AHFS Updated
 

Still a little difficult to understand but they changed a little bit of the wordage for the automatic hit of 1.2. Sounds like an automatic hit can be produced at and NHRA race including opens. Unless I am reading it correctly, there is no penalty for runs of 1.199 or slower at Opens and they are not counted towards the average. At least that is what it looks like. Anyone with a better understanding of the system?

http://www.nhra.net/content/sportsma...4179&zoneid=85

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Looks to me like they just drew a line where it specified National and LODRS events. Now it means all including National opens.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Yep , pretty clear it means all NHRA events ............or there was a crease in the paper when they copied it ! ! ! You pick ...............

Re: AHFS Updated
 

The way I read it, is that if you go quicker than 1.20 at a national open (or any nhra race) you get hit on Tuesday, Which has been that way for years just the number use to be 1.25 under last year and 1.4 under with the old indexes.

Kent

Re: AHFS Updated
 

So the fast guys still have to go 1.55 under the old index's,they still get the .15 gift from when the index's were lowered.Only difference is the addition of the open races to the mix.Man,they're really coming around and starting to correct all the negative moves they've made over the past few years.Yeah that's the ticket.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

If I'm reading it correctly. Doesn't it say toward the bottom of the page. All runs of 1.20 or more count including altitude factored tracks. Could get interesting.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Yeah if you took out the 1000' clocks. It could.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

It looks like the big change for 2011 is that ALL runs will count in the AHFS including altitude...

In the past the the only AHFS used at LODRS & altitude was the instent 3.25% hit.

So 2 (two) runs, by the same car of faster than 1.00 under the index, at a LODRS or altitude will trigger a review.

Bob

Re: AHFS Updated
 

The hits shouldn't stop at 3.25%.Let it go up proportionatly with how much faster they go.You know,the Artie rule.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

It still mentions 1st round of class, do later class rounds not count?

Re: AHFS Updated
 

It does. If you go 1.95 or more under the index you get hit 18.25%.


-Toby

Re: AHFS Updated
 

All class rounds count. It says:

"At events where class eliminations are run, all runs are included in the AHFS database."

It then says:

"Only the first round of class is part of qualifying and therefore is part of the "Q" database."

I assume the other rounds of class will be part of the "E" database.


Also, the way I read it, runs at national opens won't be put in the AHFS database. Only the automatic HP hit applies at national opens.


-Toby

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Thank you Toby.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Hi Toby,

I believe that the incremental increases in the percentage of increased HP only apply to a combo that averages more than 1.00 under the index and not the instant 3.25% hit.

If your combo's average is more than 1.00 under and the fastest single run during the review period is 1.49 under than the adjustment would be 8.25% for all cars running that combo.

On the other hand, I could be full of crap..

Bob

Re: AHFS Updated
 

The way I understand it is if there is a run of more than 1.20 under it is an automatic hit and there is no need to figure averages.

If all runs for a combo are less than 1.20 and there are 2 runs of more than 1.00 under to trigger a review, then they go to the average.

If you look at the web page everything quicker than 1.20 under says "(immediate change)."


-Toby

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Toby, That's the way I understood it.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Toby,

I think that you are correct about the imediate hit, but are you saying that the combo would not also be reviewed at the end of the review period if the combo average was faster than 1.00 under?????

Would an immediate hit exempt the combo from the average????

It looks like the AHFS was written in NHRA speak..



"Once the need for an adjustment is determined, the following sliding-scale formula, based on a percentage of horsepower, is used to calculate the horsepower increase"


"The quickest run, by the combination being reviewed, is used to determine the adjustment percentage".




Bob

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Yes, that's how I understand it. If a combo gets an immediate hit of say 5.25% there is no need to figure the average.

And the quickest run being used is if one car goes 1.21 under and another goes 1.51 under on the same weekend, the combo would be hit 9.25% instead of 3.25%.

Or if one car goes 1.01 under and another goes 1.11 under and after the review the average is more than .850 under, the combo will get hit 2.25% instead of 1.25%

It is kind of confusing, but I think I'm getting the hang of it. :)


-Toby

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Ok ,So if this don't work , will they just drop three more tenths off the indexes ? They sure gonna be a lot of 1,000 ft racing going on as usual,

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Bob,
For some unknown reason once a combo gets a new HP Rating all previous runs for that combo are wiped out. The data collecting starts all over at the new HP rating. My thinking is the runs should continue to be gathered and be reviewed at the end of the year to see if the " possible runaway combo" is still a running away. LOL

Re: AHFS Updated
 

"The class review revealed that K/SA had a class/engine average for the combination in question of 1.101-second under, therefore surpassing the 0.850-second-under requirement and signaling a horsepower adjustment for all 305/215/241 FI Camaros."

Sounds like 1.01 trigger, and the average has to be faster than .85 under for a hit.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Sounds like everyone is getting the drift. Also a racer that runs two runs between 1.00 and 1.19 at the same event triggers the review.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Except when they do it only in qualifying. Say a racer runs 1.05 under and 1.03 under during qualifying, that only counts as one trigger since only the 1.05 under run shows on the final qualifying sheet.


-Toby

Re: AHFS Updated
 

I just keep learning about this! Last year I was told 1st round of class was the only class round that counted. That never did make sense to me. Also did not know only the fastest qualifying time counted. Used to be just Farmer's call. LOL.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

The data from before the hit is irrelevant. Once it has been hit, the factor has changed, and the previous data no longer matches the current combination. How would you accurately correlate previous data to a car now running heavier, or in a different class, or both?

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Makes perfect sense.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

I've never made perfect sense in my life. :cool:

Re: AHFS Updated
 

I think you usually do.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

perfect change maybe, but never perfect sense

Re: AHFS Updated
 

What I'm saying is:
An auto hit should also trigger a rewiew of the class average at that time before the data is thrown out.

Soft combos are exactly that "SOFT"

I don't care how hard you work on your car. Blah Blah Blah

The fact remains a "soft combo" will still be at the top of the heap until it is reeled in like the tried and true combos.

It is my experience that the "Soft Combos" are usually in the wrong class to begin with. based on carb size, head cc's, valve size, cubic inches etc.

My question to all.......

Should any combo ever be rated lower than the factory HP rating?

Re: AHFS Updated
 

I don't see the point, an instant hit has always been a harder hit than one from the class average for a combination. Like any penalty, the greater of any penalties for the same "offense" is the one applied.

The minimum instant hit is greater than the adjustment you get from the class average by definition.

If a combination is hit with an instant adjustment, the only fair thing to do is start all over with data collection.

Regardless of how much the new cars are underfactored, writing "special" rules to hit them is not the way to do it. The minute you write "special" rules for one, it opens the door to do it to anyone. Fair is fair, same rules for everyone.

Re: AHFS Updated
 

excellent point Alan, however just from looking at a DP challenger you can tell its not "same rules for everyone" right now, especially the V10

Re: AHFS Updated
 

Doesn't matter. As soon as you rewrite the rules so they can "get" one guy, you open the door, and they will rewrite the rules to get anyone they want.

The test of a law is not how much good can be done with it in the right hands, but rather how much damage can be done with it in the wrong hands.

The same applies to rules.