Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

The problem here is all of the modern cars have at least that much that can be legally removed.

When I match raced Robin Lawrence, I had over 400 lbs of ballast in my COPO. If I were running the production LT1 the only major difference is the hood. Where do I put another 500 lbs?

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

It's called shipping weight not weight with legally removed items. Older cars face similar issues. Ask anyone racing a Corvette in Stock or SS.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Good morning to all,
Just on the "silly side" I've always found the Cheese Burger, Pizza and Beer diet to help add a couple of Pounds right in the drivers seat. Legal ballast and a good artery clogger as well. Probably easier to find an over weight driver then a skinny one! Enjoy the Pizza and Beer and lets go racing!

Respectfully,
Henry Kunz 1534 H/SA

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Also we are referring to production cars being put in the guide, not Copo, drag Paks, & CJ's

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Yep. And like I said, there is very little difference between my COPO and a production Camaro in legal Stock Eliminstor trim. Just the weight of the hood and intake manifold.

The new cars are nothing like the old cars. The seats, wheels, wiring, modules, rear cradle, transmissions, emissions, safety, equipment, etc. have made them stupid heavy in production form.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Factory Hood instead of carbon fiber+30lbs

With production car you have to run the battery in the front where they were put by factory. So front battery and add one in the back. +50lbs

Use factory seats instead of light weight race seats +120lbs

With production car in stock you can even use back seat +75lbs

Instead of light weight 3 or 5 gallon fuel cell use max allowed 16gal fuel cell or even better heavier stock fuel tank. +75lbs

No rule that a car has to be built with chrome moly instead of mild steel. Mild steel cage with few extra bars +90lbs

Add factory spare tire and jack. +45lbs

NHRA allowed 500lbs of permanent mounted ballast.

Walla 4000lbs LT1 2023 SS Camaro.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

And yet they are suppose/expected to run under the same rules.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Well, you just described a car that no one would build!

On another note, I have been told to make it clear that it is FX not A/FX.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

And there are hundreds if not thousands of cars in guide that "no one would build".

Should we manipulate the rules so the other unfavorable cars in the guide will be built?

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

The FX cars must be the same dimensions as the stock production cars. Same engine rules apply for FX as FSS, larger rear tire and 5 spd. The FSS cars could go below 7.50 with out the constant rule adjustments and NHRA does not want any passes in the 7.5s with these cars. The FSS are 1000 lbs heavier with half the rear tire and make more power than the prostocks do. The FX cars should be much safer to run than the FSS and take away some of the limitations of the small tire and chassis of the FSS.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Well Billy since we are being clear I also have a problem with NO TECH - but here is the thing - the problem is with you and the 'dime rocket ' type old cars - if you were to put in a thin head gasket lets say - it would pick up some ET for sure so we need some Tech .Sure I'm no engine builder but there really isn't much that can be improved with the modern engines easily as they are well developed from the start - it's progress ! ! !

I'm sure everyone knows that I love muscle cars but we can't have an eliminator full of 50 plus year old cars - even the fans in the stands like and are excited about seeing a good old fashioned 'old vs new' drag race ............ All that plus those of us who know you are sure it makes your day when you win a round against a modern era racer .

Yes, I know this is a bit off the F/X subject but since you brought it up .........Anyway I like the F/X cars but feel we won't see very many of them .

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

For crying out loud Jack, over the past 2 years I've raced a 2005 car and a 1999! That's a whole bunch newer than most of the stuff out there. And you of all people should know that I'm not going to spring for head gaskets if I don't NEED them. Where are you going with this? Would you like to see NHRA pull the "20 year" rule out of it's ***** again? Let's just agree to like all of the stuff that's out there now.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Billy do you realize that your 2005 car is only 7 years older than both of my COPO's????

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

that would open up a lot of affordable combo for stock . For example no place for a street hemi challenger to race in stock .

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

There's actually a hand full a street Hemi Challengers in the natural classes right now.




Bret Velde
??/SA

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

When the class was being developed, it required OEM roofs, quarters, and trunks. As many recall, this was the way old-school, early Pro Stock cars were built.

My buddy was one of the first shops that started to build a COPO Camaro under this premise, with oversight from NHRA. Then, he started to hear that the big chassis shops got orders from racers and started to complain to NHRA that it was too difficult for them to build the car with the OEM body components. NHRA gave in and Five-Star and other companies that build carbon fiber bodies got involved too to make the body parts.

If my buddy had built the car with the new rules, which by the way, have not been released, he would have saved himself over 250 hours of labor and lots of money in parts. The new cars are just a tube chassis with carbon fiber parts attached similar to a Pro Stock.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

I want to make it very clear from the start that I do not know if this is still the case.

But when the move came to the new Pro Stock bodies, be aware that the most well known chassis builders had exclusive rights to the bodies. Each developed a certain make and they profit from every body used on every car that is built, whether it's built in their shop or not.

Before anybody starts, I'm not against capitalism or people making money, I'm just pointing this out to clarify why the 1 piece front ends and the body rule change was so heavily pushed by them. It created a monopoly and a new profit center.

Again, I don't know from direct information, but I'm pretty sure that's why the rules for the new class got changed. When I was racing, different manufacturers would hand out body kits - which was the roof, quarters, and trunk. Everybody who they approved got the same part numbers in the crate.

But again, some builders were much better at tweaking those parts than others. So some kept crying it wasn't fair instead of doing R&D on aero and finding ways to fit the templates and still improve the bodies. That is where the Standard Bodies arose from. Can't beat em, push for a participation trophy sort of thing.

I know this is a class racer board and is supposed to cover Stock and Super Stock. My deepest knowledge is in Pro Stock but to be honest I could not pick my favorite among all three. If this is getting tiresome, somebody say so and I'll shut up.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

I just reread the 2023 rule supplement and it says it must be OEM roof and quarters, no where do I see it saying carbon fiber. Am I missing something?
I never saw so many people uptight about a new class coming out. Most people I have talked to are excited about this class, and are hoping it will be the new Pro Stock down the road. Some of you want to kill it thinking they will increase are quotas instead. lol

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Steel roof and quarters. Carbon fiber front ends and doors etc. It would have been cool to keep all OEM body panels, but it is what it is . At least they still look like factory cars.

These cars are badass !

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

The rules that were released to the public were changed and NHRA has not published the changes because they are still under review. As an example, the trunk is now carbon fiber with a built-in wing. Also, the latest rumor is some have requested to do away with the spec drag slicks and run your choice of drag slicks.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

I thought this class was above cool... The factory car bodies would be just like the old days of pro stock and would sell cars.This 1st Camaro ruined it for me as a spectator. The car doesn't look like a factory car, especially behind the doors. Rick Flare would be proud of this rear end of the Camaro.

Geoff Turks car looks like a real factory body and the build of Chis Holbrook has the looks of factory as well.

https://youtu.be/0AQO2wZ9V7k

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

That is so awesome!
Keep the 10.5 tire

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

I suppose most of you have seen it already, but I watched the Jeff Turks run and crash in his A/FX Challenger. What a super cool car, but scary crash, glad he is okay.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGf-SH3VofY

https://moparinsiders.com/nhra-facto...uring-testing/

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

My brother works for a well known chassis builder. I'm aware of how these are being built.



Cool video Joe did!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp6jIdn-9Zo

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

I had heard about the crash, but hadn't gone to look for the video.

Two things came to mind: On these types of cars, I don't think I've ever seen the deck lid dip down before it meets the wing. And I was surprised the car was in first gear for so long.

I realize these are still being developed, so whether the deck contour comes from the rules or is an experiment could make a difference. Same for ratio in first gear.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

As a side note, Geoff posted a few days ago on FB that he was not feeling well. His wife talked him into going to the hospital and they found a couple bleeders in his brain from the crash. They got him fixed up and he is back at it.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

NHRA is in the entertainment business. Their first priority is to draw spectators. And for those that think the priority should be to supply racers a place to race.... How profitable do you think a divisional is with no spectators? How long do most businesses last not being profitable??

Sadly take away heads up runs and Stock and Super Stock is just expensive bracket racing. And maybe some of you are better than me but watching bracket racing is not very exciting for the most part. After a couple of pairs unless I'm watching a specific car or friend and..... Super Classes, Bracket Racing with an index. Damn competition eliminator is same, just CIC instead of breaking out......


Heads up drag racing is not cheap to participate, but it is the easiest to watch, especially for a drag racing newbie. It appears NHRA is lowering sportsman quotas and minimal rounds on Sunday for easier viewing and a better show while still keeping us involved. I give them credit right now as car counts are up with the pros and alcohol classes, Factory Stock is getting the car manufacturers involved which is a great thing, and if there are guys willing to build a factory stock car on steroids... Thank you!! The only ones that should be bitching here are the guys spending the $ to build the cars. The rest of us should be thankful for their efforts!


Everyone should pray NHRA is around in 10 years and do everything possible to make it happen. We need them much more than they need us and give a big props to them for trying to draw the spectator and put on a great show. We are not in the 70's anymore and NHRA TV is the greatest thing since sliced bread, well unless you're trying to work on your race car in the shop LOL! Thank you NHRA, Racers building cars for this class and fingers crossed manufacturers stay involved and support this class!!

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

So the plot thickens.

From IHRA - "In addition, there will be a heads-up Real Steel, No-Time class that requires OEM steel shell, steel doors and steel fenders (with the exception of those originally fiberglass, which must be factory-original parts). No Billet heads or engine blocks are allowed."

I don't follow outlaw racing so I'm not sure what existing cars (if any) could fit the class. I'm posting this due to the conversation about getting new specators and new racers into the sport.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Just saw where Ex Pro Stock racer Allen Johnson is going to drive Jeff Turks car.

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

There's an article on Competition Plus. Geoff is no longer driving.

Turk Faces Near Death Experience Which Puts Allen Johnson Behind The Wheel Again

Re: new A/FX CLASS
 

Strong stuff. Very good article. Anyone who wants to complain about the US healthcare system is free to move to another country.
Thanks for the link, Mike.