Re: HP on Monday?
 

Zero tech on cylinder heads, intakes and piston notches but not all combos benefit from allowable upgrades since many had nothing or little to gain.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Runs of 1.300 or more under the index will be reviewed and adjusted following the event.

This is done to better react to any out-of-line indexes or under-horse-powered combinations. Runs at all NHRA National, Sports National, and LODRS events, including those at altitude-factored racetracks, are included in the 1.300-second-or-more-under analysis. No runs made during exempt events, National Opens, test and tune, time trials, 1/8th mile events or races within a race (i.e. Jegs Allstar eliminations, Stock / Super Stock Combos or other races that are not part of a season long points championship) are included in any review. Adjustments are rounded up to the nearest full horsepower even if the fraction is below 0.5 horsepower. As an example, 2.15 horsepower is rounded to 3 horsepower.



Parameters used for reviews of 1.3xx runs are the same as stated above.

The decision to adjust horsepower or to reduce the index will be at the discretion of the NHRA Tech Department.

Could This Happen?

Racer X is sick of getting outrun in Class. His car always looses to the
396/375 Camaro in B/SA, so a plan is devised by someone with plenty of money.

1. Buy a good B/SA 69 Camaro that is a good stock class car.
2. Build a big Big Block, 502?, with all the correct parts showing, heads, carb, manifold.
3. Put car together and secretly go test to get performance high enough to ruin combination for a lifetime.
4. Get some local racer to enter the car at a local points race where AHFS will be in play.
5. Have car pass inspection before first run, weight, fuel, safety belts, and helmet
6. First run blast the index load up and go home
7. Monday AHFS gives 396/375 6.25% additional Horse Power

My question is could NHRA keep this from Happing? With how the rules are written now I do not think so. Our category needs some protection from NHRA Tech Department. Maybe a check list to follow when runs of 1.3 seconds or quicker are made during events when the AHFS is in place.

The answer will take some thinking and some work

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Confusing !!

National Record for H/SA is posted as 10.62

H/SA 10.62
10/21/22
Glenn Briglio - Massapequa Park, NY
'89 Chev
Reading, PA

Did it get hit with a HP Increase too?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

I believe that would have been at the Dutch Classic in which case it was a National Open. National Opens do not have any AHFS, so that run would not have gotten HP.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

That's a good question and or idea Larry . Anytime an combo that gets HP really needs to be checked first period .

Re: HP on Monday?
 

I thought about this exact scenario yesterday while reading this thread. One would have to be smart about this and run the car for a while at a safe e.t. before blasting it. I think just showing up and doing it would (hopefully) trigger some warnings in the tech department's heads.

Shy of everyone tearing down prior to an event like it's 1975 again, the only thing I can think of is a random chip draw after the final Q session. Have a racer's meeting, Every racer would sign in and put their name in a bucket. Pick 3-5(?) at random. Those drivers have 10 minutes to report to a teardown location. The downfall of this would be the extent of a teardown that was performed, to where first round may need to be pushed off to the following day. In place of this, NHRA could run an extra round or two of the other sportsman classes that day.

I would hope the threat of being an unlucky random teardown participant would be enough of a deterrent to being caught with a 4.5" crank in their block.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

How about this idea instead of penalizing the fast cars look at the slow combinationsand take HP off them then everone is happy

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Suppose the slow car is in the Class and has the same engine, and platform as the fast car. Personal Indexes?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Going to Orlando ego air from Ohio can get you in trouble real quick, most 350/255 camaros run low 11 ets will pick up to high 10s just by going to Orlando . add in a few up grades over the winter you can pick up alot more than you think.Even though it helps me in heads up runs I hate to see anybody get a 15hp hit. Just saying. Rick

Re: HP on Monday?
 

I would hope/wish/expect that NHRA would tear down those entries with fast runs.

The CJ 350 Auto combination received a HP increase when an engine builder claimed the 2014 combination (As Cast Heads) verses the 2013 Combination that allowed the Boss CNC Ported Heads. As in, he was running ported heads claiming it as a 2014 combination.

NHRA has never corrected that issue.

I am sure there a few cars out there that aren't 100% legal. Smart people would stay mid to bottom on the sheet and then race smart.

If we are going to have rules they be followed and NHRA needs to do random teardowns. Not just the fast cars, maybe the winner and runner up and anyone that races a pickup truck.


Robin

Re: HP on Monday?
 

[QUOTE=Robin Lawrence;709974]I would hope/wish/expect that NHRA would tear down those entries with fast runs.

I am sure there a few cars out there that aren't 100% legal. Smart people would stay mid to bottom on the sheet and then race smart.

If we are going to have rules they be followed and NHRA needs to do random teardowns. Not just the fast cars, maybe the winner and runner up and anyone that races a pickup truck.

This would be a great idea. They already always tear down a truck for the record! May be beating a dead horse with that.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

All those bogus 302 Cobra Jet combinations NEED a big HP hit!!

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Wheres the smily button. 😂

Re: HP on Monday?
 

The truck has been down so many times we use Dzus fasteners and Velcro just to save time. 😯

Re: HP on Monday?
 

So a guy goes 1.15 under on 1st run , comes back for 2nd run and goes 1.30 under , my feeling is it took some work to pick up the 15 hun, air didn?t improve that much. He cut it too close and fed up! Gotta pay if u gonna play!

Re: HP on Monday?
 

This is a heavy hit no doubt but perhaps the old way of -1.20 instant hit would have saved the combo some. His first run was dangerously close to that already so I doubt he would have tried to improve much to get number 1 spot. Also I think a few cars last year hit the -1.20 or better without penalty.
There were at least a dozen trigger runs on the combo but no HP last year so it was bound to happen sooner than later but 15hp is a heavy hit

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Here?s a question I was there and saw Kevin tun that #. Great job knew he failed fuel check saw him on ladder. My question is why was he not put on ladder if he had I would have run a 10:75 car instead of a 8:40 car I?m not saying I would have won however it is A LOT easier to judge a 10:75 car instead of that Missile FS/AAA I don?t think anyone in the country realized HP on Monday if I knew I would have went to race Control and voice my opinion on the qualifying ladder. I did Email Lonnie about this and other concerns about that race. Great race not easy to protect your combo there

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Hahahaha, you're still mad. Sorry that the COPO couldn't close the deal.

I've always said the stick Cobra-Jet is a VERY soft combination.

Robin

Re: HP on Monday?
 

[QUOTE=Paul Wong;709975]
I was messing with the Truck guys, glad to see you are paying attention.

Robin

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Nothing like a truck

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Unless you are waved off at scales or fuel check...you always stop.
Ask me how I know!

Re: HP on Monday?
 

So now he shows up at the next race runs a test day then hears someone may want to take a look at his car, so he leaves the event? Anyone think there?s something wrong here? Looks wrong to me.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Does anyone know the outcome of NHRA tear down after the auto hit? Obviously must have been straight as string?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

No way in Hell any car, any combo, should get ANY HP without a teardown period!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Under AHFS, reviews are at the end of the year after completion of all events. Who and when would be torn down?
LOT'S of holes in AHFS.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

After a combination hit the trigger twice. Stock or Super Stock

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Round 3 of Class

Jerry Bennett 3391 D/SA
-1.264

Terry Hembree 2962 E/SA
-1.23

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Just a question from someone who thinks he should know the answer,
I thought the the 396/325 HP & the 350/255 HP combo's got hit hard
last year(396) & last week (350). Did I see a few of them go in excess
of 1.20 under in Gainesville, or did those people change to different
combo's that I'm not familiar with? Thanks.

J.R.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Must of the 68 - 69 Camaro's switched to the 396/350 hp engine which is factor at 330 only difference is the cam.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

I still don't understand how a combination can receive HP when the run never counted on the sheet. If the run counted he should've been the number 1 qualifier no?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Thanks Ron. I knew that some of those had gone to the 396/350/330, you
get a ton more cam. I guess it's the 350/255 that has me going hhmmm............

J.R.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

I don?t think that was the case, I know Kevin and Kevin is a straight shooter and I would guarantee he is legal. I believe the 1.30 under pass was a mistake on his part and I think NHRA screwed up giving the HP I see the circumstances stated here, if any of you guys knew Kevin you would know he is just as upset as you are by the mistake. I think more than anything the system, ?AHFS? is screwed up and needs some fine tuning by the higher ups. Just my .02

Tim Stickles

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Question how much of a issue is it to have the software written that when there is a 1.30 under run it triggers the tower and then they can communicate with the scales? Maybe it will only result in finding out the guy/girl is in the wrong class but maybe this could have been avoided.
Second how much longer are you guys/girls going to run with this broken system. If this is supposed to be a performance based class then why is the most frequent ask question " what do i have to do to slow it down"?? Starting to sound more like a throttle stop class than a performance based class. What is the system there to protect?? Lets take the AH class you really think that them guys are going to see how much oil they can run and timing they can pull just to make the 3 at the bottom of the sheet feel better??? The time it takes to look at every run down the track what class it was in and a average of all them that time couldn't be better spent elsewhere. How do you race a performance based class with a noose around your neck and call it fun?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

All of those in favor of not reducing the indexes by .3 are the ones you thank for that!

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Most SS and Stock racers are not concerned about the indexes or AHFS. At least not in Div. 3 where only 10% of the registered racers voted for, or against a change.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

What was the mechanism to vote?

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Reducing the indexes would be fine with me if they took 40hp off of the Max wedges like they did the 409s and 421s. These cars are pushing a lot more air than the Camaros, Novas and newer cars and the faster the A and B cars get the more of a disadvantage it is on bigger cars.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Maybe the easy fix is let?s go back to the original HP ratings on all combos. Then lower index 3 tenths and do away with the AFHS. Everyone will be happy and nobody will have a reason to cry. The automatic system was to create parity. It seems most don?t want that. So let?s do away with all previous corrections.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

That would make a lot of 72 and up Mopar 340-360- and 400 racers very happy as well as countless 72 and up GMs and Fords, it would be a mess far beyond words and a lot of the 60s cars would be dead. In a class that's mostly old guys including myself at 70 I don't see us starting all over again with a new car.
Just adding, that might be fun if we all had to run stock blocks, rockers and whatever transmission came with the car originally.

Re: HP on Monday?
 

Still waiting for the results of the NHRA teardown and verification of the run?