Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

This quote just shows how much some dont know what they are talking about. They are not allowed narrowed rears, they are not allowed to move the frame rails and if you want to call a 10,5 (non W ) tire fat then go for it. They are allowed minor movement of the rear leaf springs to clear the side wall. The 10.5 tire was allowed mainly for the higher HP cars in AA and A, etc at the time this came about some of the southern IHRA tracks that these races were held on were not of the highest caliber in the traction dept. Besides have you ever seen how much modification of the wheel house and external fender is required to put a 9 inch slick on something like a 66-67 Chev Nova for NHRA. Oh yeah...its just a "STOCK" bolt on deal.....lol.

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

9" tires are fine, IMO.

Past tense. Even by the time I joined IHRA 9 years ago, I think they were already putting that old legend behind them. The 'popular image' of the condition of IHRA tracks from way back when is an outdated misconception today. I'll take my 9" M/T radial down any IHRA track without hesitation.

Back to naming the organization, remember that it doesn't *have* to be an acronym. "ProStar" for instance, is a motorcyle racing organization. You define what *you* want, and do the branding & marketing to give it life & meaning.

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

Name game :
IDR
simple, plan, easy
Independent Drag Racers

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

[QUOTE=Michael Beard;





Back to naming the organization, remember that it doesn't *have* to be an acronym. "ProStar" for instance, is a motorcyle racing organization. You define what *you* want, and do the branding & marketing to give it life & meaning.[/QUOTE]

Still waiting for some suggetions.......Not many have come up with much.

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

[QUOTE=Michael Beard;108641]9" tires are fine, IMO.



Past tense. Even by the time I joined IHRA 9 years ago, I think they were already putting that old legend behind them. The 'popular image' of the condition of IHRA tracks from way back when is an outdated misconception today. I'll take my 9" M/T radial down any IHRA track without hesitation.

OK Michael....I re-worded my post slightly. Remember I havent been to many IHRA races in the last 8 -9 years or so.

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

I think we make the trophies with a gold wild Ukranian smoking a cigarette pissing on a 14/32

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LMAO!

Too funny!!!!!

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Name: CRA is very good.
Project: needs to have a 1 year, 3 year plan. Should it be IHRA and NHRA class cars just running at a new location? Should it take on the problems discussed with the current classes, rules, etc?Will it look to do what is BEST for class racers? to get sponsors, spectators, fun back into Class racing?
More Consolidation of classes?
Consider publishing outline of future with goals and plans.

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"Sportsman Drag Racers Alliance" comes to mind.

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You may want a name that the general public can relate to or understand and that TV would want. They may not understand "CLASS RACERS ASSOCIATION" just my opinion. So here are a couple of ideas.

"Eliminator Drag Racing"

"Hot Rod Drag Racing"

"Quarter Flash Drag Racing"

These may not be any good but just an idea.:)

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

I apologize if the frame narrowing is incorrect. I was going from Robert Swartz post. IHRA is not out west so I am not familiar with your rules, sorry. If you believe there are no narrowed rearends in NHRA stocker you may also be mistaken a little bit.

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Yes I know that some of the NHRA cars and IHRA cars also have slightly narrowed rear housings. Who really cares as long as it looks correct. I was just saying that the amount they moved the leaf spring for side wall clearence was usually less than 3/4 of an inch on each side. This is in comparison with all of the body work required to fit a 9 inch stocker tire on some body styles. In time I hope IHRA changes the wording in thier rule book. A 9 inch radial is quicker than the 10.5's anyway.

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IDRA Independent Drag Racer Alliance

Bunch the abc, def, ghi etc. together for the Saturday afternoon class run-offs, no handy capped starts, more heads-up racing. Heads-up format is marketable. Run the class winners off together for the big event braggin rights Saturday night. Bunch everyone together Sunday afternoon for a Stock/Superstock combo bracket race.
My 2 cents, Mike Szcz

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Harry,

I too, could have phrased differently the wording. I guess it was a bit misleading. If your not familiar with IHRA rules, there are some differences. I don't see the rule differences being so substantial that we all can't come to some compromises and have a race. As Terry stated, IHRA rules allow minor inboard movement of the springs. And I took that from the rulebook. Here again, the car I'm building, a 1979 Firebird, I have no intention of running anything larger than the 9" tires.

No, you are NOT allowed a narrowed rear end. Now, something I've heard but can't substantiate, is some guys have mini-tubbed stockers in IHRA? Maybe someone currently racing can clear that up for me? Here again, I wouldn't do it because I one day may want to build either a 301 Pontiac or a 403 Oldsmobile engine to run NHRA events. I want my car to retain it's versatility.

On another note, even though I don't presently have a car ready to race. IF I had a say on the name. I like the CRA = Class Racers Association. That's my two jingling penny's.

Robert Swartz

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Mini tub's are for front drive conversion crate motor stockers.

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Correct.... ...and which there are only 4 of in the country. Not sure about Wright's Probe and Mace's new Sunfire, but I believe the Ross's Avenger and Sebring fit their 9" tires within the stock wheelwell.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Lundholm
Mini tub's are for front drive conversion crate motor stockers



Michael & Bobby,

Thank you both for clearing up that misconception.

Robert Swartz

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[QUOTE=X-TECH MAN;108474]Hey Jack and/or Terry,

How would you handle "THE FEW, THE PROUD, THE FRONT WHEEL DRIVE STOCKER RACERS"? I must ask, because while NHRA only has five classes for us, IHRA has 16...which NHRA hasn't had for at least 4yrs??? If you wanted to keep class sizes down, I'd have no problem running in the F/I class, because the IHRA's "L/FIA class could be do-able too??? Just a thought....

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Gary, I would think we'd have our choice. DF/S, or EF/SA (or D or F, depending on weight), since they are both 19 pound classes and both have 15.90 Indexes.

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National class racers association "ncra"

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Terry Bell

I think to have our own Assocation would be great. I like UCRA - United Class Racers Assocation.

I also like Jeff Lee's comment on combine classes, Stick with Auto's & combining A,B&C - D,E&F, ect.
I came up with a different plan. See if anyone out there likes this idea.

I only did this for Stock Elim. I broke down all of the NHRA classes into 16 classes by combining them
of course. OK
1. AA stick & auto same index
2. A & B 3 tenths difference in indexs, so add wt. or take out wt. to make it even.
3. C & D 2 tenths difference.
4. E & F 2 tenths difference.
5. G & H .25 hundreds diff.
6. I & J .25 diff.
7. K & L .15 diff.
8. M,N&O 3 tenths diff.
9. P/S & P/SA is the same index.
10. Q/S - Q/SA & A/FS 2 tenths diff.
11. R/S & R/SA 1 tenth diff.
12. T/S & T/SA same index
13. U/S - U/SA & B/FS 2 tenths diff.
14. V/S -V/SA- C&D/FS .45 hundreds diff. ( this is the only class with a big index gap ) suggestions ?
15. W/S & W/SA .25 hundreds diff.
16. E/FS class by itself

How i would run this would be: Run these for Class Elim's on Saturday & the 16 Winners go into the Handicap Style Elim. for Sunday. Payout's, we could use some ideas. Anyone ?????
I'm sure you could do the same for Super Stock using the index formula. Different Class, Same Index =
1 Class, ect....
I would really like some payout ideas. I'll try & do 1 today.

UCRA is the future for us Class Racers...

Sincerely
"Pistol" Pete Dutko
1374 Stock

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

I like the NCRA suggestion.

Please, NO fuel injected classes. NHRA HP factors too.

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This is great for the NHRA/IHRA stockers. What about the rest of the IHRA cars, GT, Crate motor and Pure stockers? IF, we're going off indexes, lump them in where they fit? No, I haven't done the research to see how this would work out. Or, we run as stand alone classes?

I like this scenario. Just curious as to how we'll fit with the rest of the stockers.

Robert Swartz

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

They already have thier own class index in GT, Crate motors, and the pure stockers but if you notice they run stick and auto together for the same class. There is no seperate stick and automatic class and to cut down the number of classes this might happen with the rest of the classes. Not sure yet though.

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If you think that it is OK to lump the FWD with the RWD, then lump the Crate Motor cars with the rest of the field as per their index. Let the bitcin' begin.

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TOP/STK type deal for 2 or 3 classes together first time or two all the way down in Stock and SS. Get people comfortable again with bigger classes.
SS and GT with similar consolidation. Give 50 lb break to original SS cars at same breaks to see how it works.
It will work if you can keep the excitement of the stand alone Association. ADVERTISE it locally and charge minimal spectator fees. Get the crowd hooked again. Make the money on Food, and decals.
Regardless how cheap the tickets are it will be a start...
Get the Mustangs there and the Hemis and the Challengers and consider a Nostalgia display.

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

Might go with ONE pound wt breaks instead of 1/2 lb breaks to further reduce the number of classes in both stock and super stock. Have to add a 6 and 7 lb wt break for the GT S/Sers to give the Hemi, T-Bolts, and Hi HP Corvettes some competition. The slight wt. break might work well to combine GT and traditional Super stockers????? Maybe some wt. break for the lower class automatic stockers and super stockers also. The main thing is there are way to many classes. The manufactures cannot pay for class win for all these different classes in this economy. Why do you think that a class win money has been going down and it isnt worth much even at Indy? All would still run the eliminator on Sunday anyway....not just class winners. Just thinking out loud. One question.....How many FWD cars exist today across the country anyway????

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

This would make the most sense to me. IF, the big IF, the crate cars dominate, which I highly suspect they won't , you make adjustments, add weight, move the cars up a class (or two), add HP, which many have suggested. I can guarantee one thing, someone won't be happy!


Full pound breaks, sticks and autos run together. I think this would make the racing fun. Wish I had my stocker ready.

Let's race!!! Gives me something to work towards.

Robert Swartz

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

I just had a phone call from a good friend Dave and he suggested that the upper classes stayed at 1/2 lb wt breaks down to the 11 lb class (Currently "G") due to the higher HP ratings then go with full lb breaks for the rest (12 on down). Give a wt reduction of about 50 lbs for the automatics from about "M" (14 lbs) on down. Theres all kinds of ways to reduce the number of classes and still be fair. He also said the reason the class win money is low is because of way to many classes. He also suggested a name for the association. What about the AHRA ("Alternative" Hot Rod Association) unless someone still holds the rights to the AHRA name......lol ?

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Or maybe that's it. Revive the AHRA under a new brand. That's an interesting question, if someone does still hold the rights to that name? I always thought they had the neatest decal anyway. I had an old AHRA t-shirt, wore that thing till it became nothing but a faded rag, LOL! Still have it in a paper bag upstairs somewhere.

I think that's it, BRING BACK the AHRA!!!!!!

Robert Swartz

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

Not sure if it would be an issue or not, but I am assuming these races will be held at tracks currently sanctioned by NHRA or IHRA?, and if so, are these same tracks bound in any way to not hold races put on by a competing (UCRA, AHRA, whatever this will be called ) sanctioning body?

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IMO, if you want credibility, you need to use a serious name not a slap in the face to other organizations. I would suggest that if you want to get at the other sanctioning bodies the best way would be to take their customers.

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They let the Pinks Show race at tracks that are NHRA and IHRA. Pinks is not a part of either orginization.

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Trevor, Pinks is not actually directly competing with either NHRA or IHRA, the new association would certainly be considered to be in direct competition with both.

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Good points by both of you. I wasn't around for the US Class Nationals. How was that handled? Wasn't it run at an NHRA or IHRA facility? Being a one time event, probably didn't raise too many eyebrows back then.

If you consider it from this angle. Many tracks run nothing but bracket racing. Back in my day, there used to be all kind of different "events", alcohol Funny Cars, Outlaw Pro Stock shows, bike drags. These were run as adjunct events to the regular shows. What makes this any different? Other than it's being planned as a stand alone event. I don't believe anyone thinks this is going to supplant the big organizations. If you race under either #HRA, I imagine you'll still run those events, won't you?

Am I reading this wrong. Isn't this mainly an attempt to bring together the various grass roots S/SS organizations that run combos now. Or more to the point, bringing back a form of racing to the mainstream that isn't as recognised as it should be.

You might not get one of the premier facilities. I'm sure there's a track out there that would be suitable for this endeavor. And wouldn't have to surrender their sanction to run the event(s).

After all this, I still like the AHRA name. What ever this ends up being called. I still think it has tremendous potential. If it never comes about, just hope there's still a combo race to run when I get my car together.

Robert Swartz

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Did anyone post "ACRA" (American Class Racers Association)?

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Robert Swartz:

I did forget about the GT Stock, Crate Motor Class & The Pure Stock Classes. My Mistake.

We can add them in too, no problem. But did you get the idea that I was trying to come up with ??

Just trying to lessen the classes. Run Class run offs with less classes, like Jeff Lee said.

How 'bout the entry fee, say it's $160. for arguements sake, take $100. a car & put it towards Class Elim.
Money, the other $60. goes towards the Handicap Elim. Money.
Say your running the A & B Class and 22 cars show up, take the 22 cars times $100. = $2200.
I don't know if you want to pay winner & runner up or what.??? we need help in this area.

The other $60. goes towards the "Handicap Elim". money pay out. if you had 32 total classes x $60.
that comes out to $1920.

Just trying to come up with ideas on a payout system.

What'dya think Terry

Pistol Pete
1374 Stock

Re: "WHAT IF" part 4
 

Pete,

I get your premse, regarding the lessening of the classes. I agree. I'd blend what both you and Dick Butler propose. Look at the combination of both weight breaks and indexes. Lump the various classes together using those. Go to full pound breaks, then even things out using the indexes. Like Dick Butler said, get people used to larger classes. I remember the large events in the 70's, you'd have a boatload of cars contesting class. I remember local events in the early 70's that it wasn't unusual to have run 3-4 rounds just to get into the eliminator.

It would be a little complicated but just need some homework. The guys doing the initial entry inspections would have a sheet in front of them. As the cars are teched, you'd be assigned a class based on that factoring. That way we'd keep out #HRA designation, just shoe polish your determined time. If we're allowd to dial under for the eliminator. For me that may not be a problem, early on, LOL!

Need to go earn some money today,
Robert Swartz

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Did I read in one of the early posts that the races were going to be run with a comp. style CIC? Now I read people talking about shoe polish. Which is it? If you want spectators you have to leave the shoe polish home. IMO

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The races with a CIC like comp was for the "Quick 32" in stock and S/S. The regular eliminators would be run as it is now in NHRA and IHRA.