not shoe polish. Now there is a down side to this. True heads up racing is going to be way more expensive to keep up with year after year and their car counts are now showing that. The other thing is there is no press and no prestige anymore for the NHRA sportsman racers. There's no help from the sponsors like there used to be. I can remember Dad telling me that this company would give them this or that as far as new products if they advertised that product on the car (sticker). Now again if I didn't grow up around Stock I would not know anything about Stock Eliminator racing because you don't see a Stocker at your local weekend bracket races for the most part. Now I'm lucky to go out and see IHRA Stock Eliminator Champ Phil Combs and NHRA Div 3 stand out Bill Sempsrott at my local races but most people don't even know what they are looking at when they see these cars nor do they care. When you tell them that they are class cars they have no idea what you are talking about. Then when you explain it to them they are impressed for a second and then they walk to the next tube chassis 10 second bracket car with a 555 BBC with nitrous and a PG in it and think its the coolest thing there. All in all I agree that we need to help spread the word and teach others about class racing. Like the others have said take someone to the races with you its the only way to get the awareness out there. The other side of that is the money. Its not cheap at all. But its not impossible. There are cheaper cars to get started with and for those guys the shoe polish will help them get started. Everybody has a chance with the shoe polish.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Generation Y's lack of interest in cars. This is the headline most newspaper carry everyday, they're right but unfortunately many NHRA and IHRA executive have decided to ignore it. How many business you know will overcharge and have but contempt for it's customer base. Let's go back to the beginning of organize drag racing, 98.9% of cars we're jalopies or nearly used vehicle(not abused) where you had no choice but to learn how to fix it or leave it in the lane-way(if you had one) Unfortunately man being man, we can't stop improving on a good thing. We cannot ask young men and women or should we expect them to make the hyper jump to race in a top notch set-up right out of the box with their first meager paychecks, remember how it was for you, this generation have been brought up on McLife(everything done in two minutes) and Toyotas,Hondas(these are their Camaros and Mustangs of our times, even their 55's is the Civic) we don't even have a place for them to race with us, we call them rice burners and poo poo them away. So come on and give them some slack. I've written to Div1 Director and spoke about a new class to allow new style cars that allows all type of performance cars to participate at Division level(much better that having snowmobiles in the middle of summer, no matter how well they're put together it's still a snowmobile) this might bring some new blood back into the sport. Like so many of you know and I hope you remember that it was hard as a young person to separate yourself from your disposable income(why do you think it was called SCRATCH after-all). Next time you're in the lanes at a bracket race at your local track, try approaching that new racer and passing on some of that incredible experience that you possess. We the Bald, the White hairs better get with the program because our legacy will be I pods and Apple androids drag racing games for our grandchildren. Claude Ruel

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

They say history repeats itself, maybe we'll get lucky LOL. I feel that getting into class racing can be done on a budget...you can do like me and shoot for the index instead of the record. My approach is to move on down the scale, and away from the busy classes. Down in SS/LA there are some really fast cars, but only a hand full in the country. I love the fast cars and it would be great to be one....on someone elses money LOL. I can only hope for success on the elininator side, which is the bigger picture for me. I look at it like this, I can spend 10K on a good engine program that will run a little under the index (11.20). Or I can spend 25K on something fast (10.60)....either way I'll be looking out the rear window with a 283. Other than class, you don't get a nickel for being fast, and MPH means nothing on the eliminator side. More money allows you to look out the front window instead of the back, it does'nt stop you from racing. Also I never was a guy that wanted what everybody else had, or whatever was most competitive. I like something different (not crazy different...just not another Camaro). I like the really cool cars....that folks choose to race

Our scale has been leaning toward (reasons not to go) for a while now. It's up to those that love it to tip the scale back the other way.

Wade Mahaffey

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Very good points Wade !

I like the "looking out the (front or back) window" deal. :D

I also cannot afford to shoot for the record.
Since there are very few cars that run in my class, I'm just happy to run the index and survive the bracket race from there.

I will not say my total to date investment for my Pure Stocker is "cheap" (about 4.5K ), it is a car I am comfortable with.

Gotta love shoe polish... it's the great equalizer.....LOL

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

I have a friend who follows the NMRA and he says most classes have half the cars in them that they had a few years ago.Some are down to just a few real die hard racers with deep pockets.IHRA ,NHRA stock is still the way to go for a young racer.Just stay away from the populated classes, and you can still race on a budget.Just get a copy of Nitro Joes stats and see who running what and where.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Continued hand wringing about the lack of class racers. Do you reallysuppose any of the current racers would make the changes to LIMIT the cost of the class cars? WOuld they buy a Spec motor? would they help fill the lanes locally to help the new guys get interested?
Randy Wilson discussed on Return of Super Mod . Will any of you down grade the motor you have to help the project if a sponsor could be found? I suggested a car of simple motor etc which COULD still run S or SS elim at a points meet so you still are in the game at NHRA event but would create a new image people could recognize and move towards.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

That's a good one to remember.

Re: attention NHRA and IHRA Where have all the class racers
 

Every once in a while, a Stock or SS racer can grab their attention for at least a while longer when they see that Stock or SS car with the wheels in the air and outrunning that big block chassis car! It feels good when they ask if you have a big block or nitrous when all you really have is a small block in an all-steel car. But, unfortunately, that impression still doesn't always last and they go back to the shiney, custom chassied vehicles with power adders.

As discussed, bottom line is time and money. Kids these days want to go as fast as they can afford to and not have to spend time working to get there. I always liked to tinker, experiment and improvise with what I have.and can afford. But even in "Stock" these days, you can buy too much trick, aftermarket stuff to go faster. That's making it harder on the little guy along with the economy. A 1-2 punch!