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-   -   1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's) (https://classracer.com/classforum/showthread.php?t=31786)

rhinodaert 05-23-2013 09:40 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine (Post 374776)
Kyle,

Rule #1 - Don't ever try to figure out what the Chrysler Performance Technicians were thinking.

Rule #2 - Don't ever forget Rule #1.

Rule #3 - Always refer to Rule #1.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That said,

Does the Dart GTS have both front and rear 'torque boxes'.

The 4-Speed 383 cars had both front and rear.

The Automatic 383 cars only had rears, but sometimes both.

Does the Dart GTS have any idications of a Console.

These cars were GTS 383's with console shifted automatics.

All '6' 1968 cars were converted to 440's with B&M Automatic
Transmissions.

Investigation #2

You might have to check 1968, 1969 and 1970 Race Results at the
following California Tracks
* Carlsbad
* Irwindale
* Freemont
* Bakersfield
* Lions
* Fontana
* Riverside
* OCIR
* San Fernando

Charlie Allen was at the March 1968 'Hot Rod Magazine Championships at Riverside Raceway with that Dart.

The 1968 Dart '440 GTS' was classed in;
* SS/EA in 1968
* SS/GA in 1969
* SS/FA in 1970.

Information, back in 1968 "no' Header Company made an under-chassis
set for the 440 A-Body.

Only fenderwell units (Hooker Headers).

Some of these are not quite correct as I have documented a couple hundred Dart GTS's from 68 and 69. Very few big block Darts had both front and rear torque boxes, there is no rhyme or reason for that as far as I can tell. There are also very few automatic Darts that had front boxes. Iggy's Muffler in Chicago did indeed make under chassis headers, as I had a set in my Mr. Norms 68 383 Dart, though they were not known nationally at the time and no "national" header company made any.

Rhino

Paul Ceasrine 05-24-2013 07:16 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Rhinoman,

Yes I know,,,,,that list is 'fragmented'.

I had a 1967 Barracuda 273/235 HP 'Commando' convertible, with an
automatic.

It had the 'front' Torque Boxes, but not on the rear.........

Back in 1967, I think it was Belanger Headers who could custom make
a set of Headers for the 383 A-Body, but they were very expensive.

Kyle Kohr 11-26-2014 01:10 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
6 Attachment(s)
We started working on the Charlie Allen dart again today and found something very interesting. As we were cutting out the after market wheel tubs we found a bolt that ran through the frame rail that we knew did not belong. We did not know what it was for and looked at our copy of american rodding from 1969 which has an article on this car. It turns out Charlie relocated the shocked to the front of the rear and mounted them vertical to reduce wheel hop. I feel it just helps to prove that this is really his dart because who does that kind of stuff.

Here are a few pictures

Liteweight 11-26-2014 03:00 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
great to see your still on that project Kyle. You've got a very special car there. glad to see someone is returning one of these back to it's formal glory. Were you ever able to get in touch with Charlie Allen? Are you restoring it as Charlie's? Including paint?

liteweight

Paul Ceasrine 11-26-2014 03:00 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
* Mickey Thompson Wheels
* Super Scavenger Headers {by Mickey Thompson}
* Crower Cams

http://classracer.com/classforum/att...6&d=1364178148

Kyle Kohr 11-26-2014 03:16 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 453962)
great to see your still on that project Kyle. You've got a very special car there. glad to see someone is returning one of these back to it's formal glory. Were you ever able to get in touch with Charlie Allen? Are you restoring it as Charlie's? Including paint?

liteweight


We were never able to get in touch with Charlie Allen. We are restoring it as he raced it including the paint. We want to be able to race the car so we will be making updates, keeping it more of a stock eliminator car now-a-days instead of super stock. I would love to be able to get in touch with him though.

Paul Ceasrine 11-26-2014 03:28 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Kyle

Super Scavenger Headers ~ {by Mickey Thompson}

http://i586.photobucket.com/albums/s...ps346cac0c.jpg

Liteweight 11-26-2014 03:57 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Kyle
Is your car coded as a H engine or special ordered M code?
What does it have for torque boxes under it? Front & rear or just rear.?
I noticed in one of your pics that the PS inner shock tower has been modified. pretty good tell tell sign there was a Hemi in it at one time.
What engine mounts are on the K member? wedge, Hemi or are they cut off for a engine plate?

liteweight

Kyle Kohr 11-26-2014 06:02 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 453970)
Kyle
Is your car coded as a H engine or special ordered M code?
What does it have for torque boxes under it? Front & rear or just rear.?
I noticed in one of your pics that the PS inner shock tower has been modified. pretty good tell tell sign there was a Hemi in it at one time.
What engine mounts are on the K member? wedge, Hemi or are they cut off for a engine plate?

liteweight

The dart was converted to a pro stock car in 70 or 71 and they changed the dash on it so the original vin tag is missing. It does have front and rear torque boxes. The K member is the original big block k member but has been heavily modified for oil pan clearance. When the hemi was in the car it was in with an engine plate.

Kyle Kohr 11-26-2014 06:57 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
I forgot to mention that we could see where console brackets were cut off the floor at one time

DMann0825 11-26-2014 10:21 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
awesome project doing that dart kyle--charlie used to run firebird in chandler but i believe lost the lease and i can find out more info about talking to him if you would like. i used to have a set of m/t super scavenger headers on a 440 i put in a 63 polara convertible as my first registered car.drove it in high school and sold it a classmate(hoodlum) and he drove it to colorado! . im sure its gone back to the earth by now ,but the coolest headers! I also have a friend in ma that has a 68 340 gts 4-spd with 6200 miles on it--it is day one if you look at it.unbelivable car!

Paul Ceasrine 11-27-2014 06:57 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Kyle


Saddleback Dodge
1401 N. Tustin Avenue
Santa Ana, California

Owner; Gene O'Hara

They were the 'West Coast' version of Grand Spaulding Dodge {Mr. Norm's}

They were also involved in a few 'dealer only' 440 Conversions for
the 1968 Dart GTS 383.

They were also big into the 1969 M-Code 440 Darts.

1968/1969 California > Los Angeles and Orange County Dealer List

http://img2.newspapers.com/img/thumb....jpg?cs=604800

Paul Ceasrine 11-27-2014 10:15 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Kyle


Mickey Thompson Wheels

In 1968, they were available in both Chrome, and then
they came out with 'The Duke' {see below}.

Mickey Thompson wheels had 'peaked' spokes.


http://www.kustomwheel.com/images/310_MT_Duke.JPG

Liteweight 11-27-2014 02:58 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle Kohr (Post 453984)
The dart was converted to a pro stock car in 70 or 71 and they changed the dash on it so the original vin tag is missing. It does have front and rear torque boxes. The K member is the original big block k member but has been heavily modified for oil pan clearance. When the hemi was in the car it was in with an engine plate.

Thankyou

Funny, my Hemi Dart has only the rear torque boxes.

Me's thinkin' you should post pictures of the progress of your car yes?

liteweight

Paul Ceasrine 11-27-2014 03:25 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Mickey Thompson


MK II Eliminator Mag Wheel {Aluminum/Steel}


Back in 1968 was available in Satin Black or Natural Shot-Peened.


In late-1968, the Chrome-finish was available.


http://classracer.com/classforum/dat...8/7NFFMD//2Q==

Liteweight 11-27-2014 03:40 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine (Post 454071)
Mickey Thompson


MK II Eliminator Mag Wheel {Aluminum/Steel}


Back in 1968 was available in Satin Black or Natural Shot-Peened.


In late-1968, the Chrome-finish was available.


http://classracer.com/classforum/dat...8/7NFFMD//2Q==

no picee, no showee

GTX JOHN 11-27-2014 07:45 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
I bought several cars from Rex Sagle HP manager at Saddleback Dodge
including a 1969 Charger 500 right out of the showroom floor ($5029.00)
He also taught high performance Driving at the CHP.

I remember seeing 20 440 dart GTSs in their the back yard.
Many Noted Stock and Superstock Racer worked there at the time!

Rex gave me a ride through the mountains behind to store in his 70
Dodge Challenger R/T SE demo that I vividly remember to this day

Paul Ceasrine 11-28-2014 05:56 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
1968 NHRA Super Stock

1962 and earlier model cars were 'out'
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

1968 SS/EA Class = {8.70 to 9.49 Wt/Hp}

Dodge Cars for SS/EA Class in 1968_____________________


* 1968 Dart GTS 383 ~ {with 440/375 HP Conversion}
#3305 lbs. ~ 375 HP = 8.81 Wt/Hp

Production Numbers
6 ..... Factory converted
48 ... Dart GSS 440 Grand-Spaulding Dodge {Mr. Norm's}
70 ... Dealer converted {approximate}

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* 1964 Dodge 'Model 330' 2-Door Sedan ~ 426/365 HP
#3446 lbs. ~ 365 HP = 9.44 Wt/Hp

Production Numbers
106 ... Dealer sold
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* 1963 Dodge 'Model 330' Station Wagon ~ 426/415 HP 'Ramcharger 426'
#3640 lbs. ~ 415 HP = 8.77 Wt/Hp

Production Numbers
3 .... Factory built
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* 1964 Dodge 'Model 440' Station Wagon ~ 426/425 HP 'Max-Wedge'
#3739 lbs. ~ 425 HP = 8.79 Wt/Hp

Production Numbers
7 ... Factory built

Liteweight 11-28-2014 01:32 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Is Saddleback Dodge still around today?

liteweight

Paul Ceasrine 11-28-2014 02:18 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 454134)
Is Saddleback Dodge still around today?

liteweight


1401 N. Tustin Avenue
Santa Ana, California


http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/...1&d=1334165625


Now, a Corporate Park 'Office Building'


http://s.lnimg.com/photo/poster_768/...9ad7b34494.jpg

viperakron 11-28-2014 03:45 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
1 Attachment(s)
Thanks for all the history preceding the factory M Code A Bodies in 1969. I don't remember what the 68 cars came with for a "delivered" exhaust manifold, but on 69s the drivers side was a unique casting 3462017. It was about an inch longer to accommodate the taller deck of the 440. I have one of the 299 Cuda fastback M Code cars and like to find one of those original manifolds!

Paul Ceasrine 11-28-2014 04:22 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Viper Akron

The 1968 Dart GTS 383 {w/440 conversion}

They were equipped with a 'standard' GTS full dual-exhaust system with
chrome-tip extensions.

In 1968, the NHRA required the Super/Stock cars to carry the
full exhaust system, or factory equivalent.

Most of the Racers of this car, went with a set of 'Hooker Headers'
fenderwell units with 'Y' angle connectors off the collector-tube for the exhaust pipes.

See below

http://images32.fotki.com/v1045/phot...trailer-vi.jpg

Liteweight 11-28-2014 05:08 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
So the 68 440 Darts were engine coded with a "M" ?

liteweight

viperakron 11-28-2014 06:24 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 454149)
So the 68 440 Darts were engine coded with a "M" ?

liteweight

Don't think they had the factory "special" code of M in 68. Probably H for 383/
In 69 the factory produced 440 cars on the production line with a M in the vin. Similar to the 68 Hemi cars and 69 440+6 cars. Factory made 640 Darts, 299 Cuda fastback, and 60 Notch back cars. "Approx" #

ww63 11-28-2014 06:47 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 454149)
So the 68 440 Darts were engine coded with a "M" ?

liteweight

1968 440 Dart, all automatic. 5th digit in vin was a M. No M code 1968 Cuda.

viperakron 11-28-2014 08:16 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ww63 (Post 454158)
1968 440 Dart, all automatic. 5th digit in vin was a M. No M code 1968 Cuda.

B029M8B390659 68 Hemi SS, also darts LO23M

Frank Castros 11-28-2014 08:17 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
http://images32.fotki.com/v1045/phot...trailer-vi.jpg[/QUOTE]

It would be great if Bob Lambeck chimed in on these discussions.

What size rear tire did this Landy Dart run?

Liteweight 11-28-2014 09:21 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ww63 (Post 454158)
1968 440 Dart, all automatic. 5th digit in vin was a M. No M code 1968 Cuda.

That's what I figured. Thanx for that WW63.

Liteweight

Paul Ceasrine 11-29-2014 04:45 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Frank,

Dick was running Good-Year 8.90 x 15" Slicks.

The rear Cragars were 15" x 6" with a 4" Bolt pattern

The fronts were 14" Cragars, as they were required because
of the Fenderwell Headers.

Kyle Kohr 11-29-2014 01:04 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
6 Attachment(s)
I wonder if I could still find a set of the M/T wheels today?

That picture of Saddleback dodge is really cool Paul!

Here are some pictures of my progress. It still has a long ways to go but we are getting there. Currently we are working on putting the quarters back to factory and factory wheel wells back in since the car was tubbed.

mopar68 11-29-2014 04:18 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
http://109.imagebam.com/download/0tY...on_mancini.jpg

hemiman4262003 11-30-2014 04:58 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
seen on moparts someone purchace this 69 factory 440 dart,if anyone knows who raced it in the past

Paul Ceasrine 11-30-2014 06:43 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
At the start of 1968

National Records

0.00 to 5.99 Wt/HP
SS/A ............ N/A
SS/AA ......... N/A

6.00 to 6.99 Wt/HP
SS/B ...... 11.05
SS/BA .... 11.15

7.00 to 7.69 Wt/HP
SS/C ......11.16 ~ 126.01
SS/CA ....11.55 ~ 123.11

7.70 to 8.69 Wt/HP
SS/D ..... 11.55 ~ 124.07
SS/DA ... 11.60 ~ 120.96

8.70 to 9.49 Wt/HP
SS/E ..... 11.88
SS/EA ....12.13 ~ 118.11

9.50 and up Wt/HP
SS/F ..... 11.95
SS/FA ... 12.33


Unfortunately, the 1968 Dart GTS 383 {w/440 conversion} could
not compete in Stock Class.

B/SA ..............12.43 ....... {8.50 to 8.99 Wt/HP}

Paul Ceasrine 12-01-2014 06:04 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
1968 NHRA Winternationals


The 1968 Dart GTS took the SS/EA Class.


Both Dick Landy and Butch Leal shared driving duties.


The Dart took down several 'factory-prepped' 1968 Ford
Mustang 428 Cobra Jets and Camaro SS396 cars.


http://www.draglist.com/artman2/uploads/1/ssbook.jpg

Charlie A 12-01-2014 04:25 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hemiman4262003 (Post 454218)
seen on moparts someone purchace this 69 factory 440 dart,if anyone knows who raced it in the past

http://classracer.com/classforum/att...2&d=1417337851

Liteweight 12-01-2014 05:22 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Ceasrine (Post 454177)
Frank,

Dick was running Good-Year 8.90 x 15" Slicks.

The rear Cragars were 15" x 6" with a 4" Bolt pattern

The fronts were 14" Cragars, as they were required because
of the Fenderwell Headers.

Were 15" Cragars available accross the counter with a 4" BC or were these specially made?

liteweight

Paul Ceasrine 12-02-2014 07:00 AM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Liteweight (Post 454301)
Were 15" Cragars available accross the counter with a 4" BC or were these specially made?

liteweight


The 15" Cragar S/S Wheels with the 4" Bolt-Pattern for the A-Body
Mopars were not part of the Cragar Catalog.


Special Order only back then.

Paul Ceasrine 12-05-2014 01:50 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
National Records

September 1, 1968

SS/B ........... 10.83 ~ 1968 Barracuda BO29 - 426 Race Hemi
SS/C ........... 11.16 ~ 1968 Camaro SS-396 - 396/375 HP
SS/D ........... 11.31 ~ 1967 GTX - 426 Street Hemi
SS/E............ 11.64 ~ 1968 Mustang 'Cobra Jet' - 428/335 HP
SS/F ........... 11.93 ~ 1968 Camaro Z-28 - 302/290 HP

SS/BA ........ 10.94 ~ 1968 Dart LO23 - 426 Race Hemi
SS/CA......... 11.25 ~ 1964 Dodge #440 'Steel Nose' - 426 Race Hemi
SS/DA ........ 11.51 ~ 1963 Belvedere 'Aluminum Nose' - 426/415 HP
SS/EA......... 11.92 ~ 1968 Camaro SS-396 - 396/350 HP
SS/FA ........ 12.17 ~ 1968 Ford Fairlane 'Cobra Jet' - 428/335 HP

ww63 12-20-2014 07:16 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by viperakron (Post 454160)
B029M8B390659 68 Hemi SS, also darts LO23M

Factory unrestored with original engine and trans 1968 440 Dart GSS vin# LS23M8B225261

Liteweight 12-20-2014 09:46 PM

Re: 1968 Dodge Darts (Factory SS/EA 440's)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ww63 (Post 455814)
Factory unrestored with original engine and trans 1968 440 Dart GSS vin# LS23M8B225261

Is this the one we spoke on the phone about ???

What up with the GTS 440 Darts tho??

liteweight


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